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mic'ing the amp 101

thehangingmist

thehangingmist

Dec 14, 2007
6,367
302
New Delhi, India
#1
i really have no clue about how to mic the amp, i always usually go straight DI to the board but i'd like to know the basics of how to mic the amp!
i know it all depends on the sound you want but i'd like some general pointers, so here's what i need to know

1. what popular mic's work fine and which ones dont? sure sm 57 beta or 58 or what?

2. where/how to place the mic? how far from the speaker? towards the cone or the edge of one of the speakers? how does the placement effect the tone?

3. how loud should the amp be turned up to send a decent amount of signal to the board? best ask the sound engineer, i guess?

4. how transparent is micing? does it really send out the same tone to PA as you hear from your amp?

5. do you go for a general eq every time when you mic a bass rig? like a high cut or a bass boost?

i totally understand the answers are subjective and depends on your choice and need for the situation but i'd like to read your opinion. occasionally sometimes i get a hartke stack or something with a mic sticking in front of it and i better know how to work around it.
thank you

ps: please add any pointers you find useful regarding this
 
#2
1. if the only things that i have available for micing a bass amp are 57s and 58s then i will avoid doing so if at all possible. otherwise any mic thats good for kick drum will work pretty well. my personal favorite for now is a shure SM7 although i would not use it for bands that i don't know as it's a little pricey.

2. as with guitar speakers the very middle will be the brightest and it will get darker sounding the farther toward the edge that you get. for live applications i would get as close to the grill as possible to avoid bleed from other instruments. the loudest sound at the source wins.

3. the amp should be turned up as loud as needed for the player on stage. the rest is up to the engineer.

4. yes and no. depends on the mic and everything else in the chain.

5. i do what i do with every other instrument. set the eq flat and adjust from there. although i will almost alway avoid engaging the hi pass filter on the channel
 
#3
1- Any mike will do. Personaly , I would stay away from Kick mike , since they have already heavy EQ'ing to it.

4-"does it really send out the same tone to PA as you hear from your amp? "
Nothing will sound the same through a PA.
It's better than it was 40 years ago , and it's worst than it will be 40 years from now , but that technology doesn't exist. And I doubt it will ever exist. ( spacialy anyways )
To answer your question , if you start with that in mind , you'll have a lot more choices !!! ;)

5-EQ'ing will depend on all the factors involved in the gig.
musician , gear , repertoire , loudness , acoustics , alcohol , humidity , etc.....
 
#5
1) Any mic works, but I see a lot of mics you would typically associate with toms and bass drums on bass cabs. My personal favourite is the EV RE-20, nine times out of ten.

2) Closer to the dust cap is brighter, closer to the edge is darker. Closer to the cab is more in your face, further from the cab is more mellow. As a general quick-and-dirty placement, I stick the mic right up against the grille, pointed half way between the dust cap and the edge.

3) As loud as it needs to be for you to hear. The engineer, assuming he knows the basic functions of his board, will be able to work with whatever level you're pounding into the mic (assuming the mic itself isn't distorting).

4) Not particularly transparent. The mic's not going to capture exactly what you hear in the room unless it's placed exactly where your ear is and has a response curve similar to the human ear. Even then, it would only be similar. That being said, though, it's a million times closer than a DI.

5) Too many variables. I'll generally boost a touch wherever the bass drum is scooped, but even that's more of a suggestion than anything else.
 
#6
fokof said:
1- Any mike will do. Personaly , I would stay away from Kick mike , since they have already heavy EQ'ing to it.
Click to expand...

when using a kick type mic i would use a different one than is being used on kick and i would not use one of the modern ones with really heavy EQ built in such as the Audix D6(my personal fave for kick). a D112 works pretty well in a pinch on bass although its falling out of favor for kick these days it seems.

but thats why i mentioned the Shure SM7. i am able to make the bass sound in my PA get really close to the sound coming out of the amp with the SM7. someone else mentioned the EV RE20 which is another great choice.


another thing that may not have been said is don't even bother putting the bass in the PA if there are no subs unless you are just trying to reinforce the midrange for clarity.
 
#8
JimmyM got me hooked on Heil PR40's for doing any bass guitar stuff, but I still use a little DI mixed in if there are a ton of effects.

Avoid using a kick mic, or if you have to use one, do like monkeyland says and use one that is mostly flat and different from what is being used on the actual kick drum.

Other than that, you're going to have to decide when what coming out of your amp sounds good at the place you are at. The rest the sound guy should be able to handle.
 
#9
The one time I had to mic my amp and record myself I put a mic at the edge of the speaker pointed towards the dust cap, a neodymium EV vocal mic six inches from the port (?!?) and a room mic about 10 feet away. I sat at the the mixing desk and mixed the three mics and got a keeper on the first take. No EQ required. The best sound I ever got for and by myself.
 
#10
JmJ said:
The one time I had to mic my amp and record myself I put a mic at the edge of the speaker pointed towards the dust cap, a neodymium EV vocal mic six inches from the port (?!?) and a room mic about 10 feet away. I sat at the the mixing desk and mixed the three mics and got a keeper on the first take. No EQ required. The best sound I ever got for and by myself.
Click to expand...

this is indeed a way to get a real mighty "voice of god" type of bass sound. however, you need a great knowledge of basically, all things related to microphones, and recording.

i'm interested in wich way to point the mic, particularly. as of now i've used very minimal microphones for bass, only room mics for solo pieces.

whats the differnce in sound (lets say, with a SM57 or similar) between pointing it straight at the speaker, placed middle between the cone and edge, and having it in that same placement, just pointed towards the center, or outer rim?

i'd immagine for live use you'd want to point it straight, to avoid spill...

i'd like to see this thread get filled with good advice from credible sources..
 
#11
Some good advice here, but I'll throw in my $.02-

1. An SM57 will work on virtually anything. It won't always be the best, but it'll hardly ever suck. An SM58 is just an SM57 with a different headbasket (which does make a difference in frequency response, but not an earthshattering one).

2. The angle of the mic makes a big difference, too- straight at the cone produces a more dynamic, percussive sound, while angling it 45 degrees off axis "smears" the response, reducing transients and kind of smoothing it out a little.
 
#14
JmJ said:
The one time I had to mic my amp and record myself I put a mic at the edge of the speaker pointed towards the dust cap, a neodymium EV vocal mic six inches from the port (?!?) and a room mic about 10 feet away. I sat at the the mixing desk and mixed the three mics and got a keeper on the first take. No EQ required. The best sound I ever got for and by myself.
Click to expand...
that kind of thing won't be of any use live, though.

i hadn't thought about the "old kick mic" thing, but i used to get good results with an AT 125 kick mic, especially when close-micing a 10" rather than a 15".

i think these days, it might be mics meant for floor toms that do a good job for bass (audix D-4, say), with enough low end but not the mid-scoop pre-EQ of many kick mics.
 
#15
walterw said:
that kind of thing won't be of any use live, though.

i hadn't thought about the "old kick mic" thing, but i used to get good results with an AT 125 kick mic, especially when close-micing a 10" rather than a 15".

i think these days, it might be mics meant for floor toms that do a good job for bass (audix D-4, say), with enough low end but not the mid-scoop pre-EQ of many kick mics.
Click to expand...

D'oh! I forgot about the live aspect.......
 
#16
i'm experimenting with backing the mic (heil pr40) off the cab a little. not quite to the degree that it's ambient, but it seems to mellow out the midbass and introduce a little more brightness on the top end if i back off 3-4 inches.
 
#17
JimmyM said:
i'm experimenting with backing the mic (heil pr40) off the cab a little. not quite to the degree that it's ambient, but it seems to mellow out the midbass and introduce a little more brightness on the top end if i back off 3-4 inches.
Click to expand...

That makes sense if you consider that the mic is a cardioid and therefore subject to proximity effect.
 
#19
TL5 said:
That makes sense if you consider that the mic is a cardioid and therefore subject to proximity effect.
Click to expand...
ya, i think that's what i'm going to do from now on. i got offstage tonight and the bass was killin'! it's usually really good anyway, but tonight it sounded more even and more like the amp than before.
 
#20
I'm in agreement with most people on here, kick mics are too hyped. The D6 is really over the top, Beta52 slightly less so, D112 slightly less so again, but still too much for me. Ideally I would use one of the broadcast style mics (M88, MD421, RE20, SM7 ect), but a 57 is fine unless you are a dub band or something and need huge low end.

I do live sound and always mic the bass cab unless the band specifically wants a DI (most give me a blank stare when I ask them). Most bands I mix seem to use a bit of overdrive and shoving a 57 near the edge of the cone usually gets a great sound without touching the eq on the desk. I don't understand the obsession some engineers have with their beloved DI boxes, usually a Behringer.
 
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