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I just got fired because I wouldn't Play for Free

#42
I too am what many consider to be a semi-pro musician. Withthe people I work with it is understood that we get payed for what we do. That being said, everyone has the right to bring up the possibility of doing free gigs here and there. But it has to make sense. I like the line in a previous post about how they would "start playing for free when they start giving out free beer." Makes sense in a lot of ways.

We are always open to a number of charity events as they come up. Again it must make sense for everyone. Are there any inordinate or extra expenses? What is the charity? Does it mean something to others in the band? How big an event? Is there the possibility of any paying work out of it? Is there backline and/or production available? Band gonna get fed? Can we sell merchandise at the event? Boost the email/fan base? I think you gotta ask these and more before you decide as a band or musician that "we're not gonna play for free" Anything else is in danger of being short sighted IMO.

JKT
 
#43
WayneS said:
Why is it so hard for some of you people to comprehend that a serious band would play for free? I make alot of money where I work, as does the others. We dont need to play for money.

Is that really so hard to understand? Or is it that your arrogance gets in the way of believing that a "good" band would play for free?
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Define 'serious'. IMHO you're not 'serious' unless you're hoping to make a living at it, and you can't do that without getting paid. If you're a cover band and you're playing for free regularly, then there is no way you can be 'serious'. You're not playing to make a living, you're playing for fun. That is a hobby.
 
#44
Alot of people that have posted here seem to not understand what a cover band is. It is a job, you are playing somebody else's music, and no matter how much enjoy your job you still expect a little bit of remuneration. When bands do not charge venues etc, it is like showing up to your day job for free. If you were in an originals band and you did not get paid then i would say that your not ready for being payed as most good bands get some form of payment.

I think they made a good decision for you. Saves you the hassle, alhough i would remain friends or at least civil as you dont know what they may do in the future.
 
#46
sublime0bass said:
i guess the difference is the brewer and the car maker have a tangible product they can provide. and while music isnt intangible, per se, you are getting paid for your effort and ability (and not for the equipment or anything else). and while their efforts might be "worth something", that doesnt mean its money. the value may be intrensic (enjoying playing, getting the crowd pumped, etc).
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It's still a service and a working cover musician has every right to expect to get paid for that service unless, as previously mentioned it's for a charity event or if the end benefit of the freebie show is more exposure leading to more and better paying gigs from generating a bigger fan base. I enjoy most of the cover music I play. I also enjoy seeing clubs full of people getting off on, and giving a positive reaction to the music we're playing. It's because of the efforts of myself and my band mates (by way of rehearsal and promotion) to put a solid, professional show together, that those people (who pay a cover charge) are at the shows to begin with. You may think ill of musicians who refuse play for free, but to carp about a steadily working musician expecting to get paid fairly for their efforts is simply ignorant and shows a lack of understanding (as well as stage miles) as to what the goals of what a working cover band and the business of running one are.
 
#47
Just be careful because people will try to take advantage of you if you lack experience or simply do not know.

And if you want to get paid for your services/time/talent choose to only associate yourself with that type of environment and if you want to play for free do it because you want to.

And always remember that 99% of the clubs out there do not care about you(or your band,it's all about how much liquor they can sell
 
#48
sublime0bass said:
while their efforts might be "worth something", that doesnt mean its money..
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To the guy running a bar, the music's worth is money.

WayneS said:
Bars, clubs, parties, we will play anywhere for free.

If people dont have to pay, usually more people will show up.
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Tell me about these bars and clubs where the audience doesn't have to pay. Really if there's a free bar, then I'll play for free...

Most venues are taking money from YOUR AUDIENCE. You've attracted a lot of people to the place, so the bar sells more drinks and makes more money. You ARE earning money - it's just your crazy enough to let the bar owner keep it all.

I'll play for free in plenty of situations, but if someone else is making money from my playing, then they better have a pretty good reason for not giving me some of it.

Ian
 
#49
Playing music, for me, is something I consider myself very luck to do. I run a couple of companies that provide my main income which provide me with the luxury of choosing which musical work I will take and which I won't. Years ago I would go to jams and open mics and play for free. I still do it but less and less since I am busy either gigging or preparing for gigging. Jams are still fun to hang out at and see some old friends.

These days I do little or no free work unless its a significant opportunity. My reasoning is simple: my time is valuable and I have a lot invested in gear but more importantly than that I play regularly with musicians who genuinely work full time as musicians and out of respect for them I don't do free work. If a band is prepared to play a gig for free or little or no money the next band in who is used to a certain fee could lose out on a gig simply because the precedent has been set by the free or cheap band. I suppose that's free enterprise in action but for as long as I can remember the going rate for a blues band in a club might be $50-$75, maybe $100 a guy for years. I'm not going to start the car for a $50 gig these days. I have done 1 hour sets lately for $145-$200 and have a $500 for 1 hour set coming up. A friend asked about playing on his CD and I said I siad I would charge him $100 per day. Not a lot but my time is valuable.

I'll stop now
 
#50
JAUQO III-X said:
And always remember that 99% of the clubs out there do not care about you(or your band,it's all about how much liquor they can sell
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+1. The bar owner will always say that if the place is hoping then its a great bar. The bar owner will also say if the place is empty it because the band is bad.

Just like Enzo Ferrari. If a car won a race its the car, if the car didn't it was the driver.
 
#51
I just started taoking to a band about playnig. Its a cover band. I said in short "I will only play paying gigs of X amount+Xpermile. I will come Jam a couple time so you know what I sound like and what I can do. Please give me the set list so I can have it ready by next week and come in ready tot gig." If we start getting into originals its a different thing. A cover band is like selling yourself sexually, you may enjoy it but money is the first priority.
 
#52
You guys are more than welcome to go to Link Removed and judge for yourselves whether we suck or not. However, I am not the bassist that you will hear there. The music sounds better with me playing! :)

Anyway, the people who are pro-making money have brought up some valid points. I'm not going to try to to convince anybody that my stance is the right stance. Everybody to their own I guess. Also, I wouldnt consider me or my bandmates stupid because we play for free.

"the amount of times someone says 'it's all about the music' is directly proportional to the amount of money in his wallet." That's my opinion on it.
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I dont agree with this either. Like I said, I have a good job, plenty of money, and enjoy playing music.


Its all good though. These are only my opinions.
 
#53
Well, Wayne, I love playing music too. And if I had no other option, I´d probably do free cover gigs as well - if the band was hip enough.

But, why would I ever spend my whole night playing free - when I can do the same thing making $350?

From you myspace site I can see that you play clubs and such. They make money on you. So I think it´s strange that you don´t get to share some of that.

But if you are cool with it, that´s all that matters! (As long as there are no hungry musicians in town looking for a gig:D )
 
#55
trevcda said:
Why do musicians continue to perpetuate the myth that they are second class citizens? That thier time, efforts and work have no value. When the brewers make beer, the clothes stores make clothes and automobile makers produce thier products "FOR THE ART OF IT" and give it away for free, I might change my views on this. Know what they call artist, dancers and other people who perform for free? Homeless. Does the sound guy provide thousands of dollars in equipment and his time for free just so he make you sound great? Know of any bands touring the country that foot the bill to rent the (insert the name of your town here) performing art center, a touring sound and light system and fly themselves to podunk so you and your buddies can see them for free? Yeah good luck with that. With the kind of thinking I see going on here you'll bring back the pay-to-play from the 90's. Your time, energy and efforts are worth something or you wouldn't be asked to be there. Don't let somebody else make money for your efforts or you'll just set yourself up to be walked on through out your musical career. obviously there are exceptions such as charities that you believe in. But even then the caterers and the facility are at least recouping operating costs. Sorry this stuff pisses me off. I'll stop ranting now...
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Dude you read my mind..this same mindset has been driving me up the wall for years...I gig in a pro covers band and we work bloody hard to provide a professional show..punters are in a club and they see the band come on stage and entertain them for 2-3 hrs, what they dont see is the 3-4 hr drive to get to the venue, the 1hr rig set up (including hefting heavey gear up stairs and down narrow corridors) which would drain the stamina of any reasonably fit person..and then be "on" for 2hrs with No break.. at the end of the gig repeat the whole process...its bloody hard work...if you had to hire a plumber to work the same hours you'd bloody well pay for it.

I've done the whole "original band" scene and yes its great fun BUT! when my circumstances changed over the years and I was unemployed from a day job the covers band helped me survive..so by all means play for free "for the music man" just make sure you have a pretty decent day job or have won the lottery.
 
#58
sublime0bass said:
on one hand, i dont like people who wont play music for free. they tend to think they are above the "average musician". and if you are only making like 50 bucks a night, the issue of pay is moot.

on the other hand, if you only want to use music as a form of pay, more power to you, but you need to accept that some people dont care if they ever see money. its not really funny, its just enjoying what they do. they probably also generate cash from other jobs, and not from play. To them, life (playing music) comes first, and money 2nd.
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$50 will put a new set Elixers on one of my six string basses. Considering I bring four of them to every show, I had better get at least 50 bucks a show.

Then there is the wear and tear on my equipment, my vehicle, and me. I think another $50 is required for all of that.

Then there is my time. I didn't learn all of the songs we play in a matter of minutes, that's for sure. All of the practices I attended, to get the band tight so we could put on a great show for all the people that came out to see us. And my time for actually being there, performing so someone else can make money. Yeah, you had better throw in at least another fifty for that.

If I don't get at least $100 for a show, I don't show. Thank the gods the rest of my band feels the same way, though admittedly we will do the occasional charity event.

Anybody that constantly performs for free is a fool. Hey, I love playing music just as much as the next guy, but if I am going to buy gear, keep it maintained, and go through all the other bs, I AM going to get payed for it.
 
#60
Steve Clark said:
+1. The bar owner will always say that if the place is hoping then its a great bar. The bar owner will also say if the place is empty it because the band is bad.

Just like Enzo Ferrari. If a car won a race its the car, if the car didn't it was the driver.
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indeed! If you are playing covers in a bar and the place is happening you deserve a cut of the $$. If people were just as happy listening to CDs then that bar owner would toss you out in a second.

imho orignals = take what you can get until you build up enough of a following to charge

cover band = performing a service.

I play in a cover band with most of the same guys from our original band. We do the 3-4 hour cover gigs to pay for our studio time etc. (and to admittedly try out some originals on a crowd now and then) Sure it can be fun, I have had fun at my day job, but I am not doing either for free (except for charity as mentioned in a few posts)
 

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