I basically disagree. I prefer to rehearse at a reasonable volume, but if you're stuck with bandmates who refuse to turn down then either overcome and adapt (i.e., earplugs) or move on.
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Is me
- Thread starter woody357
- Start date
Your spot on with that one , I did a recording session once where I rehearsed with the band the day before and I thought everything was fine . First take it was obvious the bass was all wrong , no one noticed the bass line(s) was not right during rehearsal because the volume was too loud . They ended up having to write out the bass line so I could record it .
I agree with about people playing softer when they don’t know some, but drummers and bassist can’t hide, like keys or guitar player can. We are the driving force behind the music. IJS
True!
And yet, in terms of matching volume or loudness, IMHO, IME, YMMV,.........it takes about 500 bass watts to keep up with a guitar's 24 watt amp.
I think it’s a fallacy that loud = sloppy. But that seems to be where this thread is going. I’m not a fan of super loud playing but some music does sound better that way. AC/DC would suck if they played at dinner volume, for example.
This came up in my rehearsal last night. We were talking about breakdowns, and how they serve a couple of purposes: one is to get everyone listening better to the groove by lowering the volume and paying closer attention to the collective sound, the other is the provide more interesting music by varying dynamics. Volume turns in to an arms races a lot (most?) of times.
Agree completely. My prog rock band has recently lowered our rehearsal volume and found that it's much better for locking together complex parts and refining tricky riffs. And the dynamics and ability to listen to each other is a beautiful thing.
Next up, in my recently formed power trio, I need to have a chat with the guitarist about his new amp that he loves...I'm having to turn up much louder than before, and my bass sound, ability to hear myself and ears are not happy about it, lol.
Next up, in my recently formed power trio, I need to have a chat with the guitarist about his new amp that he loves...I'm having to turn up much louder than before, and my bass sound, ability to hear myself and ears are not happy about it, lol.
The detail that I think makes his control of dynamics most impressive, is that he often plays (at the really quiet parts of the song) with his guitar's electronics turned OFF - he's playing his Stratocaster acoustically*, the band is still playing with him, and you can hear everything that is being played, and it's still very expressive. A 500 seat club, and he doesn't need an amp - the audience is that attentive.
Now we can actually talk about how the wood in a solid body affects the tone of the instrument, because at that point in the set it is NOT the pickups that control the tone. The wood matters, but the real secret is obviously the tone polka dots ;-)
Just one of many reasons that I’ve recently become a fan of playing on an ampless stage.
High Quality IEMs and a volume control on my hip just has so much more clarity than any combination of stage amps and cabs ever have or ever could.
And I am no longer making my hearing loss worse with every rehearsal and performance.
High Quality IEMs and a volume control on my hip just has so much more clarity than any combination of stage amps and cabs ever have or ever could.
And I am no longer making my hearing loss worse with every rehearsal and performance.
D
D
"Enter Sandman" at lounge act levels, just seems wrong
Yes, that's pretty much correct. When it gets really loud, I can play loud and I can hear what I'm playing because I have the gear for it. HOWEVER, typically when it gets really loud, the sound gets unbalanced and that sucks.
Was playing in a group that had two guitarists with very different styles of leads. One guy was always louder than the other, but when the second guy did his leads he could up his volume a bit and be heard fine as the other guitarist wasn't trying to out-volume him. However, when we got loud the second lead guitarists gear couldn't keep up with the first guitarist's amp and couldn't turn up enough to really be a good lead. Bad part of it was I needed to listen to his lead for the musical cue where I would change the bass line I was playing. I really DON"T like that.
I also am not a fan of it being too soft again because of balance of sound. When either of my groups do a sound check, I make a point of walking the perimeter of the place, walk through the tables and walk across the dance floor to check both the levels and the balance of sound. I really want that nice balance for not only ourselves, but even more importantly for our audience.
Most of the "learning songs" bit for me comes from playing along with the song on my computer. I use my Focusrite audio interface as the sound card on my computer and I keep my bass and my mic plugged in. It's a simple matter of adjusting levels to be able to hear my self well in the mix through my headphones. Then I can turn it up if I want to or turn it down much lower. Once I get the balance I never turn it low enough that I have to worry about the Fletcher-Munson curve and I can work on the song at whatever level I want to at the time.
And don't let "loud" be an excuse for sloppy playing. Just because you can't hear it well doesn't mean your audience can't. It may very well be perfectly clear to them and so will any mistakes you make while playing at those levels.
I recall back in 2019 when I got my DNS-210 cab (and my DNA Endorsing Artist status) and I wasn't sure it would be loud enough for this one venue. So I also brought my DNS-410 cab which I knew was more than loud enough and stacked my 210 on top of it. Figured I could unplug the 210 and plug in the 410 in a matter of seconds if needed. I went out and did my normal walk around using my wireless and we got the sound balanced nicely with good levels at all areas in the room. So no need to use the 410.
Then when we started playing, my 210 was way too close to my ears and was only about 3 feet behind me. It was painful. Yet I knew that was the level I needed to be at for this venue, so it was incumbent upon me to move my amp somewhere farther away. Of course it was a corner stage and I was on a shallow section of the pie wedge on stage left. Drummer was behind the back of my amp and I played the first song standing next to him. I ended up moving the rig twice with the final move putting our PA Mains off the stage and moving my amp to the left edge and to the front of the stage.
Then I could stand to stage right of my amp and back just enough to get out of its 60° cone of dispersion. Played with it in that position the rest of the night. I didn't sound as good to me when I moved to that position because I lost some of the highs, but heard my self clearly and well enough to play the rest of the night and it was no longer killing my ears.
Here's a shot of my rig that night before we started playing Only the 210 was plugged in and my 410 was relegated to being a $1,000 amp stand.
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I have developed tinnitus from too many years of playing with guitarists and drummers who are too loud.
I will never put up with that again. I listen to a constant reminder of that abuse 24/7.
Stick to your guns. Do not let anybody sway you. They are the ones being unprofessional. You’re doing the right thing.
Hey. I wasn't seriously even thinking about going that route, but now the guitarist and drummer in my prog band are wanting to make the jump to IEMs for rehearsals, at least. Quick question, if I may. Do you find any ear discomfort at all, with the level of the music being pumped directly into your ears from the IEMs? This is something that I've always wondered about.
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I struggled for a long time trying to get a rig that could compete with drums and guitars, I never seemed to have enough power until I got a very expensive rig. If I was still gigging not so much.. I was in classic hard rock, classic metal/ rock bands. seems like loud, to me is ok. Ear splitting crazy volume, no.
