Microsoft Zune

[Philbiker]

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The press on this turd has been lukewarm at best.

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Seattle Times

The debut on CNN turned into an Apple commercial

Smooth installation

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[BassGod]

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The press on this turd has been lukewarm at best.

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Seattle Times

The debut on CNN turned into an Apple commercial

Smooth installation

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"Oh, and the Zune Marketplace doesn't even take real money, proving that on the Zune Planet there's no operation so simple that it can't be turned into a confusing ordeal."

Hilarious.

I resent that in that article, some ass from Universal said that these mp3 players are filled with stolen files. As someone who has spent thousands on CDs over the years, that irritated me a little.

Graeme

 

[DigMe]

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The press on this turd has been lukewarm at best.

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I always enjoy reading Dvorak.

bc

 

[El-Bob]

DO YOU KNOW WHERE YOUR CAPS LOCK KEY IS????

My eyesight is already poor and trying to read that only makes it worse.

MY FRIEND HAS A T-SHIRT THAT SAYS "CAPS LOCK-CRUISE CONTROL FOR AWESOME" ON THE FRONT!!!!!

 

[Akami]

I seem to sense that some would like to dislike the Zune without having even tried it out.

I would definitely give it some serious consideration if I had any interest in watching videos in a pocketable device.

Screen is much, much more viewer friendly than the iPod.

 

[Josh Ryan]

Microsoft giving universal $1 for every Zune manufactured? Are they ******* serious?


iPod for me then.

 

[WalterBush]

No offense, but I don't think you understand this issue, and sadly I don't think many people will realise how important it is until it's too late. Just you wait to see the restrictions Vista will put on the media that you buy legally.

Vista won't put restrictions on me ripping my CDs and playing them on a non-Zune, non-iPod player. It also won't stop you from running the output jack of any media player into a recording device, and pressing record. DRM is so easy to defeat, in so many ways, it shouldn't be any kind of issue. Think analog.

For the record, I still buy CDs. I decide how I listen to them, what devices I put them on, how I archive or back them up, etc. and don't feel restricted by WMP, Zune, or iTunes at all. The last mp3 player I bought cost me a whopping $39.95, and holds enough music encoded at a good bitrate to last me through my work day.

Zune doesn't impress me, but neither did the iPod. They both suck, IMO. An awful lot of good music just isn't available on either service. The devices cost more than my last computer upgrade, too.

 

[Tsal]

Dunno about Zune's appearance - the display looks nice, but I assume it's at the cost of battery life. Otherwise it looks pretty much like a previous generation brick-like iPod, and something designed by Asus at that. Wi-fi sharing (can you move stuff from your computer via wi-fi?) seems a nice touch in theory, no idea how it works in real life but we'll see how Apple reacts to that anyway - they have always been quick to adapt any compeating functions.

 

[Sonic_Death]

I don't know about what they'll have in the future, but at this point, no you cannot move files from your computer via WiFi. The WiFi's only use at this point is to transfer songs from Zune to Zune, and those songs will only stay there for 3 days or 3 plays.

 

[ModulusFan]

Consumer reports said it sucked

 

[DigMe]

Consumer reports said it sucked

Is that a direct quote?

CR seems to be a fan of the Cowon players above all else. I like them too.
Just to be fair to the poor, wittle Zune though they did say that there's a lot to like about it...just that it's pricey, unrefined and restrictive.

bc

 

[Komakino]

Vista won't put restrictions on me ripping my CDs and playing them on a non-Zune, non-iPod player. It also won't stop you from running the output jack of any media player into a recording device, and pressing record. DRM is so easy to defeat, in so many ways, it shouldn't be any kind of issue. Think analog.

For the record, I still buy CDs. I decide how I listen to them, what devices I put them on, how I archive or back them up, etc. and don't feel restricted by WMP, Zune, or iTunes at all. The last mp3 player I bought cost me a whopping $39.95, and holds enough music encoded at a good bitrate to last me through my work day.

Zune doesn't impress me, but neither did the iPod. They both suck, IMO. An awful lot of good music just isn't available on either service. The devices cost more than my last computer upgrade, too.

You've missed the point - I shouldn't have to defeat DRM, I'm well aware of doing things the analogue way to bypass it, but it just bloody well shouldn't be there in the first place and I won't support any company in favour of it.

I still buy CDs and I too own an extremely cheap-ass mp3 player that serves my needs. The trouble is if more any more people buy Zune/iPod then they'll unwittingly accept DRM as a fact of life and before we know it there could be no alternative. OK, that's a worst-case scenario, but even to a lesser extent where non-DRM music gets harder and harder to find would be a bad thing (tm).

I also wouldn't put too much money on what restrictions vista will and won't put on you. Nothing will surprise me as far as that company is concerned.

 

[180+DecibelBass]

what the hells DRM first of all?

and whoever is flaming the zune without even trying it should get off thier asses and try it themselves. Then give an opinion. I love my zune.

 

[Sonic_Death]

I love my zune.

No offense, but you're the only one.

And that statement is complete sarcasm, but it somewhat proves to be true.

There are just many cons of the Zune, most of which overshadow and pros. Plus the fact that a lot of people are very intolerant of new things.

 

[180+DecibelBass]

Could you list some of those cons?

 

[Komakino]

what the hells DRM first of all?

and whoever is flaming the zune without even trying it should get off thier asses and try it themselves. Then give an opinion. I love my zune.

DRM - Digital Rights Management

In most basic terms, it's when a file is designed to limit what you can do with it. For music, this is usually something like making songs that only play on one brand of player (like the iPod) or making it so songs cannot be moved to a different player or computer, or making it so that songs will only play a set number of times before expiring.

Apparently, with media player 10 media files had a license file associated with them. If you backed up your media then you also backed up the license file. However, with media player 11 (with Vista) there is no separate file so if your hard drive gets fried then your collection is toast.

And I'm not 'flaming the zune' (as you so elloquently put it) I'm flaming everything the zune stands for, which is to interfere with my rights when I purchase music. For MS to say 'oh but you can share files with other zunes...but they expire after 3 days' is typical MS fud - to give with one hand and take with the other. There is no way in hell I will support microsoft and no way in hell I will ever buy one of their products because, from experience, there is always something hidden or underhand. Lets not forget that microsoft is a company that has been found guilty of serious anti-trust practices on both sides of the Atlantic. Just consider that phrase for a second: anti-trust. I think that says it all.

The trouble with this is that the people with the money, the people like you, are walking blindly into this until it becomes the status quo because just like you most people will say "What exactly IS DRM?" right AFTER they've subscribed to it.

Although all my information on this comes from other sources (various other sources), this article sums up pretty much everything you need to know:

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Enjoy your Zune.

 

[Sonic_Death]

Could you list some of those cons?

From page 2 of this thread:

Wifi Zune sharing is just awful in my opinion. You share songs with other zunes, and they will only last 3 days or 3 plays. You cannot access internet with it, or anything like that. Its WiFi is only good for that Zune to Zune sharing. Also...

"Caution: Zune may suddenly accelerate to dangerous speeds. Zune Contains a liquid core, which, if exposed due to rupture, should not be touched, inhaled, or looked at. Do not use Zune on concrete. Discontinue use of Zune if any of the following occurs: Itching, Vertigo, Dizziness, Tingling in extremities, Loss of balance or coordination, Slurred speech, Temporary blindness, Profuse sweating, or Heart palpitations."

Personally I think ipods and other mp3 players are pretty durable at this point, of course as with any hard drive mp3 player dropping it will screw you over, that is not the players fault per-se. You still had to say "Zune software" is easier to use. How about mp3 players that don't require software at all?

I don't think the Zune is revolutionary nor do I think it is the new ipod, or better than other mp3 players.

I'd say those are pretty good cons to start off on.

 

[ModulusFan]

Guys, I am a big MS guy when it comes to PC, but I have to say apple has this market covered. I realize there is a "fanboy" factor everyone loves to hate the ipod, but to me it's like myspace.......enough people hate it to make the hate a trendy fanboy category too.

On my second ipod, the 5gen 30 gig vidpod.....love it. My brother has my first one, a 2nd gen ipod........still kicking ass to this day.

 

[Marlat]

DRM - Digital Rights Management

In most basic terms, it's when a file is designed to limit what you can do with it. For music, this is usually something like making songs that only play on one brand of player (like the iPod) or making it so songs cannot be moved to a different player or computer, or making it so that songs will only play a set number of times before expiring.

Apparently, with media player 10 media files had a license file associated with them. If you backed up your media then you also backed up the license file. However, with media player 11 (with Vista) there is no separate file so if your hard drive gets fried then your collection is toast.

And I'm not 'flaming the zune' (as you so elloquently put it) I'm flaming everything the zune stands for, which is to interfere with my rights when I purchase music. For MS to say 'oh but you can share files with other zunes...but they expire after 3 days' is typical MS fud - to give with one hand and take with the other. There is no way in hell I will support microsoft and no way in hell I will ever buy one of their products because, from experience, there is always something hidden or underhand. Lets not forget that microsoft is a company that has been found guilty of serious anti-trust practices on both sides of the Atlantic. Just consider that phrase for a second: anti-trust. I think that says it all.

The trouble with this is that the people with the money, the people like you, are walking blindly into this until it becomes the status quo because just like you most people will say "What exactly IS DRM?" right AFTER they've subscribed to it.

Although all my information on this comes from other sources (various other sources), this article sums up pretty much everything you need to know:

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Enjoy your Zune.

So basically its just the owners of copyright enforcing their copyright? Is that what you object to?

And yes, I am aware of jurisdictional differences in copyright law and enforcement ability.

 

[Komakino]

So basically its just the owners of copyright enforcing their copyright? Is that what you object to?

And yes, I am aware of jurisdictional differences in copyright law and enforcement ability.

No - it's not the owners of copyright that are doing it. I can buy the same songs with or without DRM from various places. The DRM is added by the third party who does NOT hold the copyright, in this example Microsoft.

Look at it this way. If I buy a song from emusic.com then it's legal, it's in normal MP3 form and it contains no DRM restrictions. If I buy the same song from iTunes I can only play it on an iPod or iTunes and I'm limited to playback on a limited number of computers or an unlimited number of iPods. As the songs contain FairPlay(tm) DRM they can only be played on systems that support such DRM. I, for example, cannot play songs bought from the iTunes store on Linux.


This really scares me that so many people know so little about something that potentially has such a huge effect on using media.
I should have known that posting on a musicians' forum would lead to people saying "You don't like it because you want to share music illegally" but that's not the case - I don't want to share music illegally, I just want to retain my rights to listen to music I HAVE BOUGHT on whatever device I choose to and to make a backup so that, should my hard drive crash, I don't have to buy everything again. It's THIS that companies like Microsoft are trying to remove.