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Help with finding the perfect DI/preamp

kewp

kewp

Guest
Mar 12, 2015
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#1
I'm currently playing with a very LOUD band. I play a Rickenbacker and am using a svt pro3 through a svt 4x10HLF with a DBX 160a compressor. Even at rehearsal, my gain and volume knobs are at 3/4 or more and the sound is garbage. I have everything completely dialed in for when I'm playing with a normal volume band so I know my gear can sound great.

I've decided to look for a DI/Preamp. I would prefer a rack unit if possible. So far, I've looked at the following from Sansamp: RBI, RPM, and VT Bass. I'm honestly not sure what the difference between the RBI and RPM are. I've also been researching Ampeg SCR-DI.

I like a clean sound and have little to no use for distortion or extreme overdrive. I want something that will will help boost my volume and give me some extra tone control.

Any suggestions that can help point me in the right direction?

Here is my idea of the perfect tone I'm chasing. If I could just keep the gain and volume down, I'm nearly there....

 
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#3
Your rig is a limiting factor. The III Pro isn't a real loud amp. It would be plenty loud for me mind you but if you're a doom/metal guy, probably not... Not sure about the HLF cab. Just adding a preamp to the mix is potentially going to make matter worse in terms of clarity.

If you really need to go there then you need power and probably speaker area... IMO a better approach would be for your band to figure out how to get the sound at a lower stage / rehearsal volume and let the FOH do the heavy lifting. It will sound far better...
 
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#4

kewp said:
I want something that will help boost my volume and give me some extra tone control.
Click to expand...
You seem to you realize that you need an increase in overall volume, but I’m afraid your approach is backwards. So you get a new pre amp. What are you going to dump it to, the back-panel Power Amp In jack of your SVT-3? What is that going to get you? You’re still dealing with the same cabinet and the same 450 watts. A new pre amp, even if it has a hotter output signal, isn’t going to wring more power out of an amplifier.

It’s basic physics: The only way to increase your volume is an increase in amplifier power, or different (or more) speakers. Your options are:

Increase amplifier power. However, when you’re talking high levels, amplifier power gets chewed up pretty fast. For instance, doubling your current amplifier, from 450 to 900 watts, will by most accounts get you only a 2-3 dB increase in SPL. A substantial increase of 4-6 dB would require something on the order of an increase from 450 to 1800 watts, assuming no change in speaker cabinet.

Increase amplifier power and number of speakers. A more efficient variable of the above. Doubling amplifier power via the use of a second amp, along with a second matching speaker cabinet should, IIR, net a significant 6 dB increase in SPL.

Get a more efficient speaker. Kind of a back-door approach to the first option. Your current Ampeg cabinet has an efficiency rating (given as “Sensitivity” in their specs) of 98 dB. Without getting into the specifics of what that means, if you can find a bass cabinet with an efficiency or sensitivity rating of say, 105 dB, it would get you an additional 7 dB from the same amplifier you have now. IOW, it would have the net effect of increasing amplifier power from 450 to over 1800 watts.

As you can see, there is no cheap way to do this – aside from just living with what you have now, or getting everyone else in the band to turn down.

Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt


Administrator, Pedulla Club #45
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#9
s0c9 said:
if you are using an SVT then I would suggest you try out the Ampeg SCR (Invalid Link Removed
Click to expand...
I misunderstood the OP...
I was under the impression the DI was to REPLACE current rig and go direct to PA.. not front the current rig!!
Basically - as others have stated - you don't have enough rig for the gig!
2 - unpopular choices:
1. get a bigger rig!!!
2. get the band to turn down so your current rig works.

PS: Hope you are using ear plugs!!
 
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#10
Lighter louder option - go to something in a more modern design - in. my case it was a fEarful (yes, I know that old drill... ) but light and loud they are...make good use of the watts they get and are reasonably neutral so you can dial the character in from your amp and bass... IMO you still need more power on tap. The III Pro is a very pretty sounding amp, it just doesn't bring a lot of horsepower to the plate.
 
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#12
I would start with the cab. If you want really loud, get a more efficient 410 cab, which has more mids.
If this is not enough...
Next step: you need more power, as others have stated, your amp right now is not the loudest.
 
#13
What cab would you suggest? Size and weight is an issue for me.

I was looking at the Ampeg Neo 4x10. It's 850 watts and seems nice and light. Also considered the 800 watt portaflex. I used to have the 500 watt model and loved it. Traded it in for the SVT after being yelled at by sound guys who said the portoflex was not standard.
 
#14
kewp said:
What cab would you suggest? Size and weight is an issue for me.

I was looking at the Ampeg Neo 4x10. It's 850 watts and seems nice and light. Also considered the 800 watt portaflex. I used to have the 500 watt model and loved it. Traded it in for the SVT after being yelled at by sound guys who said the portoflex was not standard.
Click to expand...

I would like to hear more about these sound guys that yelled at you for having a non-standard cabinet. That's frankly one of the most ignorant thing I've ever heard a soundguy say, if that's indeed the case.
 
#15
He was upset about the head being a Portaflex and not a "standard" head. Not sure why it mattered because I was being DI'd. The same guy ripped my drummers bass drum while miking it. Was at the Pomona Fair Grounds for the Rob Zombie Halloween Fest.
 
#16
This is probably not what you'd like to hear, but get the others to turn down, especially at the rehearsals.
At least at rehearsals, the SVT3 and the 4x10 cab should be fairly enough. For a few months, I used the same combo in a friends rehearsal room with a metalcore band. Shure, rooms and dynamics change, but unless you rehearse in a stadium like room...
In the band I actually play in, we had a similar problem unless the drummer finally understood that hitting a little more gently will improve our sound drastically :)

Oh, but I almost forgot: since you initially asked I can recommend the Warwick Hellborg pre. Not very cheap but very clean, dead quiet, no distortion. But I doubt it will resolve your problem.
Good luck still with your quest.
 
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#18
I love Metal but I've never been to a Metal concert because I'm old and it seems to me that bands play loud because that's what you do when you play Metal?. If you're at rehearsal using a svt pro3 through a svt 4x10HLF at 3/4 volume and that's not cutting it then your band mates aren't doing you any favors there needs to be a discussion before you lay out anymore money because I don't understand why the bass player seems to be the person who has to keep upgrading gear to keep up with guitarists who have no idea what a volume knob is.
 
#20
kewp said:
He was upset about the head being a Portaflex and not a "standard" head. Not sure why it mattered because I was being DI'd. The same guy ripped my drummers bass drum while miking it. Was at the Pomona Fair Grounds for the Rob Zombie Halloween Fest.
Click to expand...

Okay, well, I still say you had an idiot for a sound guy (I've been one in a former life). If he's taking a DI signal, or even the line out of the amp (hopefully pre EQ), he shouldn't care what your amp is, or at least have the professional courtesy to keep his opinions to himself.

His comment about the drummers kick drum furthers my opinion of him.
 

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