Issues With Re-Stringing EBMM Basses Using Strings With Thread Wrapped Ends.........

[Laredo]

...............Just wondering if anyone else ever had this issue??

I have noticed over the years that my EBMM basses do not take well when switching to thread wrapped string brands. EBMM strings are metal wound end to end, and they do not have this issue. Neither do other brands like DR............But there are times that I want a different brand string on my bass.

I have lost a few hundred dollars in strings over the years due to breakage. The thread wrapped string ends slip and break at the tuners on most of the EBMM basses that I have owned. I have found some fixes, but it has cost me money in strings to figure it out! :scowl:

Some Causes:

- The newer relief (notched) nut on the EBMM basses does not put as much friction on the string, especially if you use a nut lube product.
- The chrome tuners are very smooth and let the thread wrapped string slip under load (tune).
- Not sure if the 3-1 headstock has a different angle from the nut to the tuners than other basses?
- I had a Sterling with very sharp nut slots that broke strings under tension.

Some Cures:

- Do not use nut lube products when installing thread wrapped strings.
- Remove the tuners and use a Scotch Brite pad, or very fine sand paper, on the tuning peg area where the string goes. This will provide grip for the string cloth, and keep the rest of the tuner looking nice and shiny chrome.
- De-burr the tuner slots, by taking the sharp edges off with a small fret file.
- Clean the tuning pegs with alcohol before installing the strings to remove any guitar polish from the tuners.
- Use a small Vise-Grip (locking pliers) when getting close to final tuning specs. As you get close to tune, put the locking pliers on the tuning peg over the wound string. This will help keep the thread/cloth string ends from slipping under final load.

All this being said, I killed a new TI Power Bass set of strings on a Stingray this evening ............I had not re-strung an EBMM bass with thread end type strings in a while,and I got a little lazy. I did use the Vise Grip trick when getting into the final tuning stages of each string, but when I loosened the pliers, the D and G strings slipped. When I went to re-tune them, the slipped more and broke!

I just wanted to know if I am the only one that ever ran into this issue multiple times on EBMM basses? I have never had this happen on any other brand I have owned.

I also wanted to give some tips, in case it could help spare a fellow TB'er from losing some money, and a new set of strings!

 

[Gomeztool]

It must be something you do. I've been using Chromes on mine with no issues.

 

[SLaPiNFuNK]

I think you dont know how to properly string a bass.

You need to start cutting your strings much longer and letting them be inserted all the way into the tuner before you start wrapping them around the tuner. The first couple of rounds you could do by hand. Keep a slight amount of tension on the string while turning the tuning peg until the string can rest on its own in the saddle.

The string should wrap around the tuner a minimum of 3or 4 times, more for thr higher strings,

 

[FunkySpoo]

Never had any problem stringing my SR5 with any type of string.

 

[xxx666]

I think you dont know how to properly string a bass.

You need to start cutting your strings much longer and letting them be inserted all the way into the tuner before you start wrapping them around the tuner. The first couple of rounds you could do by hand. Keep a slight amount of tension on the string while turning the tuning peg until the string can rest on its own in the saddle.

The string should wrap around the tuner a minimum of 3or 4 times, more for thr higher strings,

+1

I recently bought a SR4 and did notice some obvious difference to re stringing my other basses - but following the above should fix your probs - dunno about attacking you tuners!

 

[jasper383]

I had this happen with a couple sets of Chromes on a SR4 a few years ago, and yes, I do know how to string a bass properly.

The G string would just start slipping, and once that starts, there is no way of ever getting it to tune to pitch.

I solved this by cutting the string extra long, inserting the string, and having it go over the top an extra time before wrapping on down the post.

 

[Laredo]

I had this happen with a couple sets of Chromes on a SR4 a few years ago, and yes, I do know how to string a bass properly.

The G string would just start slipping, and once that starts, there is no way of ever getting it to tune to pitch.

I solved this by cutting the string extra long, inserting the string, and having it go over the top an extra time before wrapping on down the post.

...........With "jasper383"............

I have been setting up guitars for a long time with no issues at all.
- I do leave the strings plenty long, sometimes almost too long.
- The bent end of the string that is inserted into the tuner peg is as long as possible.
- The brands of string that this has happened with are various Rotosound, and TI ones. Not sure if they are different from othe string brands with thread wrapped ends.
- If you have an older EBMM bass with "aged" tuners, or a standard straight nut, you may not have this issue at all. Older tuners usually provide plenty of surface grip for the string to bite on. I have found that the problem is only on newer EBMM basses with the notched nut, and new shiny chrome tuners.
- "jasper383" - I do not like the look of the "knotted" technique, so I try to avoid it, but I may have to use it in the future. I have seen other people wrapping the string over the top of itself, like a knot, to gain the extra grip.

Please don't judge the post, or comments that I make............If you knew me, you would not say that I do not know how to set up a guitar or bass. I am just wondering if I was the only one out there with issues regarding thread wrapped strings, and newer EBMM basses/tuners? I love the basses, but they are the only ones that ever gave me an issue with a re-string!

 

[SLaPiNFuNK]

Pic of tuners close up please?

 

[Laredo]

Pic of tuners close up please?

............After the TI Powerbass set broke, I ended up using a set of coated DR strings which are wound steel end to end. This type of string (no thread wrapped ends) has no issues at all.

I appreciate the offer to help though!

 

[stflbn]

I've never EVER had problems with any string types regarding the tuners on MM basses. Period.

I have no clue what-so-ever of what you're doing to cause string breakage.

Provide clear photo's of your tuners with strings on the bass and at correct tension. And o f the nut.

IMHO.


.

 

[Laredo]

I've never EVER had problems with any string types regarding the tuners on MM basses. Period.

I have no clue what-so-ever of what you're doing to cause string breakage.

Provide clear photo's of your tuners with strings on the bass and at correct tension. And o f the nut.

IMHO.


.

............A Sterling 4H, and a Stingray 4H. There is nothing out of the ordinary with the nut or tuners. The only issue I found was on the Sterling. The G string tuner slot was overly sharp with burrs on the edges. As I mentioned, the strings are wrapped correctly with ample length. The issue has only been with strings with thread wrapped ends.

I am using all metal strings now, mostly DR, or even EBMM, with no issues at all..............The only photo that I still have with thread wrapped string ends is a Sterling that I sold. It gave me the same problem, until I lightly scuffed the tuner peg surface area, then I could install the Rotosound BS 66 strings. You can't tell much from the photo, as it is a full length shot of the bass.

I am not looking for answers/fixes, as much as I was curious to see how many other Tb'ers ever had the same issue? Thanks!

 

[jlepre]

I only had that problem on the G string, but fixed it by putting a sort of knot around the peg of the first wind. Never had an issue since.

 

[Gomeztool]

I leave the A,D and G string factory length and only cut the E.

 

[JEDI BASS]

You're killing me :-D!! My curiosity is peaked.

First: nut material that is plastic, bone, etc isn't gonna cut a metal string no matter how rough it is. And I've never heard anyone make restringing sound so complicated. And I don't get how some slippage can render some strings useless.

Not trying to be offensive, but I've yet to break a string in over 20 years. Please show pics or go into detail so I can understand how you restring.

Thanks

 

[Laredo]

You're killing me :-D!! My curiosity is peaked.

First: nut material that is plastic, bone, etc isn't gonna cut a metal string no matter how rough it is. And I've never heard anyone make restringing sound so complicated. And I don't get how some slippage can render some strings useless.

Not trying to be offensive, bit I've yet to break a string in over 20 years. Please show pics or go into detail so I can understand how you restring.

Thanks

Apparently, people are "skimming" this thread and replying with emotion.............The nut is not the issue, however, the tuner peg edges can be sharp. The breaking comes from the tension causing thread wrapped strings to slip around the tuners. This is only on new late model EBMM basses with the new style nuts, and shiny chrome tuners..............

As I stated before, this is only a problem on some current/late model EBMM basses, ones that have been made in the past 5 years, or so...............I have been playing for more than 20 years myself, and this issue has only happened a few times, but only on these basses. I have owned more than 14 late model EBMM basses (produced in the last 5 years). I'm not sure how many you have owned?

 

[JEDI BASS]

No emotion other than curiosity , and no skimming either... read every word. And like I said, no offense was meant. You did mention nuts several times, and it sounded like you thought they could possibly be part of the problem, therefore I assumed a correlation to the breakage issue.

I've owned 2 Stingrays (1 new and one from mid '90s), and probably 40 or so other basses most of which have EBMM type tuners, even if they're not made by EB.

As a tinkerer and amateur builder/repairman I'm very curious for more info .

Thanks

 

[JEDI BASS]

That Sterling is PRETTY by the way! Is that tangerine?

 

[Laredo]

That Sterling is PRETTY by the way! Is that tangerine?

............They actually called it Desert Gold, it is now discontinued. I sold that one more than a year ago.

 

[Laredo]

No emotion other than curiosity , and no skimming either... read every word. And like I said, no offense was meant. You did mention nuts several times, and it sounded like you thought they could possibly be part of the problem, therefore I assumed a correlation to the breakage issue.
Thanks

I am just trying to figure out if anyone else ever had this happen, or is it just me. Sounds like I will just have to do the knot wrap around technique on the EBMM basses to be safe. I also have some other tricks, that I mentioned previously............

I did mention the new style EBMM nut several times, but not because it causes the string to break at the contact point. I feel like the new style EBMM "notched" relief type nuts may not offer as much drag as a straight traditional nut. Therefore, it would put more tension at the tuning peg, and the bridge. Sometimes the string sticks at the nut contact point, that is why the use of nut lube products, like Lizard Spit, are popular. This creates less hang-up, and more accurate tuning. The newer EBMM nuts seem to offer less resistance to help hold the string in place. If you combine that with nut lube, all the string tension is transferred to the tuning peg and bridge. Then if your thread wrapped strings are already having a hard time gripping the tuner, there is even more force on the end of the strings.............

 

[stflbn]

"Some Causes:
- The newer relief (notched) nut on the EBMM basses does not put as much friction on the string, especially if you use a nut lube product."


"Some Cures:
- Do not use nut lube products when installing thread wrapped strings."


Pretty blatently mentions nut issues.

Clamping Vise Grips onto the strings at the Tuners IMHO would potentially put a hard crimp in the strings and "potentially" create a weak spot at that point... which the person doing it would create.

I still just do not see how the string is going to repeatedly slip "then" break or move if simply bent (not crimped with pliers) and inserted into the Tuner slot, and then the string given 2 or 3 turns around the Tuning peg. Turning the strings from top of the tuner to bottom.



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