Markbass LM3

[BeMoreFrench]

It's really simple to understand: if the sticker at the back says "made in Italy" --> class AB, pre-indonesia/Cor-Tek production. If the sticker says "made in Indonesia" --> class D, production moved to Cor-Tek. Since 2014 then. Because it was simply easier, cost efficient, and didn't lower the quality of the amps. The heatsinks ARE NOT a good example of a class A/B or class D version. For standardization matters, they kept using all the chassis parts identical.

Example: the Little Marcus 800 wears exactly the chassis parts as the standards LM amps, double heatsinks.

 

[mcnach]

It's really simple to understand: if the sticker at the back says "made in Italy" --> class AB, pre-indonesia/Cor-Tek production. If the sticker says "made in Indonesia" --> class D, production moved to Cor-Tek. Since 2014 then. Because it was simply easier, cost efficient, and didn't lower the quality of the amps. The heatsinks ARE NOT a good example of a class A/B or class D version. For standardization matters, they kept using all the chassis parts identical.

Example: the Little Marcus 800 wears exactly the chassis parts as the standards LM amps, double heatsinks.

They moved to class D while they were still made in Italy, 'though.
It it's class AB, it's Italian, but the converse is not always true.

 

[BeMoreFrench]

They moved to class D while they were still made in Italy, 'though.
It it's class AB, it's Italian, but the converse is not always true.

Only at the mid 2013, in fact there were some Markbass engineers already on site at Cor-Tek. The guys are smart: they first released some italian made to see if anything was wrong, generally speaking it's at the very first month or 2 months of use. That's why those ones are very rare and mostly in Europe. After 6 months they decided it was ok to move to Cor-Tek.

 

[Sparky Mark]

Those two amps aren't even voiced the same... Are you now saying that the marketing department at Markbass knew more than the engineering department?

Those amps are voiced by the same preamp EQ points. So they are as similar as they can be but with different power amps; you've probably just proved the point that the power amps are the differentiator.

As for Markbass marketing; nothing gets published without the full approval of Marco De Virgiliis, so it's not just the marketing department acknowledging there is a difference between its amplifier's delivery. I like them all, just some slightly more than others.

 

[BeMoreFrench]

The class A/B vs Class D battle is just a hispters thing claiming a pre-indonesian made Markbass amp deserved to be sold at an insane price. The legends like Hadrien Feraud or Marcus Miller really do not care for this. And I believe they have good ears right ? I guess if you told Hadrien Feraud there was a big difference between one of his old F1s and the new LM800 he uses sometimes he would probably be laughing out very loud !

 

[frankie5string]

Those amps are voiced by the same preamp EQ points. So they are as similar as they can be but with different power amps; you've probably just proved the point that the power amps are the differentiator.
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View attachment 5119609
As for Markbass marketing; nothing gets published without the full approval of Marco De Virgiliis, so it's not just the marketing department acknowledging there is a difference between its amplifier's delivery. I like them all, just some slightly more than others.

How do you explain the difference in post-di output I mentioned? They sound different at higher gain.

eq points in the preamp come after the preamp voicing. The preamp can have the same controls but still be voiced and respond differently.

 

[Sparky Mark]

How do you explain the difference in post-di output I mentioned? They sound different at higher gain.

eq points in the preamp come after the preamp voicing. The preamp can have the same controls but still be voiced and respond differently.

We will obviously not agree but all I know is that I can hear and feel a difference when I stand in front of these amps on a gig. I'm perfectly happy to accept your experience is different. Peace.

 

[Sparky Mark]

The class A/B vs Class D battle is just a hispters thing claiming a pre-indonesian made Markbass amp deserved to be sold at an insane price. The legends like Hadrien Feraud or Marcus Miller really do not care for this. And I believe they have good ears right ? I guess if you told Hadrien Feraud there was a big difference between one of his old F1s and the new LM800 he uses sometimes he would probably be laughing out very loud !

Thank you for the compliment but I'm way too old to be a hipster. Lol.
I don't see anyone trying to sell old Italian made Markbass amps for insane prices; I bought all mine for between $200 and $300. Quality wise the only visible difference is that the Italian made amps and cabs used genuine Neutrik sockets whilst Indonesian use unbranded copies.
There is a case to be made that Italian cabs loaded with cast frame B&C drivers could have the edge over the later Yellow Line drivers but the new ones are still good by all accounts.
The F1 and LM800 were both Markbass first generation class D by the way. The later class D 500 watt and 1000 watt amps are a big improvement. My F5 was the only Markbass head that tripped out on a gig; my 2012 Italian made class D LM3 was more powerful and never failed until the pre amp died.

 

[Nebadon2000]

It's really simple to understand: if the sticker at the back says "made in Italy" --> class AB, pre-indonesia/Cor-Tek production. If the sticker says "made in Indonesia" --> class D, production moved to Cor-Tek. Since 2014 then.

Nope; I bought a CMD 121P 2013 Made in Italy [sticker on back] had Class D Amp and Yellowline Speaker
to my chagrin

Ended up head in combo had dreaded low volume on startup problem;

Replaced it with 2007 LMII Combo head[A/B] also had 2015 Indo combo 121P

2007 had something to it that I perceived it slightly better and was main amp I used when adding Cab from Indo
Combo as extension speaker [amp in Indo was backup] or when used just Combo on it's own

 

[SJan3]

Definitely not Talkbass gossip; Markbass recognised the subtle tonal differences between its class AB and class D powered amps when it introduced them and described it :-
View attachment 5119553
Whilst all Markbass amps share a common basic tone, a difference is discernible when doing a true side by side comparison.

..and there it is!

 

[Sparky Mark]

Maybe if you ran the gain low and the power amp opened up, that's possible, but running them both with the gains hotter, the LMT definitely had more texture. You could even hear the difference through the post-DI out.

How do you explain the difference in post-di output I mentioned? They sound different at higher gain.

eq points in the preamp come after the preamp voicing. The preamp can have the same controls but still be voiced and respond differently.

Reading back on your earlier comment about the different DI tones, apparently you were comparing the LMT 800 with a non tube head. The tube obviously makes a difference even when both heads are class D, like the LMT800 vs LM800.

 

[Sparky Mark]

It's really simple to understand: if the sticker at the back says "made in Italy" --> class AB, pre-indonesia/Cor-Tek production. If the sticker says "made in Indonesia" --> class D, production moved to Cor-Tek. Since 2014 then. Because it was simply easier, cost efficient, and didn't lower the quality of the amps. The heatsinks ARE NOT a good example of a class A/B or class D version. For standardization matters, they kept using all the chassis parts identical.

Example: the Little Marcus 800 wears exactly the chassis parts as the standards LM amps, double heatsinks.

Unfortunately you have misunderstood. The point I made earlier in this thread was that you can tell whether an LM3 is either class D or class AB by looking at whether one or two heatsinks are visible through the side ventilation slots. Nobody said this was relevant to any other Markbass amps, just the LM3.

 

[Jeff Scott]

View attachment 5119553

Digital power amp? MB has lost some credibility, here, IMO.

The heatsinks ARE NOT a good example of a class A/B or class D version.

Truth. Walter Woods amps use the same basic case and heatsink regardless of power amp topology. I have owned both types (three Class A/B models and one Class D model).

 

[TN WOODMAN]

My humble contribution to this thread is just after all the years I’ve been playing my Berlin Combo/NY151 extension cab (2007 to present) , I’ve never regretted my purchase & still love mine with every bass I’ve played through it.

My other stay at home rig is an Eden Highwayman 500 & 410 XLT Cab . Sounds great too but I prefer the Markbass.

 

[Sparky Mark]

Digital power amp? MB has lost some credibility, here, IMO.
Truth. Walter Woods amps use the same basic case and heatsink regardless of power amp topology. I have owned both types (three Class A/B models and one Class D model).

Nobody ever said heatsinks defined whether amps are class D. This point is specific only to the LM3, no other model.
One heatsink visible through vent = class D.
Heatsinks visible though both vents = class AB.
I'm afraid I cant say it any simpler than that.

 

[Sparky Mark]

My humble contribution to this thread is just after all the years I’ve been playing my Berlin Combo/NY151 extension cab (2007 to present) , I’ve never regretted my purchase & still love mine with every bass I’ve played through it.

My other stay at home rig is an Eden Highwayman 500 & 410 XLT Cab . Sounds great too but I prefer the Markbass.

Lovely rig. Chances are you have B&C drivers in combo and cab if they're both pre 2012. Nice.

 

[BeMoreFrench]

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in Markbass Little Mark 800 Head and Traveller 102p 2x10 Cabinet |



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Proof that some models were already in production in Indonesia in 2nd semester 2013, as the combos were still made in Italy, but at 1st semester.

 

[BeMoreFrench]

So my argument is 99% spot on: they switched to class D in 2013 for some months to prepare the move to Cor-Tek that same year. They started with big heads, like the LM800, the light ones like the Rocker, 250 black line etc... were still in production in Italy until the end of 2013.

You never move ALL your production at once, you always start with some major models first.

 

[Sparky Mark]

Please read CAREFULLY all my posts instead of choosing the only one that suits you (I'm fed up of those people pushing their agenda), if it's 2013, it's second semester.

Come on...

And by the way, definition of a hipster: yep a young adult, but there were hipsters in ALL eras, if you were 20 in the 60's or 50's, not a surprise why you only swear by class A/B amps, it's a very snob and bourgeois thing to only swear by one thing.

So you don't like hipster, then snob is the definition that suits you.

And being chagrined by a class D Markbass... come on... it's all in your brain ! I've been playing SVT's on stage and I loved them, SWR SM400, made in UK Ashdowns, I've got an italian made LMII from 2007 and since some months a secondhand LMIII indonesian made, class D then. The LMIII is a peace of mind, I use it pretty much EVERYTIME: same sound as my LMII, but less older. The LMII is only a spare amp in case of problem with the LMIII.

And for your information mistaknowitalls, the LM800 has been also made in Indonesia, Feraud uses now indonesian made ones because it's a ... peace of mind on stage. He also uses new class D indonesian Ninja heads, .... or old LMII's, he's not picky as long as it is a Markbass amp. Same goes for Marcello Giuliani.




As i'm french I've been able to see him live countless of times in France and then asked him about his amps: he's pretty loyal to Marco de Virgiliis that really helped him in his debut, and doesn't really care for the Markbass amp that sits on stage, as long as the EQ is voiced the same as his old F1 or LMII. He uses the LMII when there's a spare amp on tiny stages (Baiser Salé), but most of the times he'll go LM800 Indo or Ninja...

I have no idea what point you are trying to make? This thread is titled LM3. The point of this thread is that the OP is buying what he believes is a class AB LM3 as a backup to his class D LM800. I wondered which he might prefer when he receives it? Not anyone else's opinion, including celebrity endorsers.
This totally pointless argument over when production moved to Indonesia is not relevant. Neither is talk of all the other amps with totally different pre and power amp stages. Please dont waste time posting irrelevant videos and photos; we all use and like Markbass amps. Please also remain respectful of other forum members by not resorting to insulting language.

 

[SJan3]

The class A/B vs Class D battle is just a hispters thing claiming a pre-indonesian made Markbass amp deserved to be sold at an insane price. The legends like Hadrien Feraud or Marcus Miller really do not care for this. And I believe they have good ears right ? I guess if you told Hadrien Feraud there was a big difference between one of his old F1s and the new LM800 he uses sometimes he would probably be laughing out very loud !

Hadrien uses a LittleMark3 according to one of his interviews.