I just pulled the trigger on an XR18

[walterw]

I am looking at replacing my 1604vlz (and allt other rack components) so considering my options.

oh man, it's past time for that! the board and that analog rack gear is mostly worthless now.

(i'm in the same boat, i own a nice older british-made mixwix and a rolling rack full of older US-made processing from rane, DBX, aphex, etc. the entire thing could be happily traded for one $600 XR18!)

 

[kittywithabanjo]

It does seem the way to go. Just want to be sure I get the right system
.

 

[Geri O]

Any of you wish you had gone for the xr32? Or are there enough channels for most live applications

Yeah, and absolutely not because of any deficiency with the XR18. I'd just like a couple of more auxes and inputs. (XR24, anyone? Yeah, that's getting outta hand with the line-up) But 99% of the time, it's plenty of inputs. Wish I had 2 more mixes. A 6-piece band kills my aux-driven subs. Again, in those places, it works out just fine, in spite of myself.

Sure, I could take the X32 into those situations where I need just a little more. But it's a hell of a day when you realize that your little bitty X32 (compared to Series Fives and PM4000s) is too big for a few of the clubs you play. Actually, my X32 has become a good source of rental income for a couple of the local PA houses and a couple of engineers on their own projects. I can get it when I need it.

But I'm not going to make that move anytime soon. I'm going to add a couple of P16s to my rig. And tell the drummer to not bring anymore toms....

 

[walterw]

(XR24, anyone? Yeah, that's getting outta hand with the line-up)

+1!

hell, why does it always have to be multiples of 8?

an "XR20" or mackie "DL20-11", with 20 ins, 8 aux outs and L-R + sub or mono out would be pretty awesome for lots of club-type stuff. stereo in-ears for a typical 4-piece band in smaller clubs?

 

[Frankjohnson]

oh man, it's past time for that! the board and that analog rack gear is mostly worthless now.

(i'm in the same boat, i own a nice older british-made mixwix and a rolling rack full of older US-made processing from rane, DBX, aphex, etc. the entire thing could be happily traded for one $600 XR18!)

I had picked up my mixwiz 4 AND gator rack for $850 as a set - sold for 900, and sold 4 rack pieces for another 300........bought another xr18 as backup and put cash against a kw181 last weekend!

 

[Geri O]

I had picked up my mixwiz 4 AND gator rack for $850 as a set - sold for 900, and sold 4 rack pieces for another 300........bought another xr18 as backup and put cash against a kw181 last weekend!

These day, any day you can sell any analog PA gear and get anything past a red nickel is a very good day.

 

[s0c9]

These day, any day you can sell any analog PA gear and get anything past a red nickel is a very good day.

I have an entire analog PA - consoles, amps, speakers, subs, cables, etc. - that is sitting idle (no $$ in rentals these days).
2 A&H consoles and a Presonus 16:4, QSC, Crown and Yammy amps, etc...
Basically not worth scrap metal prices

 

[Geri O]

These day, any day you can sell any analog PA gear and get anything past a red nickel is a very good day.

I have an entire analog PA - consoles, amps, speakers, subs, cables, etc. - that is sitting idle (no $$ in rentals these days).
2 A&H consoles and a Presonus 16:4, QSC, Crown and Yammy amps, etc...
Basically not worth scrap metal prices

The kinda-boss and I have this discussion once a month or so about the huge analog desks in the corner of the shop that haven't seen the light of day in 3-4 years. Which is the death of those big desks. To even try and use one now would take a week or two to clean up faders, switches, and pots before it would be usable.

We can't even give them away. "We are looking for a console for our new worship center". "Would you like to have a Soundcraft Series Five and some outboard EQs and FX for free? We'll even deliver it." "But it's sooooo big!" "Yes, there's that". "How much was that X32 again, that's all we need, but thank you anyway!". I've had that conversation 4 times in the last 2-3 years.

 

[s0c9]

To even try and use one now would take a week or two to clean up faders, switches, and pots before it would be usable.

Mine are all in cases, so that should keep them in reasonable condition, but yeah.. I completely understand... you can't give the big-uns away and the smaller ones are hardly worth selling... my GL2400-4 is listing on evilbay between $600-900 (upper end w/ case). The mixwiz is selling for around $400-600. Total sacrilege for such quality boards..

PS: Did you get my reply on the P16M?

 

[Geri O]

Mine are all in cases, so that should keep them in reasonable condition, but yeah.. I completely understand... you can't give the big-uns away and the smaller ones are hardly worth selling... my GL2400-4 is listing on evilbay between $600-900 (upper end w/ case). The mixwiz is selling for around $400-600. Total sacrilege for such quality boards..

PS: Did you get my reply on the P16M?

These are in their road cases, but they sit in a no-climate-control shop. So none-use takes its toll on the controls of them.

Yes, I did, I'm ordering one when we get back from (gasp!) vacation. It's this activity that I've come across that means you leave your domicile and job for a few days and do.....well...

...bloody well what you feel like. Who knew.....

(However, this is with the 3 grandkids, it's really their trip. We call it a vacation because we can't find a job description for such an activity....)

 

[FuturePrimitive]

PS: Did you get my reply on the P16M?

Excuse me for butting in here but are you using a P16M? I'm thinking about picking one up but most of the reviews/videos I've seen are sales oriented. Can you share your experience with it? (Or is there another thread on it I've somehow missed?) Thanks.

 

[s0c9]

Excuse me for butting in here but are you using a P16M? I'm thinking about picking one up but most of the reviews/videos I've seen are sales oriented. Can you share your experience with it? (Or is there another thread on it I've somehow missed?) Thanks.

I do not it with my current band - I'm G3 wireless - but I DO OWN 2 of them (and a P16I) and use them (and Aviom) when playing at church.
My drummer uses one of mine [right now] hooked right into the ultranet port on the back of our X32 and sits it on top of his Lasko fan within easy reach!

They connect directly to the Ultranet (using CAT5) port on the X32 and XR series mixers.
The P16M supports a 16-channel mix with adjustable EQ (High, adjustable MF band, LF) on EACH channel, adjustable limiter, panning capability, settings store/recall capability and so on (marketing blurb out of the way**).
On the X32 (not sure about XR's but assume it's the same) the routing capability lets you assign ANY of the consoles outputs to a P16 out channel. This lets you sub-group mixes to a P16M channel (for example horns on Ch16) - for situations where you have more than 16 inputs going into the console. Grouping should be based on who's needs what in their P16M mix. In other words, every P16M gets the SAME 16 channels...

You can daisy-chain multiple units (each needs its own power source) as you can with the Aviom's.

If you run the P16M from the P16I, any P16M directly connected to one the P16I's 6 output ports will be powered. P16M's daisy-chained off one of those powered P16M's will require their own power.
Audio is clean and drives the IEM's I have used it with and will get plenty loud.. I have NOT tried it with high-impedance (64-Ohm +) headphones.
For the price - as long as you have B*ringer digital consoles - hard to beat! IME

FWIW - Get industrial strength CAT5 cables if you go this route... and take care with connecting/disconnecting them from mixer and P16M's as pins can get misaligned.
This is NOT a Behringer build quality issue, but IS symptomatic of using CAT5 cabling for live audio with ANY product.

 

[FuturePrimitive]

I do not it with my current band - <SNIP>
This is NOT a Behringer build quality issue, but IS symptomatic of using CAT5 cabling for live audio with ANY product.

Thanks, I found one on eBay and put an offer in, we'll see how that goes.

And yea, I work in IT so I'm used to CAT5 cables failing. ;-)

 

[s0c9]

Thanks, I found one on eBay and put an offer in, we'll see how that goes.

And yea, I work in IT so I'm used to CAT5 cables failing. ;-)

cool..
not for you, but for others who may read this..
the CAT5/ethernet cabling design (like our old telephone connectors) were NEVER designed for constant connect/disconnects.
The have a simple plastic lip/locking mechanism that breaks under constant use...
CAT5/6 was designed to be connected and LEFT connected.
Constant connects/reconnects wears out both the male cable connectors +clips and the female jacks on the connected devices.
They are used in gear because of price and ease of use.
Ethercon is better but rare..

 

[jive1]

cool..
not for you, but for others who may read this..
the CAT5/ethernet cabling design (like our old telephone connectors) were NEVER designed for constant connect/disconnects.
The have a simple plastic lip/locking mechanism that breaks under constant use...
CAT5/6 was designed to be connected and LEFT connected.
Constant connects/reconnects wears out both the male cable connectors +clips and the female jacks on the connected devices.
They are used in gear because of price and ease of use.
Ethercon is better but rare..

Also CAT5 cable is not meant to be stepped on either. It might survive a few times, but it doesn't take much to damage the cable. CAT5 is not a durable cable at all compared to an instrument or speaker cable.

 

[s0c9]

Also CAT5 cable is not meant to be stepped on either. It might survive a few times, but it doesn't take much to damage the cable. CAT5 is not a durable cable at all compared to an instrument or speaker cable.

You are correct, . .I didn't think of that because I'm anal and ALWAYS have neat cable runs.
CAT5 is routed behind amps, etc...

 

[jive1]

You are correct, . .I didn't think of that because I'm anal and ALWAYS have neat cable runs.
CAT5 is routed behind amps, etc...

Yeah, I figured that out when I was considering a CAT5 audio snake. The prospect of running the cable across the ceiling threw that idea into the dumpster.

 

[seamonkey]

It's the same as any other cable. Buy a cable that's appropriate to the task. Yes they make cat-x cable that is just a durable as any mic cable.

 

[bebass]

It's the same as any other cable. Buy a cable that's appropriate to the task. Yes they make cat-x cable that is just a durable as any mic cable.

If you don't mind sharing, can you PM me your source for good cat-x cable? I have to buy a fair amount in a couple of weeks.

 

[Geri O]

If you don't mind sharing, can you PM me your source for good cat-x cable? I have to buy a fair amount in a couple of weeks.

We get Tourcat from Rapco. It's still Cat5 (actually Cat6 for the Yamaha CL5s, but it comes in Cat5, too. Won't hurt to move up to Cat6) and doesn't need to be kinked or stomped on with cowboy boots or stilettos, but it's much more robust for exposed runs. Rolls up nicely, too.