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Lemons (warning: G&L rant)

Kind blows my mind that people are ganging up on the OP.

1) him sanding down the neck doesn't affect the neck fit.. hes not bitching that the wood was too soft and he took so much off or something, so ????

2) Saying that "you took apart a perfectly functioning bass". I mean, if your riding a bike thats held together by ducktape... and you take off the tape... is it really perfectly functioning? or broken and held up by tape!?

All this to say it is a lower end bass, its not like its a G&L custom shop, but i dont think its unreasonable to expect a proper neck fit.
 
What happened before is water under the bridge. Ignore these detractors.

Start by getting a good aluminum straight edge. Make sure the neck is straight and then measure where the neck slope comes out at the bridge, and (OMG!) use math to figure out exactly how much shimming to do. Get a good wood shim from stewmac and reassemble the bass. Ted Woodford has several videos on YT where he does this for acoustic guitars, where it pretty much has to be right the first time.
 
Do your neck screws pass through their body holes without having to turn them? If not it would help a lot if they did. Be careful if you decide to drill the holes as they can get too big in a hurry. I usually just tap the screws through, unscrew them, tap them back through, and repeat until you can push and pull the screws through their body holes. I ran into this a lot on MIM J basses when I was fooling with them and doing it made a big difference in how easy it was to get a good setup.
Oh and BTW, I don't know anything about G&L necks, but Warmoth will not warranty their necks if they are left unfinished.
 
Until you've worked the returns desk at a public library you have no idea of "nasty little surprises."

I see your public library example, and I cite as example "cleaning and repairing brass and woodwind instruments for public schools" ... maggots, dead mice, materials used for ALL types of personal hygiene, you name it we found it :D
 
What happened before is water under the bridge. Ignore these detractors.

Start by getting a good aluminum straight edge. Make sure the neck is straight and then measure where the neck slope comes out at the bridge, and (OMG!) use math to figure out exactly how much shimming to do. Get a good wood shim from stewmac and reassemble the bass. Ted Woodford has several videos on YT where he does this for acoustic guitars, where it pretty much has to be right the first time.
This is the answer. However I would buy a three shim set from Ali express, put the 0.25 degree shim in place, check with the ruler, and if the strings can’t go that low, go up to 0.5; etc.

£4.09 | 3 Pcs Electric Guitar Neck Shims Maple Plate 0.25 0.5 1 Degree
https://a.aliexpress.com/_EytPwWD
 
It played fine before you removed the shim, so it should be possible to play fine once again.

Bring it to a good guitar tech or luthier and let them give it a shot.

And: What happened here is not correctly expressed in the title of this thread, it is misleading in at least one way.
 
I've seen LOTS of basses with factory installed shims, including expensive Fenders (like the highly regarded AVRI series). Sandpaper is not unusual, although thin pieces of cardboard (like business cards) are more commonly seen. Personally I prefer using tapered wooden shims that cover the entire neck pocket (you can even get them pre-made from StewMac) but I've never seen that used as a factory shim.

Depending on the above, the bridge saddles are either too high or cannot be lowered enough to get the correct string height because they hit the bottom of the bridge cavity.

This should only be a matter of using a shim with the right thickness. Is the problem perhaps that the strings on one side of the neck won't get high enough while the strings on the other side can't be lowered enough? You mentioned that one end of the sandpaper was folded onto itself, which suggests that the neck might need a "sideways" shim as well as a backwards tilt. While this isn't exactly impressive craftsmanship/QC from G&L it should be possible to deal with. Especially if it worked fine with the factory shim. If the saddles can't be lowered enough, start with a thin shim, like a piece of a business card. Still not low enough on ANY of the strings? Add another layer of the same thickness. If you reach a point where only one side of the bridge/saddles can't be lowered enough, add another thin shim on ONLY that side of the neck pocket. Maybe even shim the entire length of that side of the neck pocket, so you basically end up with an L-shaped shim. I've both seen and used this on a several occasions. It's not very common, and shouldn't be necessary on a properly made guitar, but it if works...

When I am able to get it close, I'm getting a lot of clank and string noise.

On ALL strings or just some of them? If it's mainly one "side" of the strings, like either D-G or E-A, see above. If it's ALL the strings it could just be a setup issue (neck relief and/or saddle heights). It could also be something worse... You bass may have developed a "ski jump", although this should happen gradually over time, not suddenly if a shim falls out. There are two separate issues that I (probably incorrectly) refer to as a ski jump. One is the "kink" that can happen near the start of the neck joint on bolt-on basses (I guess this is what's normally referred to as a "ski jump"). The other is a disfiguring near the end of the fretboard that I suspect MIGHT be caused, over time, by shims that aren't full-pocket, tapered shims. I know lots of people will say that shims deforming the end of the fretboard is just a myth but I've seen this happen on far too many shimmed basses to dismiss it as a coincidence. Does it look like the fretboard has an upwards "bump" near the end of the fretboard? This could certainly cause fret buzz, or even "clank" because you slam the strings into the last fret when playing (particularly if you're playing fingerstyle close to the neck). Sometimes this can be fixed simply by leveling the upper frets, although the "correct" way to deal with it is to remove the frets and level the fretboard itself. However, both these "ski jump" scenarios happen gradually over time, not suddenly if you remove the neck and lose a shim. I suspect you bass simply has a poorly made neck pocket (which can almost certainly be fixed with a shim) rather than a "ski jump". Of course it could also be something else entirely, like a fret that has popped up a bit somewhere, causing fret buzz. But again: This seems highly unlikely if the problem occurred suddenly after losing the sandpaper shim. I strongly suspect this is just a matter of shimming the neck right, possible by using a "sideways" shim in addition to a "neck tilt" shim.

I cannot get the intonation set. Every string is sharp to some degree no matter how far I move each saddle away from the nut.

I guess this can happen to a certain degree if the action is sky high but too sharp on ALL the strings no matter how far back you move each saddle? That shouldn't happen unless the action is crazy high! If the Chromes are only two years old, and intonated perfectly before you lost the sandpaper shim, I think we can probably rule out a problem with both the strings and the position of the bridge. You probably know this already, but just to make sure: You're not checking the intonation on EVERY fret, are you? A bass can never be intonated perfectly in every fret. That's physically impossible (unless you get one of those true temperament guitars with curved frets, that sound more like a synth playing a guitar patch than a real guitar IMO...). If the 12th fret is intonated it's ok.

I'm not sure if this is helpful at all but I honestly don't see any reason why you shouldn't be able to fix this, unless something else has happened in addition to the sandpaper shim falling out. And if you can't fix it yourself I'm pretty sure a luthier (or an experienced guitar tech) should be able to sort this out within an hour or so. If the bass NEVER worked properly it would have been a different matter of course.
 
I see your public library example, and I cite as example "cleaning and repairing brass and woodwind instruments for public schools" ... maggots, dead mice, materials used for ALL types of personal hygiene, you name it we found it :D
It reminds me of the book 'American ramble' where the guy visits a landfill. In the office of the boss runnning it there is a sign: 'If we don't have it, it doesn't exist!'
 
SharpCat has the right idea, I think. If you work it out geometrically you will see that a small adjustment at the neck heel is multiplied many times at the nut end.

As a machinist and a diemaker during my career I encountered shims and things that needed shimming frequently. And yes O.P., if you're wondering if an old pro like me has ever thrown out a shim without measuring it, and later regretted it, I've done it a few times. Shimming is part calculation, part guesswork, part precision measurement, and a bunch of trial and error. Depending on the accuracy you're looking for, many attempts may be necessary.

I've seldom had the good luck of finding exactly the right thickness of material handy. Often you have to stack more than one layer, and often the fine tuning part ends up with your using thin shim stock, down to .005" or so. It's not as simple as some think. God knows how much trouble it was for the last guy who shimmed it. How many tries before he got it right?

I'd also suggest a hard material like plastic or brass, which is easy to work and comes in a large variety of types and thicknesses. Metal or plastic won't compress like card stock does, though I'm reflecting my personal experience rather than conventional wisdom. Also make sure your neck is fully seated and the screws fully tight, and your strings are tuned up to pitch before you decide your latest shim is good or not,

There's more to it than that, but the basics should give you a good start.

Good luck.

Tom
 
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Kind blows my mind that people are ganging up on the OP.

1) him sanding down the neck doesn't affect the neck fit.. hes not bitching that the wood was too soft and he took so much off or something, so ????

2) Saying that "you took apart a perfectly functioning bass". I mean, if your riding a bike thats held together by ducktape... and you take off the tape... is it really perfectly functioning? or broken and held up by tape!?

All this to say it is a lower end bass, its not like its a G&L custom shop, but i dont think its unreasonable to expect a proper neck fit.
Thank you. This is exactly my point.

A bass that can only be functional due to a piece of sandpaper in the neck pocket, was not and is not a properly made nor a properly functioning instrument. It is the equivalent of a bike held together by duct tape. Taking the neck off and disposing of the sandpaper exposed a very big underlying flaw that is difficult to correct even when another piece of paper is placed back in the same location.
 
If the bass was able to be setup before, it can be set up again. My guess is that something is being overlooked. If the neck is properly back in the pocket and sitting on a shim as it was before, then the neck-body geometry would be the same as it was before and it would be possible to get the same setup.

Some questions:

What are the shim thicknesses you are using? My first guess is that you are not using the correct thickness if the neck is sitting properly down in the joint. If it is too high with one shim and too low with another, then you need a shim with a thickness in between. Do you have a set of calipers to measure the shims? A little can go a long was as the shim thickness will correspond to a proportionally larger change in neck plane height at the bridge.

How much travel is there in the height of the saddles? Usually this style of bridge has quite a bit of vertical travel, so there's a pretty wide range you can get the neck plane set to and still adjust the saddle height to work.

What is the clanking sound from? Surely that can be diagnosed. Are the strings hitting something? Is it the truss rod or something else?

Is it possible that when you're putting the neck back on it's somehow now sitting down in the pocket properly? It would be difficult to tell what's happening at the front of the pocket if something was preventing it from seating at the bottom.

People here can calculate the shim height that you need if you can provide six measurements. They must be precise.

Put the neck in without a shim, lay a straight edge onto the frets and measure the height above the body right at the front of the bridge.

Measure the saddle height above body at the top and bottom of travel.

Measure the length of the neck pocket.

Measure the distance from the front of the neck pocket (bridge side) to the saddles.

Measure the distance from the back of the neck pocket to the shim location.
 
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I've seen LOTS of basses with factory installed shims, including expensive Fenders (like the highly regarded AVRI series). Sandpaper is not unusual, although thin pieces of cardboard (like business cards) are more commonly seen. Personally I prefer using tapered wooden shims that cover the entire neck pocket (you can even get them pre-made from StewMac) but I've never seen that used as a factory shim.



This should only be a matter of using a shim with the right thickness. Is the problem perhaps that the strings on one side of the neck won't get high enough while the strings on the other side can't be lowered enough? You mentioned that one end of the sandpaper was folded onto itself, which suggests that the neck might need a "sideways" shim as well as a backwards tilt. While this isn't exactly impressive craftsmanship/QC from G&L it should be possible to deal with. Especially if it worked fine with the factory shim. If the saddles can't be lowered enough, start with a thin shim, like a piece of a business card. Still not low enough on ANY of the strings? Add another layer of the same thickness. If you reach a point where only one side of the bridge/saddles can't be lowered enough, add another thin shim on ONLY that side of the neck pocket. Maybe even shim the entire length of that side of the neck pocket, so you basically end up with an L-shaped shim. I've both seen and used this on a several occasions. It's not very common, and shouldn't be necessary on a properly made guitar, but it if works...



On ALL strings or just some of them? If it's mainly one "side" of the strings, like either D-G or E-A, see above. If it's ALL the strings it could just be a setup issue (neck relief and/or saddle heights). It could also be something worse... You bass may have developed a "ski jump", although this should happen gradually over time, not suddenly if a shim falls out. There are two separate issues that I (probably incorrectly) refer to as a ski jump. One is the "kink" that can happen near the start of the neck joint on bolt-on basses (I guess this is what's normally referred to as a "ski jump"). The other is a disfiguring near the end of the fretboard that I suspect MIGHT be caused, over time, by shims that aren't full-pocket, tapered shims. I know lots of people will say that shims deforming the end of the fretboard is just a myth but I've seen this happen on far too many shimmed basses to dismiss it as a coincidence. Does it look like the fretboard has an upwards "bump" near the end of the fretboard? This could certainly cause fret buzz, or even "clank" because you slam the strings into the last fret when playing (particularly if you're playing fingerstyle close to the neck). Sometimes this can be fixed simply by leveling the upper frets, although the "correct" way to deal with it is to remove the frets and level the fretboard itself. However, both these "ski jump" scenarios happen gradually over time, not suddenly if you remove the neck and lose a shim. I suspect you bass simply has a poorly made neck pocket (which can almost certainly be fixed with a shim) rather than a "ski jump". Of course it could also be something else entirely, like a fret that has popped up a bit somewhere, causing fret buzz. But again: This seems highly unlikely if the problem occurred suddenly after losing the sandpaper shim. I strongly suspect this is just a matter of shimming the neck right, possible by using a "sideways" shim in addition to a "neck tilt" shim.



I guess this can happen to a certain degree if the action is sky high but too sharp on ALL the strings no matter how far back you move each saddle? That shouldn't happen unless the action is crazy high! If the Chromes are only two years old, and intonated perfectly before you lost the sandpaper shim, I think we can probably rule out a problem with both the strings and the position of the bridge. You probably know this already, but just to make sure: You're not checking the intonation on EVERY fret, are you? A bass can never be intonated perfectly in every fret. That's physically impossible (unless you get one of those true temperament guitars with curved frets, that sound more like a synth playing a guitar patch than a real guitar IMO...). If the 12th fret is intonated it's ok.

I'm not sure if this is helpful at all but I honestly don't see any reason why you shouldn't be able to fix this, unless something else has happened in addition to the sandpaper shim falling out. And if you can't fix it yourself I'm pretty sure a luthier (or an experienced guitar tech) should be able to sort this out within an hour or so. If the bass NEVER worked properly it would have been a different matter of course.
Thanks for taking the time to reply with such detailed suggestions!

Part of my frustration comes from the fact that I have already tried most of them, to no avail. I've tried shims made of different materials (wood, paper, metal), shims of different dimensions (length, width, thickness), and even different locations in the neck pocket. I tried a piece of sandpaper approximately the same size as the original, placed in the same location. I tried shims that are similar to the original (a strip) vs. shims that fill the entire pocket. I have been extremely systematic in my approach.

You mention: "It's not very common, and shouldn't be necessary on a properly made guitar, but it if works...". This is where the vast majority of frustration is coming from. Another person wrote that this is equivalent to a bike that is held together by duct tape. If the duct tape is removed and the bike no longer works, but only worked because of the tape - was it ever really a functional bike to begin with?

I may have to take it to a tech or luthier.
 
Well according to the OP- any bass with a shim is like the bike with tape... but others here with much more experience say that shimming is common- so that implies, according to the OP, that most basses are not well made- ridiculous to say the least.
But without measuring tools and a quasi-scientific approach, this bass will never be right again....