Wow thank you so much for the information. I thought pick up height only mattered in the amount of volume it put out. So how would you compensate for the volume after adjusting for the tone?
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Help me get a thick Jazz bass tone!
- Thread starter Ampeg SVT
- Start date
Wow thank you so much for the information. I thought pick up height only mattered in the amount of volume it put out. So how would you compensate for the volume after adjusting for the tone?
You need to get those strings up off the fretboard.
Low action nearly always means poor tone, though if its the MIM Jazz your using then its gonna sound bright and thin anyhow.
Still dont forget the jazz sound is always gonna sound slightly scooped in the mids and full and soft in the lows. If its a punchy type of cut you really need then a P is your only hope...
Low action nearly always means poor tone, though if its the MIM Jazz your using then its gonna sound bright and thin anyhow.
Still dont forget the jazz sound is always gonna sound slightly scooped in the mids and full and soft in the lows. If its a punchy type of cut you really need then a P is your only hope...
For what it's worth. Setting pickup height with the last fret fretted should only be used to establish a baseline of minimum clearance - assuming you don't want your strings to smash against the pickups when you dig in and you're fretting high on the neck.
That aside, you can have thick tone with low action - I have very low action on my jazz bass...
It does seem strange to me that this is requiring so much experimentation though - I get a very warm, thick tone out of my jazz bass when I'm playing it and I still attribute it to the Rotosound TruBass88 strings... but mind you I have a US '62 reissue, where the pickups can't really be raised without sticking something underneath the grounding strips (the pickups aren't a unit, the shell is just screwed down over the floating coils/bobbin package).
Likewise, I have a Korean MTD with Nordstrand pickups in it and VERY low action (it's a fretless) and the tone on that too is very warm and meaty...
So unless you're mostly clacking against the fretboard (because of an incomplete neck setup) you should be able to get this elusive "thick" jazz bass tone you're after.
That aside, you can have thick tone with low action - I have very low action on my jazz bass...
It does seem strange to me that this is requiring so much experimentation though - I get a very warm, thick tone out of my jazz bass when I'm playing it and I still attribute it to the Rotosound TruBass88 strings... but mind you I have a US '62 reissue, where the pickups can't really be raised without sticking something underneath the grounding strips (the pickups aren't a unit, the shell is just screwed down over the floating coils/bobbin package).
Likewise, I have a Korean MTD with Nordstrand pickups in it and VERY low action (it's a fretless) and the tone on that too is very warm and meaty...
So unless you're mostly clacking against the fretboard (because of an incomplete neck setup) you should be able to get this elusive "thick" jazz bass tone you're after.
frankie5string, I also have a US 62 RI jazz, and a Sadowsky into which I just put Nordstrand NJ5's. They are both very thick sounding. The Nordstrands in particular are thick sounding even with the bridge pickup soloed.
Previously the Sadowsky had the Sadowsky hum canceling pickups, and that was much thinner sounding. It had more sub-bass, but IMHO that's not where thickness comes from. A thicker sound comes from a fat complex midrange. I heartily recommend the Nordstrand NJ pickups...
Previously the Sadowsky had the Sadowsky hum canceling pickups, and that was much thinner sounding. It had more sub-bass, but IMHO that's not where thickness comes from. A thicker sound comes from a fat complex midrange. I heartily recommend the Nordstrand NJ pickups...
Frankie,
I had to remount my Geddy pickups with additional foam to get them to an acceptable height for the tone I was looking for.
Before that I was never happy with the overall tone of this bass. It was good, but I knew it could be better. With the pickups a bit closer the low mids are now part of the overall tone, and I'm much happier with the way the bass sounds.
I had to remount my Geddy pickups with additional foam to get them to an acceptable height for the tone I was looking for.
Before that I was never happy with the overall tone of this bass. It was good, but I knew it could be better. With the pickups a bit closer the low mids are now part of the overall tone, and I'm much happier with the way the bass sounds.
Yes, you're right, it's a MIM Jazz and I don't know if this makes any difference but it's a special run that I got at GC, and was supposedly only available there and at Musician's Freind. I'm only saying that because I don't know if they are your average MIM pickups or not. The A and D string pole pieces are raised. I've heard folks refer to these pickups as 'hotter than average' but I have nothing to compare them to so I don't know.
Anyway, thanks for your response. I'll work with them and see what I can come up with. I'm hoping I can find the sound I'm looking for without having to resort to new pickups.
Anyway, thanks for your response. I'll work with them and see what I can come up with. I'm hoping I can find the sound I'm looking for without having to resort to new pickups.
mrhardy, are you saying both the treble side and the bass side of the pickups will be the same height?
Pretty much, yes. Fender specs the treble side to be closer, but I find that I like to run them flat. The treble gets to be a little shrill otherwise.
mrhardy, I'm about to get started but I just want to make sure, you're saying you have your MIM Jazz neck pickup at 12/64 from top of pole to bottom of string, and your bridge pickup at 4/64, that's without being fretted at the last fret?
I haven't read through the whole thread, so I'll apologize in advance if this has been said, but def experiment with pup height, especially on the neck pup. Lower it just a bit and that should bring more bottom, and you can always balance the mids/highs by playing with the vol on the bridge pup. Then you can compensate for any volume loss by raising your gain just a bit on your head.
run it through a Behringer BDDI or Sansamp, neck pickup max, bridge cut by just a hair....treble cut (or not...depends on rig)....problem solved. I do this with my 4-string (fender jazz copy) through a GK1001RBII and a Goliath Senior. HUGE, FAT tone yet still very articulate. Those two pedals do a weird tube amp compression scoop type thing that really beefs up a jazz while keeping it's articulation.
Hey BazzAnderson, been doing a little tweaking and it's a definite improvement but I was wondering, if I got one of those pedals, would I run into the front of my amp with it or into the effects return? And, if into the front, would I go into the passive or the active input?
I run my BDDI through my effects loop. I think there are slight tonal differences between the two but I've never tried it in front of my input (afraid of overdriving my preamp section). I've used the sansamp rackmount this way as well with good results. I know many people don't like Behringer but man....for $30.00 bucks?!.....it really can't be beat and it REALLY made an improvement in my jazz's tone. Originally I had it wired in series for a thicker tone but it wasn't working for me. The factory standard settings suggestions (behringer manual) never worked for me...I just tweaked it until I found what I liked.
I disagree about the poor tone with low action, but hey apple's and orange's. I like my strings on the other side of the neck=)......anyways I just got the fender varitone hooked up on my bass last night, and can I say
I love it. IT's still passive, and tons of different tones. I need to mess with it more tonight but I found all kinds of bottom out of that thing, and though I usually never use neck pick-up by itself I found some killer tones like that too......I'm sold.....I'm trying to find a Varitone switch for my marleaux......brianNO, to your first question. If I fret the string at the last fret and set the pickup at 1/8" I end up with 12/64" with the string in the open position.
Your reading two different responses and combining them.
Your pickups are the same as mine with the raised "A,D" string poles. Those are the standard MIM pickups.
My current spec is pretty much as you listed yours. I'm right at 10/64" neck 7/64" bridge. This is with open strings.
Gotcha. I'm in the process of putting Fender pure nickles back on. That should help, too. Thanks.
Not true, I've played with low action most of my life and I've been playing bass for a good while. As far as low action is concerned, my action is low enough to get a little fret buzz but not to the point where it chokes your sound. If an individual has low action then they have to know how to use it to benefit them. Other wise their bass playing will be terrible. You have to use a light touch when playing with low action. I can pull a variety of sounds out of my bass with low action depending on how I use my hands, and also where my hands are located. Heck, I can make my jazz bass sound like an upright bass even with steel strings on it. Economy of motion is much easier with low action, and its easier to play speedy passages in addition to having low fatigue. But it doesn't mean you'll get a bad sound.
The sound of your bass is in your hands, as well as eq'ing, type of woods used, pickup position and all. Believe it or not, you can get a good meaty sound is your hands are positioned right. I can thump you out of your house even with the treble notched up. Also it depends on what amp your using, and it also depends on what cabinet you have too. The two most bass heavy amps I've ever heard are Eden's and Mesa Boogies.
All right, many things said here are true, many not so much.
1. Construction and woods do affect tone, but you can get a bassy sounding J even from the cheapest Squier on the market.
2. The setup plays a part here, but not so big. If the pickup height is not correct, the worst thing you may get are some dead spots across the neck or a sloppy E string (up to the 5-7 fret ONLY) But bass is still there.
3. A bass is a bass. It'll sound like a bass even thru a 15w practice amp. So this might not be the problem.
4. Saying that "a Jazz is a Jazz" or "get a P" are not too kind words for them basses. Both can sound muddy or thin. EQ might help a little.
5. Electronics are what you go for to fix this problem. And I don't mean messing with active things, passive will do it. Adding a set of heavy gauge strings (.50 or .55 up) will help too, but there's no need to change the pickups. Believe me, if you WIRE THE PICKUPS IN SERIES you'll get what you want. A Jazz wired in series delivers a FAT tone close close close, real close to Precision. Both pickups will be always on and only 1 vol pot will work, but they're gonna act like a humbucker (this will only happen if the pickups are rw/rp with opposite magnetic directions -- note that this thinness may be a polarity problem: take to the luthier and ask him to check if both PUs polarities are correct; this problem will cause a SEVERE THINNESS on Jazzes). You can add a DPDT On-On switch and make it switchable from series to paralell and there are some tutorials on doing it here in talkbass. You can DIY if you can solder.
Don't waste money if you don't want to... I mean, if you really want to get an active preamp and new pickups is up to you, but try the series wiring first, if you don't like there's always the new pickup option!
1. Construction and woods do affect tone, but you can get a bassy sounding J even from the cheapest Squier on the market.
2. The setup plays a part here, but not so big. If the pickup height is not correct, the worst thing you may get are some dead spots across the neck or a sloppy E string (up to the 5-7 fret ONLY) But bass is still there.
3. A bass is a bass. It'll sound like a bass even thru a 15w practice amp. So this might not be the problem.
4. Saying that "a Jazz is a Jazz" or "get a P" are not too kind words for them basses. Both can sound muddy or thin. EQ might help a little.
5. Electronics are what you go for to fix this problem. And I don't mean messing with active things, passive will do it. Adding a set of heavy gauge strings (.50 or .55 up) will help too, but there's no need to change the pickups. Believe me, if you WIRE THE PICKUPS IN SERIES you'll get what you want. A Jazz wired in series delivers a FAT tone close close close, real close to Precision. Both pickups will be always on and only 1 vol pot will work, but they're gonna act like a humbucker (this will only happen if the pickups are rw/rp with opposite magnetic directions -- note that this thinness may be a polarity problem: take to the luthier and ask him to check if both PUs polarities are correct; this problem will cause a SEVERE THINNESS on Jazzes). You can add a DPDT On-On switch and make it switchable from series to paralell and there are some tutorials on doing it here in talkbass. You can DIY if you can solder.
Don't waste money if you don't want to... I mean, if you really want to get an active preamp and new pickups is up to you, but try the series wiring first, if you don't like there's always the new pickup option!
I have several boutique basses that are sooo hot that I can't use the active electronics. Passive pickups are so mundane, that I don't want to use the bass through my DEMETER VTBP-201. Simple solution: enter my SANSAMP BASS DRIVER DI stompbox. I can get any thickness I want all the way to muddy if I want it. You can pick up one for 100 to 150 used without doing any surgery. HERE ME NOW, OR HERE ME LATER!! i TOLD YOU SO!
