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How To Fire a Band Member

As a TB reg and someone that has routinely recommended firing X band member, often for transgressions no greater than bad hair, I'm ashamed to admit I don't actually know how to go about firing anyone.

I'm struggling with the idea of just how to fire the drummer in an originals band I play in. It gets more tricky because he was in the band before me and enthusiastically voted for me after they had auditions. That meant a lot to the BL/vocalist and he certainly helped me get on board. It was a very sweet deal too. I got networked with this original BL's mom, and get quite a lot of jazz work with her.

So I feel I owe a great deal to our drummer for helping me get the opportunity, but the fact is, he's holding the sound back musically. He's a self admitted cover band specialist, mostly 70's to 90's era. He's great at playing loud bar rock and that's about it. My blunt and clinical assessment is that he's basically a living drum machine. You set him off on a beat or groove and that's what the beat will be to the end of the song, no dynamic changes, no variation or new textures. He doesn't even have a workable Latin anything. I ask him to play a samba or bossa with me and he just stares back blankly.

So Friday night, we play our first show without the drummer because he's out of town on business. And it was the first time I believe we created something musical. Was just me on string bass, her and guitar harmony vocals man, a trio. When she got big and loud, so did we. When she took it intimate and soft, so did we. There was actual communication between musicians on stage and the crowd raved about it. I gushed hearing how much they loved the more intimate sound particularly my bass work. Everyone loves the double bass anyway, so that helped of course, but I want more of that. She got requests for her to do more of these trio things and is gushing about the feedback so I thought this was a good time to voice my concerns about the drummer.

Ultimately I'd be doing her and the music a disservice if I didn't raise my drummer concerns right?

Thank you for your indulgence.
 
How long have you been playing together? The longer it's been, the more consideration is appropriate. For instance, it may be worth going the deadline route - explain the issues to him (dynamics, flexibility of style), and give him time to make changes before he's out (or to decide he doesn't want to). If not, I would still explain it to him as sympathetically as possible; you like him, you're really glad to have had the chance to play with him, but you just don't think he's the right match for the musical style you're aiming for and he'd do better in a straightforward rock band. Do it in person if you've known each other a while or are friends.
 
The first question I would ask myself is how instrumental is this person in securing paying gigs? For me, it comes down to the $ above all else. Aside from that, whomever speaks to the drummer needs to be clear that it was a band decision, not any sort of personal vendetta, etc. to move on without him. Additionally, diplomacy is best, as this is just part of the business, and you will more than likely see each other out and about.
 
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How do the other two feel about the drummer?

Here's my potential solution. It seems as though you excel at many types of music. Perhaps just start a side project that caters to the drummer's skill set. Compartmentalize. Keep everyone where they fit best.

But, again, find out how everyone feels first. You shouldn't be firing anyone by yourself. But if everyone is on board then everyone should participate.
 
I'd simply take Bert and Joe's solutions and combine them. Give the drummer a deadline. One week, one month, one year, whatever you think is appropriate, for the drummer to up his game a bit. If he decides he doesn't want to or he fails to get there, then YOU quit. If the others feel he's fine as he is then you have no right to force your standards upon the band.

He got you in, he's having fun, he gets the job done, and he's not hurting anyone. He's just not living up to your standards.
 
I'd simply take Bert and Joe's solutions and combine them. Give the drummer a deadline. One week, one month, one year, whatever you think is appropriate, for the drummer to up his game a bit. If he decides he doesn't want to or he fails to get there, then YOU quit. If the others feel he's fine as he is then you have no right to force your standards upon the band.

He got you in, he's having fun, he gets the job done, and he's not hurting anyone. He's just not living up to your standards.

I would imagine (and I could be wrong) OP isn't the only one who feels this way in the orgnization. If three out of four people in an organization feel one way about musical direction, and the other can't/won't get on board, the "I got here first" rule doesn't apply.

So are you guys saying that everyone in the band should put his/her feelings aside and cater to the drummer because he has been around a while? (I'm sure you arent.) There's playground rules and then there's practicality.
 
n a situation like that, I believe you should quit and find another band. Sorry, but I don't like when people do crap like that. It was his band that you wanted to be a part of, and he helped you become a part of it. If you don't like it now, leave. My opi
I agree with this wholeheartedly.You will be asked why no doubt.If they want to listen to you then fine.You may find that they will easily move on too as well.
 
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This ain't show friends, it's show business.

The key is how the rest of the band feels. If they agree, then a discussion as to whether to provide a deadline or just release him is in order. If they disagree, then you need to find a new group or accept him as-is.

Unless a band is a group of friends doing this as friends first and musicians second, this isn't preschool. If you run the band as a business, treat it as such. If it's a social thing first, then you have a different situation.
 
I think you should bring it up with the band leader. If you don't know how to bring it up I would start with discussing how good the show without the drummer was and why you feel that the drummer is preventing the band from playing your best. Ultimately if the choice is made to go with a different drummer or without one letting that person go is the band leaders responsibility.
 
Make it a Disco band!

Ok, maybe not. It will depend on the consensus of the rest of the band partly. It will depend on how well he responds to direction partly. There are a lot of variables, and it does seem like a tricky situation. There are three other members of the band, from the sounds of things, so what are their thoughts?

And people do love the double bass for all kinds of things. I don't know quite why, but it has its own charisma.
 
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How long have you been playing together? The longer it's been, the more consideration is appropriate. For instance, it may be worth going the deadline route - explain the issues to him (dynamics, flexibility of style), and give him time to make changes before he's out (or to decide he doesn't want to). If not, I would still explain it to him as sympathetically as possible; you like him, you're really glad to have had the chance to play with him, but you just don't think he's the right match for the musical style you're aiming for and he'd do better in a straightforward rock band. Do it in person if you've known each other a while or are friends.

This seems to be the consensus, to do it in person IF the other band members are on board. Was hoping the BL vocalist would do it though. Heh.

Basically I sent her a nice long email explaining my thoughts and actually scared to open my email again and see if she responded. It's conceivable that she could say basically, "Sorry, Jim has been with us from the beginning. YOU'RE FIRED!" Honestly doubt she'll fire me, but will also be lame if she doesn't see a problem.

The selfish part of it is that I just really enjoyed playing the trio thing with them. Was like a jazz gig but instead we're doing Americana/pop with plenty of disco mixed in of course. ;)
 
I would love to have a drummer that played like that. They are rare. You want a drummer who likes to play splashy fills and bring out latin drumming? Dime a dozen man, dime a dozen. My drummer is really good but if anything, i would ask him to try and play more simple stuff like charie watts or phil rudd. Those guys are the best. Simple beats make the music catchy. Plus this guy stood up for you and now you want to kick him out? Why? You think you're new drummer will make you famous? They wont. Its not worth it.
 
Sit down with the other members - how do they feel? This should be a group decision. If they agree, you all need to sit down, in person (NOT at a rehearsal) and have a talk. Are their options that can be considered, such as lessons for the drummer, or just explaining your worries?

Whatever you do, be professional.
 
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In a situation like that, I believe you should quit and find another band. Sorry, but I don't like when people do crap like that. It was his band that you wanted to be a part of, and he helped you become a part of it. If you don't like it now, leave. My opinion.

Fair enough, not sure if it helps but I'm the more experienced musician in the band and responsible for most of the bigger shows or stage gigs that we land. I'm struggling with this precisely because he IS a dear friend but I do believe I'm ultimately doing the BL/singer a disservice if I didn't mention my clinical assessments of the sound.

I mean hell, I know I'm not the best and could be replaced by some virtuoso but I am musical enough to know that it's much worse with the drummer, musically. He's a really damn nice guy but he's got a full time job and not even available if we tried to tour. He's intimated that he knows he could be replaced as he doesn't have a ton of time. He was just beuing a nice guy and helping them out when they needed a drummer to get her act off the ground. He said something like, "I just wanted to help you get this going." He makes no bones about it, it's a fun hobby for him. Still makes it hard as poopie to even bring up asking him to bow out.
 
Fair enough, not sure if it helps but I'm the more experienced musician in the band and responsible for most of the bigger shows or stage gigs that we land. I'm struggling with this precisely because he IS a dear friend but I do believe I'm ultimately doing the BL/singer a disservice if I didn't mention my clinical assessments of the sound.

I mean hell, I know I'm not the best and could be replaced by some virtuoso but I am musical enough to know that it's much worse with the drummer, musically. He's a really damn nice guy but he's got a full time job and not even available if we tried to tour. He's intimated that he knows he could be replaced as he doesn't have a ton of time. He was just beuing a nice guy and helping them out when they needed a drummer to get her act off the ground. He said something like, "I just wanted to help you get this going." He makes no bones about it, it's a fun hobby for him. Still makes it hard as poopie to even bring up asking him to bow out.
I believe you just answered your own question. Tell him you (and the rest of the band) have different priorities than him and you want to take it to the next level - something which he will not be able to be a part of. Honesty is the best scenario!
 
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How do the other two feel about the drummer?

Here's my potential solution. It seems as though you excel at many types of music. Perhaps just start a side project that caters to the drummer's skill set. Compartmentalize. Keep everyone where they fit best.

But, again, find out how everyone feels first. You shouldn't be firing anyone by yourself. But if everyone is on board then everyone should participate.

He is a dear friend. I almost named this thread "What is a band? Is it 'friends and family or a business?" I'm sure the rest also love him for his help getting the ball rolling. He almost never missed a rehearsal and it's no small thing to have a drummer actually willing to haul his kit out every week.

I like your side project idea but perhaps modified a little. How about just more side gigs like the café trio thing we did? This makes sense because we got booked back the night of that Zola's trio thing. Fans and friends requested more of the trio with the double bass. Even her dad, which is usually Mr. Grumpity Grump, her words lol, loved the new sound and said for the first time he could actually hear her vocals and of course he loved the double bass. *primps hair*

It's definitely a bit selfish of me also, but ultimately, the professional musician in me feels obligated to at least mention that we sounded WAY better Friday and all it took was removing the overly loud human drum machine.
 

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