Line 6 HX Effects

[smeet]

Aftershock has optional true bypass, didn't notice any tone change. Is yours set to be in true or buffered bypass?

I don’t know, I’ll have to check tonight. I just got the Aftershock, so I don’t know too much about it yet. I’m getting a noticeable loss of highs through it, which surprises me. I would not have expected that from an SA pedal, in either bypass mode.

 

[JustSomeDude]

I'm sure some (or all) knew this but I accidentally discovered a little trick yesterday. Was using my HX Effects at church and went to make a block adjustment via hands-free editing. I also happened to be using my expression controller assigned as a volume pedal, and I went to adjust a parameter on a block.

Turns out the expression adjusts the parameter you have selected in this edit mode instead of controlling whatever it's assigned to in the preset. Could've been bad as I was playing live, but fortunately I wasn't messing with anything that had any consequences in that moment. Good to know though! Makes for faster on-the-fly adjustment if needed.

I've been meaning to get good at this

 

[Chace90]

I've been meaning to get good at this

Ha! Pretty sure I watched that at some point in the past too, so I should've known. Regardless, handy feature though I sorta wish you could toggle that ability on/off per preset. I was doing delay swells at the moment I was adjusting something, which is how I discovered that feature. If I had been adjusting the feedback or mix, it could've gotten messy real fast!

 

[gregmon79]

I don’t know, I’ll have to check tonight. I just got the Aftershock, so I don’t know too much about it yet. I’m getting a noticeable loss of highs through it, which surprises me. I would not have expected that from an SA pedal, in either bypass mode.

What do you think of it otherwise? The dirt sounds. Always curious about that one. Almost moved on one a few times.

That kinda sucks about the bypass. Wonder of something's wrong with it.

 

[Chace90]

I don’t know, I’ll have to check tonight. I just got the Aftershock, so I don’t know too much about it yet. I’m getting a noticeable loss of highs through it, which surprises me. I would not have expected that from an SA pedal, in either bypass mode.

I have the SA Aftershock, don't recall any of these issues. A quick aside to check the 2 cables that are going in/out of it, sometimes a bad ground can cause pops like that too. It's a digital pedal so it should definitely be isolated on your power supply and getting the proper voltage and current. If you can, do a backup & reset of that thing and wire it up by itself with cables you know are good. Make sure there are no issues with the pedal first.

Do you toggle the Aftershock loop with any other effects simultaneously? There's several ways around the issue. The first would be to assign that loop to the same switch as another block/effect that you use in conjunction or opposite it. If you have the SA hub, you could send a MIDI command to turn the pedal off, though I would think it would still pop this way.

Assuming you're doing 1 switch per block, you could always get a momentary switch or MIDI controller to gain access to the 3 blocks you can't access while in stomp mode.

Which makes me think, wouldn't it be cool if you could change the functionality of tapping MODE and TAP simultaneously to show the 3 other "hidden" blocks instead of toggling analog/DSP bypass? Bet they could address that in firmware, assuming there was demand for such a feature. I personally don't ever use analog/DSP bypass myself, but that's just me.

 

[bassophile]

I don’t know, I’ll have to check tonight. I just got the Aftershock, so I don’t know too much about it yet. I’m getting a noticeable loss of highs through it, which surprises me. I would not have expected that from an SA pedal, in either bypass mode.

Both bypass types should be pretty much transparent. You can select it using Neuro mobile or desktop app.
Also check Send/Return signal type whether it is line or instrument and how that interact with pedal.

 

[parapentep70]

They might be more authentic with regards to component modelling and such, but I think they set the input gain too high on some of the fuzzes, enough to render them unusable for me.



Seems I'm not the only one, but I do notice we were both using Native, which is going to be very dependent on how you're setting up your input gain on your interface. The actual hardware Helix probably has the gain fixed at a much lower level that one might typically set when recording direct into an interface.

Hi,

True, I use Native to quickly assess things like frequency response or point to start distortion. But I also have a full Helix. In the last weeks I am keeping the input of my interface (EMU 1616 with instrument input) adjusted so that certain blocks (typ. SVT / Obsidian) start distorting at exactly the same point in both Native and the floor unit. Doing so both Native and the floor unit behave the same... if impedance is kept at 1 MOhm.

It is very true that if I use the real floor unit AND one of the passive basses AND I force the low input impedance in the floor unit (by placing a fuzz at the input or more usually adjusting it manually), then the gain is significantly lower in the floor unit while it remains unchanged in Native. I learnt this in the forum.

Anyway I do not like some of the fuzzes because they require a drastic reduction in gain and they become very noisy, many have high pass filters at high frequencies and others have a very special distortion ("rectifying" distortion) so they don't let the fundamental to pass to the output. At this moment, using Native I understood why some fuzzes are not usable (at least for me) with bass guitar.

 

[Dade8283]

Your sensitivity settings sound about right, given the super hot output of your bass. My other initial thoughts are that 1) a little more compression would probably help balance out string to string sound, but 2) What's your setup like? It sounds like the two high strings might be further away from the pickups that the low strings. Has that bass had a good professional tuneup in a while if you're not a DIY setup/action guy? That might account for the difference, when one set of settings works for the high strings vs. low strings.

What are the other settings you ended up with for the Auto Filter? Maybe I can help troubleshoot a little bit. A level of +6dB does sound a little weird. If I had a +6dB boost, the sound guys my band works with would panic and probably hit the mute button. lol

5sg.

1.) yup, I need to play more with the comp but I’m not much of a compressor fan, allthough I probably need one.

2.) I’ve messed a LOT with the pickups on that bass. Those mfds have insane HIGH output. It seems really balanced volume vice, but My ears could of course be wrong. Any way to measure the string to string output besides using your ears?

3.) my settings are pretty much exactly as in the post i quoted besides having the sensitivity a bit lower and the Gain at 3.6 db. Having to boost the level to +6db for unity with clean signal seems off. I tried turning up the gain but soon run into clipping/overdrive. I’m thinking that maybe I’m drivning the filter input to hard? I have nothing boosting it before in the signal.

 

[aledeville]

I have a feeling these are fine to power the HX with as long as you aren’t powering many other things off the supply. Which sorta defeats the purpose of having a power supply like that imo. Unless you really only need to power a couple other low ma drawings pedals with it.

Now that you say it, it matches what I discovered. At first I only had the HX and the Mesa Subway Preamp connected to the Ojai and it kind of worked. Then the StageClix Wireless Unit, which runs properly with about 250mA. The issues only arose after using it. The weird thing is that at first it worked but then it wouldn't even boot.

I'd need to power the Stomp, a Cali76 Compact Bass (18V voltage doubler cable and about 100mAh), a Darkglass AOU (110mAh) and VMT (bugger all, like 50mAh). I think my Polytune might get turfed if the Stomp tuner is good. I feel like I'll be cutting it fine...

It's all just theoretical. Theoretically the Ojai should power it, if the 1000mA is a sufficient amount of power.

@gregmon79
A normal TrueTone OneSpot? The one with 9V/1700mA? Is the jack fitting? Because of the bloody 2.5mm...

 

[gregmon79]

Now that you say it, it matches what I discovered. At first I only had the HX and the Mesa Subway Preamp connected to the Ojai and it kind of worked. Then the StageClix Wireless Unit, which runs properly with about 250mA. The issues only arose after using it. The weird thing is that at first it worked but then it wouldn't even boot.

It's all just theoretical. Theoretically the Ojai should power it, if the 1000mA is a sufficient amount of power.

@gregmon79
A normal TrueTone OneSpot? The one with 9V/1700mA? Is the jack fitting? Because of the bloody 2.5mm...

Yeah my HX ran fine for about a week off the Truetone CS7, then all the sudden it would just shut off. That happened like 4 times. That's when I decided to just use the supplied L6 supply.

Yep. Just the regular ol' 1spot wall wart. But I do use the 2 other adapter plugs with it. The red and green one. So I think it's the voltage doubler, the red one, then the 2.5mm is the green ones. I think that's how it works. But yeah, with the 1spot and those 2 adapter plugs it's worked fine for me so far when it's just the HX. Sometimes I'm at home and just want to mess with the HX. So I'll take it off my board and use the 1spot that way.

 

[aledeville]

Voltage doubler? 18V?

 

[gregmon79]

Voltage doubler? 18V?

No no! Sorry. Idk what the red plug is. An inverter maybe? Oh, they are reverse polarity plugs. NOT voltage doublers.

 

[fivestringgecko]

1.) yup, I need to play more with the comp but I’m not much of a compressor fan, allthough I probably need one.

2.) I’ve messed a LOT with the pickups on that bass. Those mfds have insane HIGH output. It seems really balanced volume vice, but My ears could of course be wrong. Any way to measure the string to string output besides using your ears?

3.) my settings are pretty much exactly as in the post i quoted besides having the sensitivity a bit lower and the Gain at 3.6 db. Having to boost the level to +6db for unity with clean signal seems off. I tried turning up the gain but soon run into clipping/overdrive. I’m thinking that maybe I’m drivning the filter input to hard? I have nothing boosting it before in the signal.

I had a love/hate relationship with compressors for a long time... as in, I loved to hate them. Once I got the Symmetry, I was able to FINALLY wrap my head around how to best use a compressor. Might be worth some further exploration, as compressors can help with a wide variety of things.

Aside from getting your bass to a PC and seeing the visual representation of the waveform when you record, I can't think of any other ways to measure individual string output. Even then, it's a ballpark solution at best to the best of my knowledge, because that beefy low E is going to have more mass and frequency output than a G string. But, it might be helpful to further understand your bass. I did that when I replaced the pickups in my Jazz V, and found that there was a much thicker low end. (see illustrations below). Those pickups in your G&L may just have more low end than you actually realize, or that you can necessarily hear. I know the Quarter Pounders did. If you're hitting the Effects that hard, it may account for the problem you're having. Do you have another bass you can try?

Possible solutions for people having the same problem as Dade:
1) You could add a compression block before the filter, set it with higher compression settings than you normally use to squish your sound more than you normally would, and program it to the same footswitch as the Auto Filter. That way you can have your normal tone when the Auto Filter/Compressor combo is off, and the extra compression when the AF is on.
2) You could also try adding a 10-band EQ block before the Auto Filter. Then try dialing down one frequency point at a time to see where the trouble spot(s) are. Could be that your upper mids just need a little help, or could be that there's some serious low end in there that you don't know about from those pickups. You could also use the EQ block in combo with the Auto Filter as well... Program the EQ to only be on when the filter is, and goose the frequencies that need help.

Not sure about the +6dB boost, but if it works, that's what the setting is in there for. I just suspect there's something going on with how hot your signal is. Do you have trouble with signal based effects, like dirt?

5sg.


Stock Fender MIA pickups:

Seymour Duncan Quarter Pounders:
(Note the much increased low end frequencies)

 

[Dade8283]

I had a love/hate relationship with compressors for a long time... as in, I loved to hate them. Once I got the Symmetry, I was able to FINALLY wrap my head around how to best use a compressor. Might be worth some further exploration, as compressors can help with a wide variety of things.

Aside from getting your bass to a PC and seeing the visual representation of the waveform when you record, I can't think of any other ways to measure individual string output. Even then, it's a ballpark solution at best to the best of my knowledge, because that beefy low E is going to have more mass and frequency output than a G string. But, it might be helpful to further understand your bass. I did that when I replaced the pickups in my Jazz V, and found that there was a much thicker low end. (see illustrations below). Those pickups in your G&L may just have more low end than you actually realize, or that you can necessarily hear. I know the Quarter Pounders did. If you're hitting the Effects that hard, it may account for the problem you're having. Do you have another bass you can try?

Possible solutions for people having the same problem as Dade:
1) You could add a compression block before the filter, set it with higher compression settings than you normally use to squish your sound more than you normally would, and program it to the same footswitch as the Auto Filter. That way you can have your normal tone when the Auto Filter/Compressor combo is off, and the extra compression when the AF is on.
2) You could also try adding a 10-band EQ block before the Auto Filter. Then try dialing down one frequency point at a time to see where the trouble spot(s) are. Could be that your upper mids just need a little help, or could be that there's some serious low end in there that you don't know about from those pickups. You could also use the EQ block in combo with the Auto Filter as well... Program the EQ to only be on when the filter is, and goose the frequencies that need help.

Not sure about the +6dB boost, but if it works, that's what the setting is in there for. I just suspect there's something going on with how hot your signal is. Do you have trouble with signal based effects, like dirt?

5sg.


Stock Fender MIA pickups:
View attachment 3182223

Seymour Duncan Quarter Pounders:
(Note the much increased low end frequencies)
View attachment 3182225

Thank you so much for taking the time tryinh to help me!

1.) yes I will have to dig deeper into compressors and how to get them to work for my sound. I find the Helix comps to be a bit hard to set when you really can’t tell how much you are compressing the signal. Signal meter/level on the comps would be great!

2.) will experiment more with eqs before the filter to lower some freq or just lowering the gain in general with a gain block.

The G&L L2000 doesn’t allways play nice with overdrive/dist/fuzz. This seems to be well known here on Talkbass. I’ve read several posts about their high output. A lot of people seem to run them with the volume backed off a bit and the bass/treble pots turned down a bit aswell (cut only). I prefer my volume at full but allways turn down the treble/bass a bit. My pickups are lower than What the old manual recommends, but might be time to experiment some more due to the hot signal overpowering filters and other signal sensitive blocks in the Helix. I allways have to run the gain pretty low on stuff...

 

[Chace90]

Thank you so much for taking the time tryinh to help me!

1.) yes I will have to dig deeper into compressors and how to get them to work for my sound. I find the Helix comps to be a bit hard to set when you really can’t tell how much you are compressing the signal. Signal meter/level on the comps would be great!

2.) will experiment more with eqs before the filter to lower some freq or just lowering the gain in general with a gain block.

The G&L L2000 doesn’t allways play nice with overdrive/dist/fuzz. This seems to be well known here on Talkbass. I’ve read several posts about their high output. A lot of people seem to run them with the volume backed off a bit and the bass/treble pots turned down a bit aswell (cut only). I prefer my volume at full but allways turn down the treble/bass a bit. My pickups are lower than What the old manual recommends, but might be time to experiment some more due to the hot signal overpowering filters and other signal sensitive blocks in the Helix. I allways have to run the gain pretty low on stuff...

Assuming you're running the HX Effects and don't need to have all 9 blocks occupied on every preset, you could always run a block first thing in the chain that just simply pulls your input gain down. Not sure which block would be most appropriate for this, but I'm sure there's many options that would work and use very little DSP.

 

[Dade8283]

Assuming you're running the HX Effects and don't need to have all 9 blocks occupied on every preset, you could always run a block first thing in the chain that just simply pulls your input gain down. Not sure which block would be most appropriate for this, but I'm sure there's many options that would work and use very little DSP.

Good tip. I’ve tried that briefly before using the mono gain block, but might revisit. I’m running the full Helix so really don’t have to worry as much about how many blocks are being used. I’m also pading the input (i think it’s a -6db pad) and that helps things out a lot.

 

[Chace90]

So I finally downloaded some IRs from 3 Sigma the other day. I purchased the Aguilar and Ampeg 8x10s. I have a regular church gig that is in-ears only. I run direct off my board. Decided it was time to try some "modeling." My chain was basically this:

Bass --> Cali76 comp (always on) --> Obsidian 7000 (always on, no dist) --> IR block --> DI out

I had some very light EQ on the Obsidian dialed in for a bit more detail in the low and high mids. I think about 1.5db bump at 500hz and 1.5khz, and my passive tone on the bass rolled off about 50%. Then I had the IR set for 50% mix of "direct" and IR.

I really felt the bass sat a lot better in the mix, at least in my in-ears. Couldn't say for the house sound as I never really get to hear that. I've always been the type to set my amp flat and try to let my bass and fingers provide the tone as much as possible, but having the IR certainly helped in this case.

A word of warning for would-be IR experimenters. Be careful with the level control. I found when I added the IR block, it's automatically set to -18db, and there's a reason for that. I set the mix where I liked it and then adjusted the level to be about the same as when the IR block was bypassed, which ended up back at -18db.

HX Effects just keeps on giving!

 

[MascisMan]

I have those IRs and like them as well. My favorite of the 3Sigmas is the Mega Bass Custom. Also, the Acoustic 810 one is good

 

[smeet]

So the SA loop is always on currently? Nothing else in the loop with it?[/QUOTE

What do you think of it otherwise? The dirt sounds. Always curious about that one. Almost moved on one a few times.

That kinda sucks about the bypass. Wonder of something's wrong with it.

I haven’t had a chance to get into the Aftershock yet. I found one sound I really like and didn’t have time to mess with it any more.
Hopefully this weekend.

So right now in my very time-limited life I’m trying to learn the HX, Aftershock, and Future Impact. Along with fitting them together with my Cali76 CB. I’m hoping this will be my do-everything board.
I wish the send-return was a single block, so I could swap pedal order in my presets.

 

[Chace90]

I haven’t had a chance to get into the Aftershock yet. I found one sound I really like and didn’t have time to mess with it any more.
Hopefully this weekend.

So right now in my very time-limited life I’m trying to learn the HX, Aftershock, and Future Impact. Along with fitting them together with my Cali76 CB. I’m hoping this will be my do-everything board.
I wish the send-return was a single block, so I could swap pedal order in my presets.

Very similar to my setup! I run the Cali76 CB first in my chain, always on. I have mine set pretty subtly, I doubt anyone in the audience would notice. But I sure hear it, especially in my in-ears, which I use nearly every gig. Also rocking that Future Impact, which isn't super friendly to use without some programming. No tips other than download some presets from the threads about it here on TB and start there.

As for the send/return, you're talking about the FX Loops, right? Those absolutely are 1 block each. It sounds like maybe you're using one block for send and one for the return, making for 2 blocks? You could do that but I don't see a great reason to do so unless you were doing a wet/dry setup or something.