Is interest in live music declining?

[friskinator]

My experience tells me that most people under the age of 30 want instant gratification and have ZERO patience. They want their favorite song, you know, the one that clocks in at an impressive 2.5 minutes tops. Anything longer and they're either bored or triggered. Not conducive to live music bar scenes.

A friend of mine has a 15 yr old daughter. She likes music and occasionally goes to shows with a parental chaperone, but she has zero interest in listening to music in any format other than individual songs. My friend is taking her to see Paul McCartney soon (she likes the Beatles), but she's not familiar with his solo material. She asked her dad "what song should I listen to?" Not songs, SONG. He didn't even know how to answer. How do you distill 40+ years of material into one 3 minute bite? Will she even have fun at the McCartney show, or resort to looking at her phone after a few minutes?

Is interest in live music dying? I don't know the real answer, but I do know that a lot of the bars my old band used to play back in Atlanta either closed or stopped booking live music entirely.

 

[xroads64]

We had a band meeting on this subject last year. We get paid a lot more than our peers in the weekend-warrior world, enough that our BL asked us to not talk to our friends in other bands about it. So I'm not going to share that here, either.

I assure you I don't do this for grins and gas money. In my world money = validation.

Convenient argument, I call B.S.

 

[Bunk McNulty]

Convenient argument, I call B.S.

Whatever, man. No skin off my nose.

 

[Kragnorak]

Of course live music is not in great shape. Back in the day, there were enough clubs that a jazz or blues musicians could gig 5 nights a week without leaving a local metropolitan area. I don't know anybody that gigs even close to that amount without touring

 

[theinfamous]

One thing I don't see covered here is the effect of smoking bans. Most people who want to hang out in bars and drink also want to smoke. If they can't smoke in a bar, they will likely go get a bottle and a pack of cigarettes and watch the tube at home.

I notices this in spades on Beale street in Memphis. When I was there in mid 90s, bars with live music lined both sides of the street punctuated by a tourist/gift shop here and there. The streets were full of people and the bars were packed. Last time I was there, about 2007, There was no smoking in bars. There were very few bars left. The tourist/gift shops had taken over the street. I went into one bar and the entire atmosphere was depressing. The band didn't seem to care and were not really putting on a show and the audience was indifferent.

I would agree that the smoking ban had an impact on the bar scene in general. It's been overall a positive thing for my experience because I dont go home smelling like an ashtray with a headache. However, it definitely hurt bar and gambling business.

 

[sm49341]

I think live music is alive and well. I believe audience expectations are different these days. I think these days for a cover band you had better have drop dead good vocals. Quite a few bands i see do not. Really good signing bands have a lot of work and command a premium.
Lotta TV shows like American Idil showcase singing skills. None showcase guitar/musician skills. They are assumed.
And you had better play fun music, or the party is over .....for you.

 

[theinfamous]

This is not a snarky question, just an honest one. How much are you making a night at these gigs? Not the band, but you personally?

This is an incredibly valid question, because I could gig every weekend if I was willing to drop my price, but to haul all my gear and play for 3 hours it's just not worth it, especially when you play for three people and a dog all night.

I think live music is alive and well. I believe audience expectations are different these days. I think these days for a cover band you had better have drop dead good vocals. Quite a few bands i see do not. Really good signing bands have a lot of work and command a premium.
Lotta TV shows like American Idil showcase singing skills. None showcase guitar/musician skills. They are assumed.
And you had better play fun music, or the party is over .....for you.

Even if you have the most slick presentation and best musicians, people still need to be there to see your band. Bands that do street dances, rodeos, and special events tend to do fine because they have a built in crowd. Those bands tend to sound more refined and have a more polished show because they can afford to because they're the ones getting all those good paying gigs. It's really hard to break into that circuit around here, but once people know your name, you're in. I wouldn't say that those bands have exceptional vocals either.

I've seen interest in music, regardless of quality or genre steadily declining.

Production and quality of performance will help, I believe, but it's still a struggle to get people out of the house to see the band.

 

[dbsfgyd1]

DUI laws, high liability insurance, karaoke, trivia, MTV, and the internet have all reduced the crowds at live music venues in the last couple of decades IMO. I play in an acoustic original band and we can play at just about any brew pub in town as long as we play for beer, food and tips. I think to make a living playing music you have to be young, hungry and talented. Good luck for old geezers like me. Luckily I don’t need the money to pay mortgage. I make enough to buy a new bass once in a while.

My musical work load consists of about 8 gigs a year, half with an 8 piece corporate dance band, and the other half with an 11 piece oldies/beach music/doo whop band. Both with top end talent, but zero market that is willing to pay enough to make it worthwhile.

Earlier this year I was working with a 5 piece British Invasion tribute band with nowhere’s near the talent, playing local restaurant pubs @ 6-8 times a month, my end averaging $65 a gig (two hours of music) +food, and had to give it up due to my day job at the time.

5 years ago I was knocking down $300-$400 a show with those other two bands. Heck of a pay cut.

 

[Gravedigger Dav]

I would agree that the smoking ban had an impact on the bar scene in general. It's been overall a positive thing for my experience because I dont go home smelling like an ashtray with a headache. However, it definitely hurt bar and gambling business.

Yeah, I hated that part, too. I remember one place where I got home and all my gear smelled like an ashtray. Even after unloading, my car smelled like smoke for a day or two.

 

[rtslinger]

I noticed between sets the music of choice even with our loyal followers is country on the jukebox, so we have taken to adding more country songs to our set list just to keep them happy. And it seems to be a win win situation. Whatever it takes to keep them coming back

 

[theinfamous]

I noticed between sets the music of choice even with our loyal followers is country on the jukebox, so we have taken to adding more country songs to our set list just to keep them happy. And it seems to be a win win situation. Whatever it takes to keep them coming back

See I'm torn. It makes sense to do some country because that's what some people like, but if we just try to chase down what drunk people like or the songs they think to request, we are going to end up playing a lot of stuff we dont particularly care for, and for perhaps little to no gain.

Just because "Ashley 21 year old" wants to hear Garth Brooks and 21 pilots does not insure that we're going to get more gigs or a bigger crowd than we do now.

 

[Badwater]

IME, Live music is where it's at. That's where the artist make or lose their cash. It's where people experience the music. All types of music has a following. Some are more popular than others. Thus, if you stick to one kind of style or music, you'll see a decline in that style as the years and decades go by. But if you keep up with the latest and underground music, you'll see that live music thrives.

For example, I see huge stars like Carlos Santana, John Fogerty, Isley Brothers, EWF, Ratt, Edgar Winter, Elvin Bishop,... you name it from the 70s-80s and 90s, playing small club gigs in Las Vegas and all over the country on tours in these small venues. And for cheap. On the other hand, some new modern artists being promoted (forgot their names, you take your pick), were playing the same venues with ticket prices 2x that of the once famous musicians. And, if you keep up, with the new music, like ED, and other tech driven dance grooves, they play huge sold out arenas for ticket prices into the $150 to $2K range. And you likely never heard of these Djs and artist. But, I can tell you they sound great and innovative for what they do.

On the other hand, there are the huge popular artist like ZZ Top, Van Halen, RHCP, Stones, etc... those who's music still sells out arenas and huge venues. They are still significant in the live music scene. But, they tend to recluse due to the weight of cost put on them by the music industry promoters and agents to run these huge venue shows. Thus, if anything, these types of artist will slowly fade as they grow old and income or wealth declines.

 

[s_wood]

There's no question that there is less interest in live music in most places, at least in the US. Certainly where I live and gig (Philadelphia metro area) there are maybe half as many places to gig as there were 20 years ago. And, except for those places where the population is growing rapidly, judging by what I read on TB that seems to be the case nearly everywhere. The question is why? My guess is that the smoking ban really hasn't had that much to do with it: it's a pretty pathetic dig at smokers to portray them as so badly addicted that they won't leave their homes if they can't smoke. But, at around the same time that the smoking bans began to become widespread home theaters, video gaming and the whole gamut of Internet-based entertainment options began to take off in popularity, too. I wonder if those things created competition for entertainment time -- some folks who used to go out for entertainment now stay home instead.

I also wonder if the current trend in pop music (defined as what gets played on the radio), which favors sampled stuff over anything like full band tracks, is a problem, at least for cover bands (who have always been the most common kind of bar band). If the original track wasn't created with a full band, why do you need one in the bar? I guess the test of this theory would be to see if the country cover bands are having the same trouble finding places to play as the "pop" cover bands (country tracks still feature bands, right?).

These things are all guesses, though...

 

[LT131]

Begging your pardon, but it's all about whether my stinky little bar band gets booked. There is an awful lot of opinion in this thread, but this right here is fact:
View attachment 3199422
We break every "rule" too. We have no EPK. We have no pro audio or video. We are definitely not breaking any kind of new musical ground. Oh, and we're definitely "too old." If people have lost interest in live music where you are, well, I'm sorry to hear that. They haven't lost interest in us. Yet. Someday this will all fall apart, but I'm diggin' it while it's here.

No offense but your personal success is in no way an indicator of the general publics interest in live music. Your fans are interested in you and I am envious. But, if you believe that recorded music sales, concert attendance, live music venues, etc. are greater than say, 30 years ago, then well, you're just going to believe.

I play in two bands one country, 1 70-80's rock. We are veteran, no drug/problem drinkers, good players. We would love to play more but there are just so many venues booking full bands and the competition is fierce. Most have gone to background duos. 30 years ago there were easily 3 times the venues offering live music by full bands.

Again, I applaud your success but it does not apply to the question in the OP.

 

[bikeplate]

Not where i live. Its a free for all every weekend. And summer? Insane

 

[Bunk McNulty]

No offense but your personal success is in no way an indicator of the general publics interest in live music. Your fans are interested in you and I am envious. But, if you believe that recorded music sales, concert attendance, live music venues, etc. are greater than say, 30 years ago, then well, you're just going to believe.

I play in two bands one country, 1 70-80's rock. We are veteran, no drug/problem drinkers, good players. We would love to play more but there are just so many venues booking full bands and the competition is fierce. Most have gone to background duos. 30 years ago there were easily 3 times the venues offering live music by full bands.

Again, I applaud your success but it does not apply to the question in the OP.

No offense but your personal success is in no way an indicator of the general publics interest in live music. Your fans are interested in you and I am envious. But, if you believe that recorded music sales, concert attendance, live music venues, etc. are greater than say, 30 years ago, then well, you're just going to believe.

I play in two bands one country, 1 70-80's rock. We are veteran, no drug/problem drinkers, good players. We would love to play more but there are just so many venues booking full bands and the competition is fierce. Most have gone to background duos. 30 years ago there were easily 3 times the venues offering live music by full bands.

Again, I applaud your success but it does not apply to the question in the OP.

Okay, I see where this is going. I wish to apologize:

1. I apologize for my personal experience deviating from the collective wisdom.
2. I apologize for giving anyone the idea that my good luck somehow invalidates what has happened to the music business in general.
3. I apologize for playing in a cover band that is successful. It had nothing to do with me, and everything to do with working for a singer who is also a good business head.

As a side note, I wish to assure everyone that Redhead is relentlessly small-time. We are a band that makes most of its money playing in dive bars. We just happen to be better at it than most of our competition. I apologize for that, too.

 

[theinfamous]

Okay, I see where this is going. I wish to apologize:

1. I apologize for my personal experience deviating from the collective wisdom.
2. I apologize for giving anyone the idea that my good luck somehow invalidates what has happened to the music business in general.
3. I apologize for playing in a cover band that is successful. It had nothing to do with me, and everything to do with working for a singer who is also a good business head.

As a side note, I wish to assure everyone that Redhead is relentlessly small-time. We are a band that makes most of its money playing in dive bars. We just happen to be better at it than most of our competition. I apologize for that, too.

So, what makes you successful, beyond musical capabilities, if you don't mind me asking?

I'm curious to know what your set list is like. Do you take requests? Do you have a large catalogue of tunes to choose from to cater to specific crowds, or do you play a pretty rigid show?

How do you market your band?

Do you have a lot of places you play consistently on a schedule, or are you kind of all over the place?

 

[rtslinger]

See I'm torn. It makes sense to do some country because that's what some people like, but if we just try to chase down what drunk people like or the songs they think to request, we are going to end up playing a lot of stuff we dont particularly care for, and for perhaps little to no gain.

Just because "Ashley 21 year old" wants to hear Garth Brooks and 21 pilots does not insure that we're going to get more gigs or a bigger crowd than we do now.

We have been getting younger and younger people hanging out with us. The people in their 50-60 even 70 who were our crowd back in 2005 are now no longer showing up or now longer with us. The crowds coming out to party are in the 20-30 and some 40 somethings. To stay relevant you need to pay close attention to the changes what went over great in 2005-2010 now falls on deaf ears so you need to find the right mix of old and new, and for us it isn't too much of a change to add some rocking country stuff, because we have been doing southern rock for years. We are adding She Country drop C#/Db tuning this isn't your mama's country anymore ha ha ha

 

[Bunk McNulty]

So, what makes you successful, beyond musical capabilities, if you don't mind me asking?

I'm curious to know what your set list is like. Do you take requests? Do you have a large catalogue of tunes to choose from to cater to specific crowds, or do you play a pretty rigid show?

How do you market your band?

Do you have a lot of places you play consistently on a schedule, or are you kind of all over the place?

1. There is nothing special on the set list. Doobie Brothers, Linda Ronstadt, Steely Dan, Zep, Beatles, Joss Stone, Heart, Rod Stewart, Guns'n'Roses, Maroon 5, blah-blah-blah.

2. Our BL surveys the audience before we start the first set, usually looking for birthdays. If someone requests something that's in our book, we'll probably play it. We probably have over a hundred songs in the book, but we usually have 50-60 in rotation, so to speak. We always have a set list, but our BL will call audibles a few times a night. We do design set lists to meet specific conditions: There are two places we play where the first set isn't "dinner music" but is quieter than a dance set.

3. We market our band by being on the scene as much as possible. For example: We're going into a new club in December, and we're already planning advance visits. As our BL says, "We need to get our faces known before we go in." So we'll go to their open mic, etc. Every place we play--every single one--our BL has a personal relationship with the owner/booker. Yes, it is a lot of work, and yes, it pays off. Basically, we invest time rather than money in promoting ourselves. We have a facebook page, but that's it. Oh, and once a year we load up on tee-shirts and hoodies that we sell or give away. We had a sort of ersatz "fan club" but that has become what we call Redhead Nation. We even got them to pose at a fundraiser we did back in July:

4. At the moment, we have nine clubs, all but one in central Connecticut, that we cycle through.

5. I've just been really, really lucky.

You will notice our BL does a lot of heavy lifting. The real secret of our success is that she depends in part on the band to make ends meet. (When she's not playing with us, she runs an open mic, sings with an acoustic duo, and books a few other bands.)

 

[theinfamous]

1. There is nothing special on the set list. Doobie Brothers, Linda Ronstadt, Steely Dan, Zep, Beatles, Joss Stone, Heart, Rod Stewart, Guns'n'Roses, Maroon 5, blah-blah-blah.

2. Our BL surveys the audience before we start the first set, usually looking for birthdays. If someone requests something that's in our book, we'll probably play it. We probably have over a hundred songs in the book, but we usually have 50-60 in rotation, so to speak. We always have a set list, but our BL will call audibles a few times a night. We do design set lists to meet specific conditions: There are two places we play where the first set isn't "dinner music" but is quieter than a dance set.

3. We market our band by being on the scene as much as possible. For example: We're going into a new club in December, and we're already planning advance visits. As our BL says, "We need to get our faces known before we go in." So we'll go to their open mic, etc. Every place we play--every single one--our BL has a personal relationship with the owner/booker. Yes, it is a lot of work, and yes, it pays off. Basically, we invest time rather than money in promoting ourselves. We have a facebook page, but that's it. Oh, and once a year we load up on tee-shirts and hoodies that we sell or give away. We had a sort of ersatz "fan club" but that has become what we call Redhead Nation. We even got them to pose at a fundraiser we did back in July:
View attachment 3204097

4. At the moment, we have nine clubs, all but one in central Connecticut, that we cycle through.

5. I've just been really, really lucky.

You will notice our BL does a lot of heavy lifting. The real secret of our success is that she depends in part on the band to make ends meet. (When she's not playing with us, she runs an open mic, sings with an acoustic duo, and books a few other bands.)

Thanks for the insight! I think a lot of bands would benefit from being more visible like you suggested, because it takes a lot of time and effort to go from a band that makes people go "who?" to a band where people go "I know who they are," and even more to get someone excited about going to all your shows.