Minding the dance floor

[basshawk21]

I agree with the majority here. I've been gigging since the mid 1970's and have seen both sides of the audience. Sometimes the dance floor is packed the whole night - only to come back the next week to the same venue and a lot of the same people and the dance floor stays empty all night.
For me personally, I've never been one for dancing. When I go to see a band I go for the music and hardly get out of my chair. I think sometimes you just run into a group of people who are there just to sit and watch a band play. I gave up trying to figure it out long ago, just try to stay in the pocket with the drummer and get a groove on that satisfies you.

 

[squidtastic]

Am I over analyzing this a bit?

Yes.
Over 30 years of playing dance music in more venues than I can recall, the one thing I'm confident of is that there is no formula to making a crowd dance -- that's because every crowd is different. I've had shows where the drummer was just not good, and the groove wasn't there, but the floor was packed. And, of course, there were shows where the band/groove/sound was killin', but the crowd were on their butts. It's a complex mix of the crowd dynamic, band, venue, time of day, song being played, set order, weather, etc...

That said, I've seen no evidence that bass tone in and of itself makes a noticeable difference (assuming you're not talking about extreme timbral choices).

 

[OogieWaWa]

"At the very least we make sure everyone there knows we are having a great time and that they should too." That's why you're succeeding right there. Attitude certainly is very important.

Hey, Larry Graham described our job best, folks:

[Freddie Stone]
Hey Greg
[Greg Errico]
What?
[Freddie]
All we need is a drummer
For people who only need a beat, yeah
[Drum added]
[Freddie]
I'm gonna add a little guitar
And make it easy to move your feet
[Guitar added]
[Larry Graham]
I'm gonna add some bottom
So that the dancers just won't hide
[Bass guitar added]........

Bass excites that nerve going between the ear and the butt.

Tone? Set the tone for the song! There's a reason the songs you're playing make successful covers; apparently the bassist, board guy and producer knew what they were doing! Just use that as a general guide an don't overthink it.

Edit: Oh, and all of you KEEP IT GROOVING NO MATTER WHAT. Don't let a dead crowd drag you down, and you may eventually win them over and get them up, but not if it looks like you've given up.

 

[richntiff]

This is an interesting - if somewhat self important - question. We all would love to stand out as ‘God’s Gift to the Groove’. Truly we would. But - at the end of the day it’s the band and their playlist as a unit that can unleash a dance floor. The only way I can equate the bass player’s tone to the inclination of people to dance is that, if you are loving your tone, you are likely to put just a bit more groove and mojo into your playing. Is that enough to take a sober crowd into conga line territory? I doubt it. Song selection. Then play to that particular groove - but SONG SELECTION is it.

 

[2F/2F]

My question is...Am I over analyzing this a bit?

Yes. Just play your part well every second. Don't let what you perceive to be the audience's reaction to your tone (but almost certainly is not) guide you. People dance, or not, based on a zillion factors that have zero to do with the music being played. Besides, when people are dancing, it means they aren't DRINKING, which is what you need them to do. You're paid to get people to spend money in the venue, whether they dance or not.

 

[Davbassdude]

I'm glad you're playing in what sounds like a tight band and gigging in dance-oriented clubs. The last top 40's dance band I played in was in the early 80's, when songs from the Ramones, Pretenders, Joan Jett, Go-Go's, B-52's, Police, Billy Idol and Pat Benatar, got those 18 to 25 year olds out on the floor! Then, as now; it's most about song selection, playing them well and a receptive audience. It sounds like you've got the first two covered. Most often the third thing follows, but the response is not 100% consistent.

 

[eKay]

I also watch the dance floor, I feel it's largely my responsibility. I also play sax, and whenever I had a solo I'd pay very close attention to the dancers. The funkier I played, the funkier they would dance. I like to think of it as the dancers are the notes on a page of music that I'm sight reading.

I think tone is very important to the dance floor, that is, it can't be too "ganky" and it's gotta have enough "booty." I will adjust my amp settings throughout a gig to get to that perfect point, but then I leave it. I do change my playing depending on the piece, because contrast helps to create interest. I'll play close to the neck, or by the bridge, or I'll use one of various muting techniques. Dynamics! Or just fiddle with the knobs on my bass... more neck pickup, more bridge pickup, tone knob, hit the chorus pedal or wah... whatever. The audience (mostly) doesn't know what I'm doing, which is fine, and that's not the point.

A little personal anecdote that always stays with me... my wife is a dancer, and I pay attention to the songs she puts on that inspire her to dance. One song in particular came on and she went crazy for it. A moment later I thought I understood and said, "Ah, it's where the bass comes in right here." To which she replied pointedly, spinning wildly through the living room, "What bass?!"

 

[devnulljp]

I think you need to read BF Skinner's 1947 paper "'Superstition' in the Pigeon" in the Journal of Experimental Psychology.

quick synopsis from wikipedia

One of Skinner's experiments examined the formation of superstition in one of his favorite experimental animals, the pigeon. Skinner placed a series of hungry pigeons in a cage attached to an automatic mechanism that delivered food to the pigeon "at regular intervals with no reference whatsoever to the bird's behavior." He discovered that the pigeons associated the delivery of the food with whatever chance actions they had been performing as it was delivered, and that they subsequently continued to perform these same actions.[72]

One bird was conditioned to turn counter-clockwise about the cage, making two or three turns between reinforcements. Another repeatedly thrust its head into one of the upper corners of the cage. A third developed a 'tossing' response, as if placing its head beneath an invisible bar and lifting it repeatedly. Two birds developed a pendulum motion of the head and body, in which the head was extended forward and swung from right to left with a sharp movement followed by a somewhat slower return.[73][74]

Skinner suggested that the pigeons behaved as if they were influencing the automatic mechanism with their "rituals", and that this experiment shed light on human behavior:

The experiment might be said to demonstrate a sort of superstition. The bird behaves as if there were a causal relation between its behavior and the presentation of food, although such a relation is lacking. There are many analogies in human behavior. Rituals for changing one's fortune at cards are good examples. A few accidental connections between a ritual and favorable consequences suffice to set up and maintain the behavior in spite of many unreinforced instances. The bowler who has released a ball down the alley but continues to behave as if she were controlling it by twisting and turning her arm and shoulder is another case in point. These behaviors have, of course, no real effect upon one's luck or upon a ball half way down an alley, just as in the present case the food would appear as often if the pigeon did nothing—or, more strictly speaking, did something else.[73]

 

[Dr. Gonzo82]

I go against the grain and say that your your tone has a big impact on the on the crowd and you are absolutely right about tweaking it a little to serve the song. A Dub/Reggae song from Sublime needs fat lows and a fast Punk song from Green Day sounds better with a more midrange/treble tone.

I go even further and say that people who comment that the crowd doesn't notice the bass player at all are the ones who play through a Di or a super HiFi amp with all knobs at noon.

Since you are rocking a P bass with flats through an SVT all your adjustments can be done with Tone knob on your bass. Personally I'm not a big fan of the ultra low switch but if it works for you it's great.

But most important:

Don't think that that tweaking your EQ will make a crowd who doesn't want to dance dance.

Of course playing shows is much more satisfying if the crowd is into it and sweating on the dance floor but sometimes it's just not happening. Don't take it personally and play with confidence.

As others said before sometimes it needs just one person to start dancing or the right song and the dance floor goes from empty to packed in a few seconds.

 

[Bander]

People are just sort of bobbing and I change the tone up a bit and they start dancing.

I take it personally and will tweak and tweak.

Sounds like you are making a false association, and possibly experiencing a placebo. If you are constantly tweaking, you can't conclude any correlation to the reaction to dance or not. What is most likely happening, is the crowd hears a tune they really like and jump up or, the band is really tight on some material, wobbly on other pieces, and the crowd picks up on it.

 

[NZBassman]

I would also add that the overall sound needs to be good on the dance floor.... you can be playing your socks off with great songs, but if it sounds like crap out front on the dance floor, then the chances of people wanting to get up and dance will be almost zero.
It's not just the bass that has to have good tone - make sure you have a good mix out front and a good set list

 

[Nevada Pete]

One of many reasons to try to avoid twiddling with your amp during a performance is that this facilitates your concentration on your playing, and putting on a show. All things being equal, I think believing that your bass tone, per se, has all that much to do with what's happening on the dance floor is an attribution error. Like LBS-bass said, though, your volume might have a lot to do with it (too loud or not loud enough).

If its a new gig and your really that worried about it, salt the crowd.

I happen to have misused the term "attribution error" in the above message. The term "attribution error":
describes the tendency to overestimate the effect of disposition or personality and underestimate the effect of the situation in explaining social behavior.”

 

[retslock]

Perhaps you are taking too much upon yourself. I never thought that the bass player is solely responsible for filling the dance floor. It’s a band and that means everybody contributes. I’ve seen people jump up and flock to the floor from just a guitar riff alone.
My wife used to be in a band many years ago that had a strong following. The bass player was ordinary but they always got people dancing. How come? The punters don’t always zero in on one thing but they tend to feed off the energy that’s coming from the stage. I’ve seen it time and time again in my very long career. Mediocre playing with great energy behind it will reach people better than brilliance done with an offhand or blase attitude.

 

[lfmn16]

My question is...Am I over analyzing this a bit?

No. You are way over analyzing it. Sorry, I'm not buying that you tweak your tone and suddenly the dance floor fills up.

 

[DWBass]

I'm of the "If they feel the bass, they will dance" camp. I play pop, r&b, soul and funk music. Tone literally goes out the window unless it's a signature bassline.

 

[MtManiac]

Wasn’t sure where to put this so mods pls move if needed. Thanks

I’ve been gigging with my current band for going on 3 years. We gig at least 2 full weekends a month and one nighters on the others. Great band with plenty of work. We play to full venues. Bar gigs and nicer restaurant/bars that feature bands with a dance floor.

I find myself taking the dance floor very personally. If people aren’t dancing I feel like I’m not putting a good bass tone out that they can move to. I know my lines are good. When the bass is pumping out front people dance. We play a variety of songs from good ole Brown Eyed Girl to Green Day to 80s hits. So from song to song I feel like I need to change up my tone a bit to fit the tune. And I’ve watched this work in action. People are just sort of bobbing and I change the tone up a bit and they start dancing.

My question is...Am I over analyzing this a bit? When the floor isn’t into it I take it personally and will tweak and tweak. It’s kind of driving me nuts. Anyone else deal with this?

I don't take it personally about *me* so much, but I do take it personally about our band. Rightly or wrongly - sometimes people have their own reasons for sitting it out that have nothing to do with us. But I do take it as a reminder to listen more closely to the drummer and make sure we are tight and locked in.

 

[Brother Goose]

I also agree that tone DOES have an impact on the audience. As of late, I've become fond of onboard EQ and the ability to quickly target a sound while still "minding" the dancefloor .

My approach to playing is all about the dancers (unless I'm playing some esoteric art music as a rare departure) and I feel that it's important to move on stage and suggest that others do the same.

I grew up in a musical and dancing household which really influenced my playing and choice of music. I believe musicians, especially rhythm section, should be comfortable moving to music and know basic dance steps that correspond to their genres of choice.

Something that made a big difference in my development as a bassist was playing in front of a mirror and becoming aware of my posture/forebearance and avoiding the pitfall of watching my hands.

This helps me to keep my head up so I can work the room, maintain better technique/ergonomics, and sing.

As Mama said: "Keep your head up, look like your having fun, let the groove breathe, and NEVER fool the dancers"

 

[pcake]

song familiarity can be a part of it, but it can often be a case of the right speed song for the right crowd. i once saw a band doing an outdoor gig in marina del rey that kept a group of folks from pre-teens to a group of seniors in their 70s dancing. they played nothing but classic oldies, and everyone was smiling and moving on the dance floor - they started with brown eyed girl.

if you keep tweaking your tone from the stage, what you hear could be great but what the crowd hears could be a muddy mess. i wouldn't keep tweaking your tone unless you can get off the stage after each knob tweak while you play so you can hear the changes from where the crowd is.

 

[cheapbasslovin]

Also, sometimes it's ok to tell your audience to dance. I routinely make comments early in sets that, 'it's way more fun right down here' or something similar and audiences usually respond pretty well to a little egging on. Sometimes they just need a little push to open the floodgates.

 

[WI Short Scaler]

The only way I can equate the bass player’s tone to the inclination of people to dance is that, if you are loving your tone, you are likely to put just a bit more groove and mojo into your playing. Is that enough to take a sober crowd into conga line territory? I doubt it. Song selection. Then play to that particular groove - but SONG SELECTION is it.

I also believe the song selection is "IT", the thing that people equate with a good band. But even that is an inexact science. A couple weeks ago we played "American Kids/Chesney" and the place was crazy singing along, having fun. This past Friday we thought "here it comes, this will be fun" and it fell flat. I'd like to think that the two versions, as we played them, were not that much different. But the reaction sure was. So that's what I mean by inexact science, no guarantees.

But I think richntiff is onto something here with the personal angle. You're liking your tone, the PA sounds great, everyone in the band is doing their thing well in their own minds and you're bound to pass that energy along to the crowd. If you're happy and you know it, they will too.