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Is there a ladies' forum?

#3
Well, there are a lot of issues if you think about it. I have owned basses that are completely not ergonomic in the body design (for women), or the weight is a problem. Then there are patronizing attitudes commonly encountered in different places. Technique can present problems, too: smaller, more slender hands means a lot of improvising; some basses rock on your hip more than others when slapping, etc, etc. I'll stop here.
 
#6
Precious said:
Well, there are a lot of issues if you think about it. I have owned basses that are completely not ergonomic in the body design (for women), or the weight is a problem. Then there are patronizing attitudes commonly encountered in different places. Technique can present problems, too: smaller, more slender hands means a lot of improvising; some basses rock on your hip more than others when slapping, etc, etc. I'll stop here.
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#

That's not a gender issue - I've met many really small guys who have small hands and struggle playing bass. I have also met 6 foot tall women playing Double Bass with ease, as well as those closer to 5 foot!

Patronising attitudes are everywhere - you can get patronised for pulling out a boutique 6(+)-string bass at a gig!! :hmm:
 
#8
I will keep my eye open for relevant threads, or start one. However, Bruce, you are still wrong in not recognizing issues specific to my gender, and I noticed you only addressed the points about hands and attitudes (men usually dismiss sexism, anyway). Ergonomics in bass design is no small issue. Many women, of a certain build, know what I mean. So you have kind of proved my point. A girls' network would be nice.
 
#9
Bruce Lindfield said:
#

That's not a gender issue - I've met many really small guys who have small hands and struggle playing bass.
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Actually, there are quite a few gender issues related to the bass:

Size: I've had several female DB students who were within an inch or so of five feet tall, and quite petite on top of that. It's all well and good for me to say "just do this" when I'm 6'2" with 76" wingspan and weigh 180 lbs, but to a person who's about 5' tall and 110 lbs, it's not quite the same thing. The reach - both in terms of hand size and arm length - has to be addressed with technical adjustments, and the strength must come from the trunk with a smaller person, or tendonitis is almost a certainty.

Build: Back when I used to teach BG, I had several female students whose anatomy clashed with their instruments and their posture. Imagine playing a heavy instrument which pressed against a very tender male region for several hours. At the very least, posture has to be adjusted, and in some cases, a more ergonomic instrument can be a godsend.

Attitudes: Let's face it - music (especially pop and jazz) is a very male dominated business, and there are a lot of stereotypes and preconceptions about female musicians. Try comparing the "Women bassists" thread in DB to the various "Bass Babes" threads in BG. The BG mode of thought is much more prevalent. I'm not so sure I'd like to be viewed as a piece of meat whose intrinsic value can only be measured by some sophomoric standard of "hotness" first, and then only secondarily as a musician. You can laugh that trend off if you want, but I believe it's very real, and have seen it far too often.

So in short, I think a permission-only "ladies forum" would be a great idea...kind of like the Lobby, only different. :)
 
#10
Chris Fitzgerald said:
So in short, I think a permission-only "ladies forum" would be a great idea...kind of like the Lobby, only different. :)
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true...permission-only and pretty-well moderated...not because of the girls, but just in case that a guy sneaks in and starts harassing the girls...being this is a virtual community i could just as easily choose "female" as "male" on the selection box, so some guy could easily slip through the cracks...just my thoughts :)
 
#12
I don't really think it's necessary to further divide the forums with a gender specific forum. It's no problem to start a specific thread, dealing with how a bass is incompatible with some body shape. I know how that is, because I don't play my bass so low anymore. It makes my gut stick out more, which bothers me. That, and my technique has changed quite a bit from those days too.

I am sure that the mods will also help keep an eye out so the thread doesn't get derailed too much.
 
#15
Chris Fitzgerald said:
Actually, there are quite a few gender issues related to the bass:

Size: I've had several female DB students who were within an inch or so of five feet tall, and quite petite on top of that. It's...
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But then I've seen young boys learning DB who are under 5 feet tall and comparatively weaker than a more mature woman - I don't see how this is a gender issue - it applies to all children learning DB!
 
#16
Chris Fitzgerald said:
Attitudes: Let's face it - music (especially pop and jazz) is a very male dominated business, and there are a lot of stereotypes and preconceptions about female musicians. Try comparing the "Women bassists" thread in DB to the various "Bass Babes" threads in BG. The BG mode of thought is much more prevalent. I'm not so sure I'd like to be viewed as a piece of meat whose intrinsic value can only be measured by some sophomoric standard of "hotness" first, and then only secondarily as a musician. You can laugh that trend off if you want, but I believe it's very real, and have seen it far too often.
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I agree with what you're saying - but I don't see how "Ghetto"-ising women is going to help? :confused:

Surely we want to be challenging the behaviour of men, pointing out how their attitudes are sexist, unreasonable etc. etc. at every occasion...

NOT - just sticking women in a corner and saying - now that's OK then!! :hmm:

I would see the aim as being that everyone is treated equally as a musician and not, as you say : a hot "piece of meat" !! :hmm:

But I don't see how sticking women in a corner and drawing attention to them, is going to help this? We need women to be integrated in the forums, unnoticed by gender, but rather as fully-accepted members of the community!

Not special cases - but accepted by all, on their merits as musicians.
 
#19
Precious said:
I will keep my eye open for relevant threads, or start one. However, Bruce, you are still wrong in not recognizing issues specific to my gender, and I noticed you only addressed the points about hands and attitudes (men usually dismiss sexism, anyway). Ergonomics in bass design is no small issue. Many women, of a certain build, know what I mean. So you have kind of proved my point. A girls' network would be nice.
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1. Welcome! :)
2. The idea of a Women's section has appeared before, and it usually brings the ornery out. :)
3. It's a completely valid idea.
4. Welcome again.
 

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