"If you use two 2X15 cabinets were each individual speaker is rated at 8 Ohms" ... I get 2 Ohms from this, am I doing it wrong?
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Mesa/Boogie Official Club Thread...Part #2
- Thread starter lobey
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Really? Or is this just poor wording on their part. I see two 8 Ohm speakers per cabinet (4 ohms) and two cabinets (2 Ohms) ... Why would they talk about wiring in series to 16 Ohms per cabinet and then lowering it to 8 Ohms total if they weren't talking about going below 4 Ohms?
"Furthermore, speaker impedance mis-matching is not critical and perceived loss of power will be minimal. ... But if this [wiring in series] seems too complex, do not despair! Some of the heaviest players of the Bass 400 (Michael Anthony, Juan Crocier) use pairs of our standard wired 2x15 cabs, each plugged into a 4 Ohm jack."
Why would they point any of this out if it is a total load of 4 Ohms? I am so confused. My head sounds fine to me through my two 4 Ohm cabs, and a couple other people say they have taken it down to 2 Ohms with no problems. I just want to know what is right and what is wrong, I guess. Cheers all, and thank you for trying to help me with this.
"Furthermore, speaker impedance mis-matching is not critical and perceived loss of power will be minimal. ... But if this [wiring in series] seems too complex, do not despair! Some of the heaviest players of the Bass 400 (Michael Anthony, Juan Crocier) use pairs of our standard wired 2x15 cabs, each plugged into a 4 Ohm jack."
Why would they point any of this out if it is a total load of 4 Ohms? I am so confused. My head sounds fine to me through my two 4 Ohm cabs, and a couple other people say they have taken it down to 2 Ohms with no problems. I just want to know what is right and what is wrong, I guess. Cheers all, and thank you for trying to help me with this.
The way I read this is that a 2 ohm load is acceptable. The "But if this seems too complex..." statement gives (IMO) license to use two "standard wired 2x15 cabinets" aka 4 ohm ones (given that the 15s are 8 ohms each resulting in a parallel wired 2x15 that is 4 ohms) with this amp.
Keeping in mind that a speaker's impedance rating is really a nominal rating and one that is only achieved at two individual frequencies (shown in a typical impedance plot), most of the time a 4 ohm cabinet's impedance is greater than 4 ohms...so it seems to be even less of a worry than we make it out to be.
Chef
In Memoriam
Mesa's standard 2x15 cabs, at that time, were 8 ohms, IIRC. Two 16 ohm speakers inside. Thus, the talk of re-wiring the cab internally, if that suited you.
Mesa has always clearly stated in their manuals when 2 ohms was ok.
In a tube amp, you have to have 2 ohm taps on the transformer. This is nothing to play with on an older 400 that isn't labeled for 2 ohms unless you want to let the magic smoke out.
Later 400's just before the switch to 400+, had 2 ohm transformers, and were labeled that way on the back.
Mesa has always clearly stated in their manuals when 2 ohms was ok.
In a tube amp, you have to have 2 ohm taps on the transformer. This is nothing to play with on an older 400 that isn't labeled for 2 ohms unless you want to let the magic smoke out.
Later 400's just before the switch to 400+, had 2 ohm transformers, and were labeled that way on the back.
No Chef, Mesa's standard 2x15 cabs and 1516 cabs all from that time period were all 4ohms.
The only 8ohm cabs were the 1x15.
Like I've said before, when I lived within a drive from Mesa, I was there with my head having a check up done by them, and they said it was fine to run my pair of 4ohm Mesa cabs (2ohm load). That was 1991, they even pointed it out in the manual to me. Still doing it today.
The only 8ohm cabs were the 1x15.
Like I've said before, when I lived within a drive from Mesa, I was there with my head having a check up done by them, and they said it was fine to run my pair of 4ohm Mesa cabs (2ohm load). That was 1991, they even pointed it out in the manual to me. Still doing it today.
Really? I own an old Mesa 8 ohm 2x15.
About 2 ohms. My amp tech (who also amp techs for Laudanum and High on Fire) has told me it's possible but strains the tubes and transformer a lot. If you have ever had to get a transformer and tubes replaced you wouldn want to go there again. Usually about $350-400 total. Plus labor.
Would I be able to tell by the sound coming out if I am straining the tubes or transformer? I don't want to have to go through the hell of that with a new to me head ... but on the other hand what good is a cab sitting around collecting dust? I want to use both if I can. This is so confusing, I wish someone from Mesa would say something and clear this all up. Cheers all.
I seriously doubt anyone at Mesa would make recommendations on an over 20yr old amp anymore...and I'm sure most folks you talk to on the phone there weren't even around when that amp was in production.
If you're afraid to do 2ohms, then just use your 8x10 cab, it should absolutely kill and be deafening with just that one.
Keep the 2x15 cab at your practice pad, and take the 8x10 to the gig.
Single input jack on the cab?
If you're afraid to do 2ohms, then just use your 8x10 cab, it should absolutely kill and be deafening with just that one.
Keep the 2x15 cab at your practice pad, and take the 8x10 to the gig.
Calaverasgrande said:
Single input jack on the cab?
yes, and no tweet.
If 2 ohms was cool, they wouldnt have gone to the trouble of reccomending that you series your drivers to get 16 ohms. Then parallel the 16 ohm cabs into the 8 ohm jacks when using dual 2x15 cabs.
That whole extra bit I dont remember that blurb from the last time I read teh Mesa Bass 400 manual.
This is what I hav ein teh 400 PLUS manual, which is all I can find online.
SPEAKER JACKS
Two 8-ohm, two 4-ohm and 2-ohm speaker jacks are provided on the Bass 400 Plus. The
amp will produce its full power at all of these impedances, provided that the total
impedance of your speaker cabinets is matched to the output(s) used. (Slight mismatches
are not a major problem, but they will cause slightly lower output and may shorten tube
life.) When using more than one speaker cabinet, remember that the total load impedance
goes down as more cabinets are connected. For example, if you use one 8-ohm speaker
cabinet, use one of the 8-ohm jacks. But if you use two 8-ohm cabinets, they will be
operating in parallel and the total load will be 4 ohms. Therefore, plug each cabinet into a
4-ohm jack. If you want to use two 2x15 cabinets where each cabinet is rated at 4 ohms
(which is how Boogie 2X15s are wired), connect both cabinets to the 2-ohm Jacks
providedif you have a PDF of the 400 non plus manual that you can share that would be awesome. I have a small mesa tube bass head google group that I can share it on.
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]
I am done thinking about whether or not I should be doing it. I am already doing it and I am happy. I am either going to end up in the future like godspeed68 (worse case scenario) or caca de kick (best case scenario). Only time will tell. Thanks again for trying to steer me in the right direction. Cheers.
P.S. What number am I? I sent lobey a message, he hasn't gotten back to me yet.
P.S. What number am I? I sent lobey a message, he hasn't gotten back to me yet.
Calaverasgrande said:
But that's the 400+ manual. I have the (rare)original 400 manual.
If your cab is an 8ohm with single input, I believe it's an early 90's version before they swiched to the multiple jack versions. Do you have a picture of what your jack plate looks like?
I am so grateful to Dennis for taking his time and scanning this manual for me. I looked at the D-180, Buster, and 400+ manuals, on the MESA site, but couldn't find the 400 (non +) anywhere on the internet. The more I think about this, the less concerned I am about anything. Cheers!
no jack plate.
Just one jack in a cup. Thiele style, road ready. Just like I used to see Victims Family's Larry Boothroyd and every other soco bassist with back then.
I swear I was seeing these in late 80's if not earlier.
PS really, can someone kick down a copy of the 400 non plus manual for posterity sake? I've owned the same 400+ since 93!
Hi Everyone,
I've got a Carvin BX500 head and I'm thinking about getting a 1516 cabinet to put under it. The BX500 is 500w at 4ohms. None of my searches have come up with much about the 1516 being used with anything other than the 400+ head, so I thought I'd ask in here if anyone has any experience using non-Mesa Class D amps with the 1516. If so, the obvious question is: how did it sound??
Thanks!
I've got a Carvin BX500 head and I'm thinking about getting a 1516 cabinet to put under it. The BX500 is 500w at 4ohms. None of my searches have come up with much about the 1516 being used with anything other than the 400+ head, so I thought I'd ask in here if anyone has any experience using non-Mesa Class D amps with the 1516. If so, the obvious question is: how did it sound??
Thanks!
Most folks I know find it to be a tad shy on the low end for such a large cabinet. It is designed to be more of a full range cab. I know fretless guys like them a lot. It should be fine if you arent expecting SVT-ish wall of thunder.
As the guy who started all of this club business here on TB, I guess I should join something other than my own MIA club!
Just brought home a Walkabout 12" and I can't say well enough about it! Better in many ways than my Ampeg SVT..
sign me up.
Just brought home a Walkabout 12" and I can't say well enough about it! Better in many ways than my Ampeg SVT..
sign me up.
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