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have the D's toppled the SVT's?

#461
Caleb Mills said:
So here's an interesting proposition... Y'all know the Darkglass M900 is out, right? Class D, right? Priced at $999, right? Well, should someone spend $999 on one of those OR $999 (used) on an Ampeg V4-b all-tube head that only weighs about half of a traditional SVT?
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Hmm. Now that's an interesting proposition. An extremely versatile amp that fits in your gig bag vs a huge, not as versatile amp, that may well be about half the weight of a traditional svt but 6 times the weight of this more versatile tiny amp.
Yep, I don't even need to scratch my head over which one of those would suit my needs best
 
#462
arai said:
Hmm. Now that's an interesting proposition. An extremely versatile amp that fits in your gig bag vs a huge, not as versatile amp, that may well be about half the weight of a traditional svt but 6 times the weight of this more versatile tiny amp.
Yep, I don't even need to scratch my head over which one of those would suit my needs best
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Right? that's exactly what I was thinking. It's like, tubes would be great, but I can fit the M900 in my suit case, laptop case, etc. and have great tone with more features and versatility.
 
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#463
Caleb Mills said:
Right? that's exactly what I was thinking. It's like, tubes would be great, but I can fit the M900 in my suit case, laptop case, etc. and have great tone with more features and versatility.
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Sorry...I don't get where the M900 is any more versatile than the V4B. Louder? Probably, yeah. More versatile? Not seeing it.
 
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#465
JimmyM said:
Sorry...I don't get where the M900 is any more versatile than the V4B. Louder? Probably, yeah. More versatile? Not seeing it.
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I'd suggest taking your head out of the sand and having a look at both amps, then maybe you'd see it ;)
Both have high and low eq controls. The Ampeg has mid control with a 3 position mid shift but the dark glass has 2 mid controls, both with 3 band mid shifts.. I'd call that more versatile.
Then there is the 2 channels that the dark glass has that is foot switchable and there is a blend knob to blend them. That's an awesome couple of features that in no way the ampeg can reproduce.
Are your eyes open now?
 
#466
Caleb Mills said:
How's that?
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Well I see that it has two mid controls and a drive section, but I don't know if that actually translates to actual versatility. Plus I have always found plenty of versatility in a V4B and I think this business about lack of versatility comes from people who never played one. That said, I got nothing against Darkglass and it's probably a good little amp.
 
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#467
arai said:
I'd suggest taking your head out of the sand and having a look at both amps, then maybe you'd see it ;)
Both have high and low eq controls. The Ampeg has mid control with a 3 position mid shift but the dark glass has 2 mid controls, both with 3 band mid shifts.. I'd call that more versatile.
Then there is the 2 channels that the dark glass has that is foot switchable and there is a blend knob to blend them. That's an awesome couple of features that in no way the ampeg can reproduce.
Are your eyes open now?
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Reported
 
#468
JimmyM said:
Well I see that it has two mid controls and a drive section, but I don't know if that actually translates to actual versatility. Plus I have always found plenty of versatility in a V4B and I think this business about lack of versatility comes from people who never played one. That said, I got nothing against Darkglass and it's probably a good little amp.
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Yeah, that's true. There's a lot be said how intelligently you can use the controls given to you. More knobs doesn't always mean more versatility if you don't know how to use them, am I right? I like hearing both sides, which is why I asked the question. For me, I see a lot of great things in the M900, but the V4-B for the same price (although it would have to be used, which really isn't a huge deal) is so tempting because, c'mon, it's all-tube magic. And who doesn't like all-tube magic?
 
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#471
jdubbass38 said:
I have not played every tube or class D amp out there...that said I have yet to play a non tube amp that sounds better than an all tube amp. Yes, some sound really good but do not have the heft behind every note.
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The intangibles of a tube amp are usually what makes them so attractive. How many different adjectives have we tried to use to explain it? Tubes just have that X factor. Or do they? Maybe it's just our imagination. maybe it's just a placebo effect. Either way, the portability, light weight, and built in drive of the DG M900 sure do make it hard to resist.
 
#472
Caleb Mills said:
The intangibles of a tube amp are usually what makes them so attractive. How many different adjectives have we tried to use to explain it? Tubes just have that X factor. Or do they? Maybe it's just our imagination. maybe it's just a placebo effect. Either way, the portability, light weight, and built in drive of the DG M900 sure do make it hard to resist.
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The X factor is certainly very real. Sure, you can make great music on anything, but there's a reason why tube amp makes haven't all discontinued their tube amps, and it's not because an amp 1/20th the size can duplicate that sound in every way. That said, I've got micros too, and they certainly have their place.
 
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#473
JimmyM said:
The X factor is certainly very real. Sure, you can make great music on anything, but there's a reason why tube amp makes haven't all discontinued their tube amps, and it's not because an amp 1/20th the size can duplicate that sound in every way. That said, I've got micros too, and they certainly have their place.
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I think that is really the main thing. Everyone gets so loyal to one or the other. There's a time and place for everything. There are a lot of reasons why D's work for people, but I see no situition in which someone would take their little class D over an all-tube head if offered.
 
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#474
Caleb Mills said:
I think that is really the main thing. Everyone gets so loyal to one or the other. There's a time and place for everything. There are a lot of reasons why D's work for people, but I see no situition in which someone would take their little class D over an all-tube head if offered.
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Well, is there a time and place for everything or no situation to opt for a "d" over tubes? I can think of a few situations where I would.
 
#475
Gluvhand said:
Well, is there a time and place for everything or no situation to opt for a "d" over tubes? I can think of a few situations where I would.
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Me too, but it usually involves stairs or outdoor gigs where rain is predicted. Fortunately, my day-to-day tube amp is 20 lbs. so stairs aren't as much of an issue as they used to be.
 
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#478
I was bouncing around with a lot of amps for a few years, but played the last 35 or so shows with my SVT Heritage / 810E. Everything from smallish clubs to larger outdoor venues....and all I can say is "weight-schmeit" :) The more I play this amp, the more I realize why it's been the bedrock of backline for so many years. I've got a good little cart (or a helping hand) for the head, and the cab flops around as easily as anything else I have. I carry a Puma 900 in my gig-bag for emergencies, and at this stage in the game I don't see any reason to change the setup. Class D does some wonderful things, but there is something magical about this rig that makes me smile every night.
 
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#479
Caleb Mills said:
I think that is really the main thing. Everyone gets so loyal to one or the other. There's a time and place for everything. There are a lot of reasons why D's work for people, but I see no situition in which someone would take their little class D over an all-tube head if offered.
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I gigged with a re-issue V4B for a while. On a couple multi-band bills I had guys in other bands using my amp be unhappy that there wasn't an effects loop for their giantass pedal boards. I thought that amp into the 212AV cab was nothing short of magic but those guys woulda preferred anything with an effects loop. Priorities differ.

If we're talking a good SVT I'd definitely take that over any class D I know of. On the other hand I have a late 70's 200w Fender tube head I like ok but in terms of ease of quickly getting a great sound I like the class D Mesa D-800 a whole lot more.
 
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