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Low Tension, High Stiffness Flats

2

2F/2F

May 26, 2009
4,291
6,569
Los Angeles, CA
#1
Hello,

I love the stiff feel of classic old flats, but I have a few "vintage" basses with necks that aren't perfectly straight, that I'd like to baby a bit. Reduced tension sets are out there, but I very much dislike the feel of strings that are not stiff.

I'd like to install a set of flats that has close to the same feel as heavy gauge classic flats, but that isn't as tough on necks. I.e. less pull on the neck, but just as much resistance under my fingers.

Probably an impossibility, but I always hear that "stiffness and tension are different things," so maybe there is some hope. Any suggestions for specific string sets that might fit the bill?
 
#6
2F/2F said:
Hello,

I love the stiff feel of classic old flats, but I have a few "vintage" basses with necks that aren't perfectly straight, that I'd like to baby a bit. Reduced tension sets are out there, but I very much dislike the feel of strings that are not stiff.

I'd like to install a set of flats that has close to the same feel as heavy gauge classic flats, but that isn't as tough on necks. I.e. less pull on the neck, but just as much resistance under my fingers.

Probably an impossibility, but I always hear that "stiffness and tension are different things," so maybe there is some hope. Any suggestions for specific string sets that might fit the bill?
Click to expand...
Probably another impossibility but, do you remember what you have on each of these, assuming you'd already accommodate the necks with strings they could take? This way we could check out, or make informed hypotheses on, optimal tensions for them, and suggest adequate flat sets.

La Bella 760FX and D'Addario ECB80 are good suggestions. You could also get the heaviest Rotosound set (RS77LE), discard the 110, use the remaining three (95-75-50) as your EAD and add a light-gauge G (35 ~ 40) from whoever sells singles (doesn't have to be Rotos). The same trick could be tried with the SH77 (Steve Harris signature set), or with the La Bella 1954 Originals (0760M).

However, you said 40-95s are really out for tactile reasons. The aforementioned companies' next in gauge sets (760FL, ECG84, SM77) all are aways heavier than their 95 sets (or makeshift set, in the latter case). And flats from other companies are known to be less stiff than these, by and large.
Perhaps a balanced set of D'Addario Chromes (40-55-75-100), built from singles. But the A and D would be as thin as (actually a bit thinner than) the La Bella FX, so...
 
#8
2F/2F said:
In other words, it appears that tension and stiffness really can't be readily separated.
Click to expand...
In general, you are onto something: just coming down in diameter is more of a surefire solution to higher than desired tautness than looking for inherent flexibility, and viceversa. Plus, it just so happens that nobody makes very stiff flats that are low-tension with big gauges at the same time: it would cater to your situation, but probably such a specific need rarely comes up in customer feedback. It is the contrasting requirements, namely 1) weak necks and 2) you liking stiffness yes but 3) thin strings not, that paint you into a corner.

In alternative to special, stiff but light flats which to my knowledge don't exist, you'd need a set of conventionally stiff/high-tension flats with uncommon gauges - say 42-57-79-98? - in order not to fall into too high a pull for the neck, while at the same time being taut enough and substantial enough for your plucking hand. And such a set doesn't exist either (unless you put it together from odd sets and electric guitar single flats?).
 
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#9
I would have also suggested La Bella 760FX or ECB80/84 Chromes. To me they are stiff feeling, but I have a preference for more flexible strings.

OP, sounds to me like you might need to take a gamble and just install your preferred strings on these vintage basses of yours and hope for the best. Or learn how to live with less stiff strings. (Or sell the basses and replace them with something that has a sturdier neck!)
 
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#11
Mastermold said:
Do LaBella LTFs not fit the bill?
Click to expand...

^^This^^ I was going to suggest this, myself. With one possible exception, the La Bella Low Tension Flexible Flats are the lowest tension (about 136 lbs./set), long scale flats there are. Lower, even than TI Jazz Flats (143.6 lbs./set). However, unlike the "Flexible Champion" TIJFs, La Bella engineered these flats to feel about as stiff as any other "normal" flat wounds. Given your criteria, I'd say the LTF's are your best bet...:cool:
 
#12
Mastermold said:
Do LaBella LTFs not fit the bill?
Click to expand...

GIBrat51 said:
^^This^^ I was going to suggest this, myself. With one possible exception, the La Bella Low Tension Flexible Flats are the lowest tension (about 136 lbs./set), long scale flats there are. Lower, even than TI Jazz Flats (143.6 lbs./set). However, unlike the "Flexible Champion" TIJFs, La Bella engineered these flats to feel about as stiff as any other "normal" flat wounds. Given your criteria, I'd say the LTF's are your best bet...:cool:
Click to expand...

The OP has already indicated the La Bella 760FX (39-96, hex core) were too flexible and too skinny. I'm not sure how the LTF (round core) would be any better for being "stiffer".
 
#13
How about... because they were engineered that way? Yes, the core type matters, but it's not the be-all, end-all of stiffness. The fact that the LTF's round core is just a little bigger than the core of the 760FX's might have just a little something to do with it. I have a set of long scale 760FX's on one of my Dano DC59s, and yes, they are pretty flexible - and definitely skinny. But, given the OP's stated criteria; what other flat wound choices does he have?
 
#15
760 FL’s have always approximated “average” roundwounds, IMO, in both stiffness and tension. For a while I was moving between D’Addario XL165’s and FL’s semi-regularly and recall no need for truss rod adjustment. Neither ever endangered a neck. They were certainly stiffer than FX’s or LTF’s for sure.
 
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