Double Bass Low frequency importance of a 1x12 cabinet

[crockpot2001]

I have a GB 3.0-8T combo and love it. It's missing some low end and total volume I would like to get out of my Ergo Bass 4 string. It's puking it's guts trying to keep up in small clubs.

So, because I need something lightweight yet significantly louder when paired with the 8" cabinet, I've set my mind on a 8ohm 1x12 cabinet. I made a spreadsheet to help me make up my mind. I considered price, total size, weight, SPL, wattage, and lowest frequency. Where I'm a little shakey is how much importance to put in the lowest range of the output. For example, Eden claims 32 hz while others like GB, Mark Bass, and Warwick only go to 45 hz. Many others are in the 42-45 range.

Am I putting too much emphesis on their claimed ratings and will I ever hear it?

 

[chuck3]

I can't answer your technical question, so sorry about that. But I'll give you my opinion anyway. The GB Shuttle 3.0 - 8 is a great little piece of equipment - I use it mainly with my upright as a monitor/DI with the DI going to the FOH. But obviously it can do more than that.

The last couple of gigs I've played at small-medium size bars where the music space was tiny, I've used the GB Neox 1x12 cab, and I will vouch that it kicks butt. This is playing rock-country-blues with a Fender Jazz. I've used it with the 3.0 head that you have (just pop it out of your Shuttle), used it with the 6.0, am now using it with an LM II just for some tonal experimentation. All good.

So I'd suggest running your 3.0 with the Neox 1x12. They are highly compatible because that's how Genz makes them. You can e-mail Jeff Genzler with any technical questions and he generally responds quickly.

 

[bolo]

Am I putting too much emphesis on their claimed ratings and will I ever hear it?

Perhaps. I am not the only person to quote this stat, but the venerable Ampeg 8x10 SVT cab has a listed frequency response of (-3dB): 58Hz-5kHz.

I have two 1x12 cabs with frequency response of 45Hz to 12kHz. With upright and 4-string EB, I think they cover the lowest range of the instruments just fine in small to medium rooms.

 

[chuck3]

I didn't notice you were coming at it from the DB side. Having played my upright as well as my electrics through a variety of cabs using a GB 3.0 Shuttle head, I'd recommend the Neox 1x12, or even the Shuttle 12 cab as a standalone, even more strongly. You will get all the low end you need and you will keep the clean tone I assume you want as an upright player. (I'm looking for a little grittier tone these days on BG, but on upright I like the clean Genz Benz tone.)

 

[crockpot2001]

I didn't notice you were coming at it from the DB side. Having played my upright as well as my electrics through a variety of cabs using a GB 3.0 Shuttle head, I'd recommend the Neox 1x12, or even the Shuttle 12 cab as a standalone, even more strongly. You will get all the low end you need and you will keep the clean tone I assume you want as an upright player. (I'm looking for a little grittier tone these days on BG, but on upright I like the clean Genz Benz tone.)

Interesting response. I am wanting to keep things tight but still feel a bit O' Shakin going on. I know I don't like the sound through a 15" as I've used them in gigs. The Neox looks to be a great cabinet but may be a bit portly as almost all of our gear transport is by subway in Asia. Fun. Shroader mini meets this need but ooooh so pricey. I am also looking at the new 12" dual Ohm cabinet from Hartke. Certainly more affordable and versatile.

regadless, I think I may take of emphesis off the low freq. values.

 

[chuck3]

well, once you said "subway in Asia" you sealed the deal. Either get the Shuttle 12 cab:

Link Removed

Or I'd still rather the Neox 12 as deeper end. So consider that too, for about $50 and maybe 12 pounds (weight, not English money) more:

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Don't know if you're doing your curls in the a.m. to keep your biceps strong, if not maybe the Shuttle would be better for you than the Neox. They're both great cabs.

 

[AMJBASS]

Eden exaggerates their specs by quite a bit(32 hz from a 1x12" is hard to believe unless the sensitivity is extremely low). While they are great sounding bass guitar cabinets/heads they tend to be a bit too colored sounding for Double Bass. I'd look into an Epifani UL112. It is deep sounding but very smooth. You might also consider either the Genz Shuttle 12" cab, or the Neox12(which is pricey).

 

[drurb]

I have a GB 3.0-8T combo and love it. It's missing some low end and total volume I would like to get out of my Ergo Bass 4 string. It's puking it's guts trying to keep up in small clubs.

So, because I need something lightweight yet significantly louder when paired with the 8" cabinet, I've set my mind on a 8ohm 1x12 cabinet. I made a spreadsheet to help me make up my mind. I considered price, total size, weight, SPL, wattage, and lowest frequency. Where I'm a little shakey is how much importance to put in the lowest range of the output. For example, Eden claims 32 hz while others like GB, Mark Bass, and Warwick only go to 45 hz. Many others are in the 42-45 range.

Am I putting too much emphesis on their claimed ratings and will I ever hear it?

I assume you've chosen 8 ohms so as not to present too great a load in combination with another cab. The short answer is, yes, you are placing too much stock in those specs. Here's why:

Keep in mind that the fundamental of the E string is around 41 Hz. There is little point in passing frequencies below that and, in fact, doing so can cause all manner of problems. Do a search on "infrasonics" for that discussion.

There is, unfortunately, precious little standardization of specs in the musical instrument reinforcement world. A frequency response spec is meaningless without a tolerance, e.g., +/- 3 dB. That is, saying that the low end is 32 Hz or 45 Hz without specifying how far down is the response at that frequency provides no useful information.

Beyond that, it's nice to know the roll-off. I could, in principle, have two cabs, Cab A with a 3-dB down point of 50 Hz; Cab B with a 3-dB down point of 45 Hz. Which one has a better low-end response? Wait... don't answer. Suppose I then tell you that Cab A has a roll-off of -6-dB/octave while Cab B has a roll-off of -12-dB/octave. Hmm. At 30 Hz, Cab A will be down 4.4 dB while Cab B will be down 7 dB. (Okay, now you can answer. ).

Finally, I tell you that both cabs have the same power handling spec. You're just about to plunk down your cash and walk out with Cab A when I tell you that the speaker in Cab B has a much greater excursion than the one in Cab A. That means that, at the lowest frequencies, when you are up at high levels, Cab A will go "splaaaaat" while Cab B will be just fine.

The morale? Use specs as a rough guide but then go try cabs out in addition to trusting the experience of others who have used them.

Hope this helps.

 

[crockpot2001]

I assume you've chosen 8 ohms so as not to present too great a load in combination with another cab. The short answer is, yes, you are placing too much stock in those specs. Here's why:

Keep in mind that the fundamental of the E string is around 41 Hz. There is little point in passing frequencies below that and, in fact, doing so can cause all manner of problems. Do a search on "infrasonics" for that discussion.

There is, unfortunately, precious little standardization of specs in the musical instrument reinforcement world. A frequency response spec is meaningless without a tolerance, e.g., +/- 3 dB. That is, saying that the low end is 32 Hz or 45 Hz without specifying how far down is the response at that frequency provides no useful information.

Beyond that, it's nice to know the roll-off. I could, in principle, have two cabs, Cab A with a 3-dB down point of 50 Hz; Cab B with a 3-dB down point of 45 Hz. Which one has a better low-end response? Wait... don't answer. Suppose I then tell you that Cab A has a roll-off of -6-dB/octave while Cab B has a roll-off of -12-dB/octave. Hmm. At 30 Hz, Cab A will be down 4.4 dB while Cab B will be down 7 dB. (Okay, now you can answer. ).

Finally, I tell you that both cabs have the same power handling spec. You're just about to plunk down your cash and walk out with Cab A when I tell you that the speaker in Cab B has a much greater excursion than the one in Cab A. That means that, at the lowest frequencies, when you are up at high levels, Cab A will go "splaaaaat" while Cab B will be just fine.

The morale? Use specs as a rough guide but then go try cabs out in addition to trusting the experience of others who have used them.

Hope this helps.

Why yes it does. Thanks to all! I just pre ordered the 210 MBE cabinet by GK. At 30 lbs with 2-10 Neo speakers for only $299 I could not pass it up. If it sucks I'll sell it and get a 1-12 Genz before I return to Korea. Actually I could probably sell the 210 for a zillion bucks over here. Hmmmmm

Anyway, It should be waiting for me when I return to the States next month.