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Double Bass Headway EDB1 preamp

#201
Ric Vice said:
Uncle Toad,
This is also true of the Walter Woods. If you insert the Headway into the return or either of my amps the results are better using the Headway as the actual pre amp. Maybe it's the two class A stages in the Headway, or maybe the Headway just has too much juice when you run it into the input on certain amplifiers.

Ric
Click to expand...
Clarification, the first set I was not using the headway at all, just the focus. The second set was using the headway into the fx return bypassing the focus preamp.

I don't see the point in using a preamp into a preamp these days. To many gain stages for no reason other than getting the line level up enough for the power amp to do it's job. In the case of the focus it's gain stage just before the power amp after the fx return is hot enough to run the amp at full volume even without super hot preamp levels.

I discovered this while experimenting with my EB's. I'd never been thrilled with the EB tone through the Focus preamp so I started using a Sadowsky onboard preamp running straight into the fx return of the focus. I ended up with a monster sound from my slabs bypassing the front end of the Focus entirely. Not all amps fx returns do that quite as well.

Doing the same with the headway on the other channel has given me really great sounds for doubling, far better than the Focus preamps. It still makes for a very portable package. The Focus is quickly becoming a small and light high power poweramp for me.

I kinda wish I hadn't sold the WW so I could have experimented with this on it as well but then again it's a stupidly expensive piece of gear to use as strictly a power amp.
 
#202
On a side note, have exactly the same experience with my Sadowsky into the fx return of my Focus amp.
I also like the sound of my Full Circle pickup better through a Fishman platinum pre into fx return than through Focus' own preamp.

I know, a bit off topic...
 
#203
I'll have to try this w/ my Headway and the Focus fx return. Haven't done that w/ this pre yet.

However, eventhough it may be redundant to plug a pre into the pre of the Focus when I do this w/ the LR Baggs Paracoustic DI it seems to sound fatter than the Baggs into the fx return.... w/ my DB's anyway.

Bri
 
#204
bribass said:
I'll have to try this w/ my Headway and the Focus fx return. Haven't done that w/ this pre yet.

However, eventhough it may be redundant to plug a pre into the pre of the Focus when I do this w/ the LR Baggs Paracoustic DI it seems to sound fatter than the Baggs into the fx return.... w/ my DB's anyway.

Bri
Click to expand...
I could see that. I think that at least today I'm not as in love with the front end of the Focus as I have been and I don't have much bread so I'm playing with stuff I already have to find something new.
 
#205
Uncletoad said:
I don't see the point in using a preamp into a preamp these days. To many gain stages for no reason other than getting the line level up enough for the power amp to do it's job. In the case of the focus it's gain stage just before the power amp after the fx return is hot enough to run the amp at full volume even without super hot preamp levels.
Click to expand...

Agreed 100%,
In my experience he Headway just didn't work into the front end of either of the Walter Woods Amps as well as it does into the effects return. It just ends up overdriving the signal and being stupidly confusing ( I'm easily confused by over three EQ controls anyway, the Headway kind of being the exception)


Uncletoad said:
Doing the same with the headway on the other channel has given me really great sounds for doubling, far better than the Focus preamps. It still makes for a very portable package. The Focus is quickly becoming a small and light high power poweramp for me.
Click to expand...

Which makes me wonder what's missing in the front end of a Focus, cause it's got plenty of power and the effects return is actually part of the pre amp.

Uncletoad said:
I kinda wish I hadn't sold the WW so I could have experimented with this on it as well but then again it's a stupidly expensive piece of gear to use as strictly a power amp.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I thought about that stupidly expensive may be a understatement. A Focus SA would be ideal but I gave up on getting one of those a long time ago and the Ehrlund and it's tiny little pre amp seems to match up with everything I own.

Ric
 
#206
flatback said:
as someone like a lot of you cats who spent a lot of time experimenting with different pre/amp combos, I have settled happily for well over a year with the Headway into the FX return of the Focus. I wish I had a mini focus with no preamp in it but all the power. But the headway has never let me down.For the last six months I've been blending with a mic and the concept of eqing post blend is really the way to go, simple no fuss and the kind of control that has me not thinking about knobs but music. Big fat sound but like last night too fat so a 2 click reduction in bass eq puts it right in the pocket.
It kind of bums me out though because I don't have that next great thing drive anymore and now I have to practice.
Click to expand...

The DPA straight into the Focus blended w/ the pu in ch. 2 doesn't suck either and this way the DPA gets its' full 48v of phantom power from the Focus. I'll have to A/B both this method vs. the Headway blending both signals into the FX of 1 channel, but blending w/ the 2 channels of the Focus allows me to give the FOH the DPA signal alone via the send jack of the mic channel into a DI to the board if I choose. In some rooms and small theaters I rather not have the piezo blended into the FOH signal. If the venue has a good board w/phantom power I've also tried giving the sound guy the DPA signal directly bypassing my amp altogether. Then I just use the amp w/ the piezo pu alone as a stage monitor and the natural blend of that w/ the mic in the FOH (in a good sounding room) will be really the best sound. Much less risk of feedback from my amp this way as well.

Sometimes to my ears it seems the Headway puts in a bit of artificial 'sheen' into a piezo sound. In some rooms this is useful in giving the sound presence, but other times I'm not so sure I like it. Maybe this is better thru the FX section?

Anyone experience this?

Bri
 
#207
bribass said:
Sometimes to my ears it seems the Headway puts in a bit of artificial 'sheen' into a piezo sound. In some rooms this is useful in giving the sound presence, but other times I'm not so sure I like it. Maybe this is better thru the FX section?

Anyone experience this?
Click to expand...

Yes. It's useful in boomy rooms and über loud rooms with lots of crowd noise, but in normal situations I prefer the regular PJB pre with the fdeck HP filter in the FX loop.

Man, that was a geek abbreviation frenzy. LOLAMG!!!!!
 
#209
Chris Fitzgerald said:
Yes. It's useful in boomy rooms and über loud rooms with lots of crowd noise, but in normal situations I prefer the regular PJB pre with the fdeck HP filter in the FX loop.

Man, that was a geek abbreviation frenzy. LOLAMG!!!!!
Click to expand...


Chris,
That's kinda cool. Does this mean that the FDeck loads the FX loop at 10 megohm thus overriding the 4.6 megohm of the PJB or does putting it in the FX void the 10 meghom setup of the FDeck.

Ric
 
#210
Ric Vice said:
Chris,
That's kinda cool. Does this mean that the FDeck loads the FX loop at 10 megohm thus overriding the 4.6 megohm of the PJB or does putting it in the FX void the 10 meghom setup of the FDeck.

Ric
Click to expand...

I'm not enough of a brainiac to know the answer to that. What I can tell you is that when I put the fdeck in front of the signal chain, it has that super high-impedance "rubbery" sound that I don't care for, and when i put it in the FX loop, it sounds like the PJB amp usually does, only with an adjustable HP filter. My guess would be that I'm hearing the 4.whatever megohm load of the PJB, but we'd have to wait for one of the techies to confirm or deny this. :)

Either way, one of the best drummers I play with regularly (Mike Hyman) always prefers the sound of the PJB pre to anything else I experiment with, and is very adamant about it. He once remarked that "there must be a little witch doctor in that amp, or a voodoo doll, or some **** like that". It's cool to have a drummer pay that much attention to the bass sound - he's got a great ear for it, and I almost always agree with his conclusions.
 
#211
hi Yall
My thoughts regarding the Headway EDB-1 preamp

This is a well constructed unit. I really like some of the thoughtful features that make this useful for so many applications. You can screw it onto a mic stand! How thoughtful is that! This thing is designed for acoustic instruments and the interface (pickups and microphones) used to amplify them. Keep that in mind when you try to plug your electric guitar or bass into the box. It is decent but not ideal for electric instruments.

With this device you can blend 2 signals and EQ them perfectly. You can reduce feedback with notch filter and Phase reverse. If your microphone or other gear requires phantom power, it can give it. It’s ideal for pickup & microphone signals from one instrument, like a string bass or an acoustic guitar. It can be used, though is less ideal, as a 2 channel mixer-both channels are routed to the same EQ section.

If I could add anything to the box, I would add 2 switches- One switch for channel selection (1,2, both), and one to direct either channel (or both) to the EQ section of the preamp. That would make it a viable 2 channel preamp/mixer for doubling.

Thoughtful features:

Adjustable input impedance
Notch filter-Q & bandwidth
Battery & power supply (both included)
Mic & line inputs/outputs
On/off switch,
Mute switch
Phase reverse, Phantom power, Low roll off switches
Mono/stereo in & out



Pros

Metal construction, low profile knobs
Mic stand compatible
Outstanding tone shaping
It has all the features

Cons

Ch1 & 2 same preamp, no bypass-
No foot switching- hands only
Not great for electric guitar/bass



All that said, we still need to know, “how does it sound?” I say, “It sounds good.”

It’s clean, perhaps slightly colored to warm up the tone. It allows enormous tonal control, including shimmery high end that a lot of acoustic preamps skip. It offers plenty of bottom, too. The mid, notch, and presence controls allow for very precise adjustments. If you are looking for a blender or tone shaper, you’ll be happy to have this. That goes for bassists, fiddlers, guitarists, banjoists, and pretty much all the acoustic string instrumentalists out there.
 
#212
Chris Fitzgerald said:
I'm not enough of a brainiac to know the answer to that. What I can tell you is that when I put the fdeck in front of the signal chain, it has that super high-impedance "rubbery" sound that I don't care for, and when i put it in the FX loop, it sounds like the PJB amp usually does, only with an adjustable HP filter. My guess would be that I'm hearing the 4.whatever megohm load of the PJB, but we'd have to wait for one of the techies to confirm or deny this. :) .
Click to expand...

Chris,
I had a little consult with one of our Grand High TB Techie. When you run the HPF/Preamp into the FX loop it doesn't function as a 10 meg buffer. So what you have is the 4.6 meg ohm load of the PJB and the High Pass Filter of the FDeck. Not sure whether the phase shift works either.

Ric
 
#214
Chris Fitzgerald said:
Ric - good to know. :) The phase shift does still work (my ears tell me this), but I almost never use it.
Click to expand...

Good to know that the phase reverse still works. I guess this would be true of any input buffering device thingy, so the Headway, PZ PRE, Fishman Pro Plat, and on, and on, ect. ect. would have no effect on the input impedance when used through the effects loop.

Ric
 
#215
This thread was scary and took me several days to understand, but well worth it to get caught up.

I went ahead and ordered the Headway to use with a DPA4099 I have on order and will be experimenting from here with my Clarus head. Good to know about the FX send option.

Though this thread also made me realize I want to try the PJB SUper Flightcase, and that I have an Fdeck preamp around here somewhere that I never really got around to trying. (Seriously can't find it!)
 
#218
Sergio Barrozo said:
When I connect the EDB-1 balanced output to a mixer, while the unit is off I hear a hum in the PA output, which only disappears when I turn on the EDB-1.
Is that normal?
Click to expand...

Hi
Hit the ground lift switch, the hum will go away. The xlr also makes a strange noise when the Headway is powered by the power supplier with the ground lift down.
Regards
 
#219
EDB1 just arrived. Had a few minutes and tried it into the fx return of the Focus III. Really filled in the sound, fattened up the mids. Very responsive, those little dials actually do do something to it. Wow, this is the best preamp I've ever heard!

Btw, where do you guys who've used the EDB1 with a Focus put your Focus Master volume? Does it vary from room to room? I usually left it at noon with just a mic or pickup, but that Master knob operates very differently with the Headway, it cut the noise almost completely out if I reduce it. Any thoughts?
 
#220
William Hoffman said:
EDB1 just arrived. Had a few minutes and tried it into the fx return of the Focus III. Really filled in the sound, fattened up the mids. Very responsive, those little dials actually do do something to it. Wow, this is the best preamp I've ever heard!

Btw, where do you guys who've used the EDB1 with a Focus put your Focus Master volume? Does it vary from room to room? I usually left it at noon with just a mic or pickup, but that Master knob operates very differently with the Headway, it cut the noise almost completely out if I reduce it. Any thoughts?
Click to expand...
It took some fiddling but I do my gain staging like this:

(in clock positions)Headway input gain from the full circle around 9, output gain around noon or slightly less, Focus fx loop return either all the way out or back at 3, then master volume lives somewhere between 9 and noon depending on how loud I get.

The realist takes the input gain on the Headway up to around 11.

Seems like the headway front end is pretty hot so higher input gains lead to distortion down the line later. I tend to bring up the input gain on the Headway if I'm using any cutting with the headway EQ and down if I'm boosting.
 

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