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Is plugging a head into a power conditioner bad?

I hate this thread. There's so many mixed opinions

Not only opinions, but agendas as well. I'll bet that some definitions would help. It would be helpful if somebody would define just what, exactly, is in a "power conditioner". Is it an isolation transformer? R/C network? Magic dust?

Like someone said, the best thing you can do is buy an outlet tester for $5.00.

I wouldn't want a "glorified surge protector" that wasn't able to be re-set. Using a Furman with SMP (which is able to re-set), or any other "power conditioner" where the outlets are still hard-wired (through a protection device like an MOV) can't hurt anything, because they don't limit current. Of course, as someone else pointed out, if you mis-use it (by turning your amp on and off with it) you will cause damage. The better ones (they used to be cheaper, but so were Fenders) provide lights, a power strip, surge protection with a re-set button, and a common ground, which is the reason they reduce hum. Some supply a voltage reading, which is also helpful. IME, 15 amps is enough for most bars and restaurants, which usually only have 15-amp circuits anyway (at least the little dives I play at). Fortunately, that's all most amps need. And your rack plugs in and you're up and running in less than a minute, if that's important to you.

Major venues will have a sub-station of sorts to provide clean power for the stage and most top-flight mobile installations will also supply a regulated power source (but not with Furman single-space units).

The problems I've run into are usually outdoors where there isn't enough power coming to the "stage", or where the bar owner decided to have it wired by somebody to pay off a tab.

And that's when the outlet tester is your friend.
 
That depends on what an M8 is. If the M8 is a simple distribution strip w/surge protection and passive capacitive or twin-T power line filtering it won't bother your amp at all. It won't help either, as high quality amps already have that in them anyway. If it is a true active circuit power conditioner it might restrict current flow to your amp, and that's not a good thing.
Part of the problem is semantics. Until recently devices labeled as power conditioners actually contained active circuitry. But now the 'power conditioner' label seems to be applied to anything with a cord and a few outlets, so as with Mama Gump's box of chocolates you never know what you're going to get. A good guideline is the price. If it's 50 bucks or less it's not an active power conditioner, it's a power strip, and you should be OK.







This is a product description of the M8, which retails for $54





The Merit Series Furman M-8 Power Conditioner is the perfect low-cost AC power solution for any rackmount system. Its 8 switched AC outlets in the rear panel power and protect all your equipment with up to a 15-amp load.

The Furman M-8 protects your delicate electronic equipment by combining high voltage varistor (MOV) surge and transient suppressors. The fast-acting supression circuit quickly responds and clamps transient voltages to safe levels. An RFI/EMI interference filter works to prevent noise from fluorescent lights, certain dimmers, radio transmitters, and similar sources of electronic pollution from contaminating the AC line and from there, leaking into sensitive audio, video, or computer circuits. The Furman M-8 Power Conditioner is NRTL/TUV listed.

Furman M-8 Power Conditioner Features:

* Filtration of noise from radio frequencies and electromagnetic interference
* Standard level of surge suppression
* 8 rear panel outlets
* Sturdy one rack space design
* 15-amp capacity with circuit breaker
 
More specs for the M-8x:

Maximum Output Current: 15 amps

Line Cord: 6 ft., captive, 14 AWG, with 3-conductor Edison plug

Operating Voltage: 120VAC 60Hz

Spike Protection Mode: Line to neutral

Energy Dissipation: 170 joules

Peak Impulse Current: 12,000 amps

Maximum Continuous Opterating Voltage: 130 VAC RMS

Let Through Voltage (@ 125 amps, 8/20uS waveform): 400 volts

Noise Attenuation: Transverse mode: Greater than 23dB, 200Khz to 10 Mhz

Dimensions (HxWxD): 1.75 x 19 x 7.5 in.

Weight: 4.9 lbs.


So is it a power conditioner or a surge protector :eyebrow:
 
This is a product description of the M8, which retails for $54





The Merit Series Furman M-8 Power Conditioner is the perfect low-cost AC power solution for any rackmount system. Its 8 switched AC outlets in the rear panel power and protect all your equipment with up to a 15-amp load.

The Furman M-8 protects your delicate electronic equipment by combining high voltage varistor (MOV) surge and transient suppressors. The fast-acting supression circuit quickly responds and clamps transient voltages to safe levels. An RFI/EMI interference filter works to prevent noise from fluorescent lights, certain dimmers, radio transmitters, and similar sources of electronic pollution from contaminating the AC line and from there, leaking into sensitive audio, video, or computer circuits. The Furman M-8 Power Conditioner is NRTL/TUV listed.

Furman M-8 Power Conditioner Features:

* Filtration of noise from radio frequencies and electromagnetic interference
* Standard level of surge suppression
* 8 rear panel outlets
* Sturdy one rack space design
* 15-amp capacity with circuit breaker
For all the platitudes it is a power strip, not a conditioner. As for what's inside that provides the alleged 'conditioning', probably something like this:
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]
 
For all the platitudes it is a power strip, not a conditioner. As for what's inside that provides the alleged 'conditioning', probably something like this:
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]


So then it is NOT robbing my amp of power?


FWIW, I have no usable input on the argument for or against the use of a power conditioner. To me it's just a matter of convenience.
 
Also, ignore Bill Fitzmaurice. He makes speaker cabinets, which AFAIK never needed power conditioners and he cites Internet "experts". There are better arguments pro-conditioner.

No, actually there aren't.

Now - there are real power conditioners that work, but you aren't buying one for your amp unless you think a power conditioner that costs 3x your amp is a good investment.

--
Aaron (Electrical Engineer)
 
The head is a gk 800rb the power conditioner is a furman m8dx. I would have the head 2 9v power supplies one for a sansamp bddi and one possibly for a line 6 xds a korg dtr2000 and a 120vac fan.

As with anything else, it really depends...:hmm:

Depends on what the power is like where you are plugging into, depends on your amplifier, and it depends on the design of the power conditioner. The Genz Benz dude makes a great point about using a power conditioner as a master on/off switch - really not good. Bill and Jimmy have some good points too; those guys do have access to better setups than most guys see, my question to them is: Do you also have access to rooms that are wired properly initially? (It makes a difference).

The only way you can actually "hurt" an amplifier is if you are plugging into a power conditioner that has a current limiting design. Most power conditioners that are transformer-based designs limit current, and therefore limit the ability of your amplifiers output. Also, be aware that not every amp will benefit from a power conditioner.

I've tried a few amps with a few different conditioners on gigs and in rehearsals, and though it was not as scientific as a double blind test, all the musicians involved tended to hear the same things. There were a couple of amps that were not aided in the least by a power conditioner, a couple that there was a minor effect, (one good, one not), and one amp that really picked up noticeably when conditioned. You really need to try it out for yourself, and see what differences you notice.

The upside to a good conditioner? There should be excellent spike protection included, and it can/will benefit other devices that you plug in besides an amplifier. A good point - "If you can afford a real good power conditioner, you can afford a better amp". True, however, you can't plug your other stuff into your amp for AC, can you? BUT, how much does plugging in your wall wart adapter for your distortion pedal to a power conditioner actually help? :confused:

This is why - if possible - it always pays to try before you buy.

BTW, althoughy I understand the general spirit of the Audio Critic article, it's pretty subjective (also not entirely accurate). Oh, and I also use power conditioning frequently (not always) - And I make sure to plug the conditioner in with a 12 guage cord.

+/- $0.02 ;)
 
I've also had my equipment saved by a good Furman, it died my bass and p.a. gear didn't. The surge took out my guitar player's amp which was plugged directly into the wall. I always use one, and have had no negative results.

How do you prove that?
Does the furman has some indicator light that says it went into protect mode and saved all attached gear?

What went out the guitar player's amp?
Just the MOV or a fuse?

While I'd like to believe these things do anything more than a power strip with a MOV in it, the manufacturers don't even provide any proof. Couldn't they just simulate some conditions that are known to destroy gear and show proof their conditioners work?

Never mind - it's all hype. :ninja:
The majority of People will by nature believe word of mouth over science.
 
It's a fact that CDs are not sonically as good as records. Compression sucks the life out of pure audio's analog signal.

Sorry, but digital media have a much larger potential dynamic range than all but the absolutely most expensive analog studio media. Home analog media and playback equipment cannot touch digital in this respect. All the compression is dialed in by studio engineers and producers who are either looking for a particular sound, compressing to sound good over various broadcast channels or just don't take the effort to maximize the available dynamic range throughout the recording and mastering chains.

To tell the truth, I think it is very hard to find a combination of transducer (microphone, pickup etc.), preamp and acoustically/electrically quiet recording environment that can truly take advantage of the dynamic range that digital media offer.

Peace,
S
 

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