Mixing Live Bass with multiple guitars

[Omega Monkey]

I think you mean PFL which is Pre Fader Level. Many mixers (for instance Mackie CRs and Allen and Heath MixWizards), will have a feature where when you hit the appropriate button (PFL, solo, etc...), the input level of the channel (or channels) selected, shows up on the main meter (usually when there's only one master meter, and the channels might just have clip lights). So for instance, while dialing in the trim for your kick drum mic during soundcheck, you switch that PFL or solo button on so you can get a more accurate idea of what the gain is doing.

With most modern digital mixers, this isnt necessary because there's usually a meter for every channel somewhere in the UI.

I would also add that pure signal level will only get you so far in terms of matching your different sounds. You really need to listen to each sound alone and in the band mix. Signal level can get you in the ball park though, and you probably want to keep the signal level range to maybe 10 db or less. But also keep in mind a little goes a long way. Sometimes 1-3 db is plenty to compensate for a "quieter" sounding sound that you want to be at the same PERCEIVED volume as "louder" sounding one (things like EQ and compression can affect this).

Guitarists seem to like about 10-15 db of boost for solos, and it completely ruins their whole sound because they were probably already too loud on the rhythm sound, and completely out of FOH, and then they kick in the boost and it just becomes obnoxiously too loud, but there's nowhere to go with it. And yet the sound is going to change as you move around the room because they're completely out of the PA and their amp is much more directional. If they were at a reasonable stage volume to start with, and then had maybe 3-6 db of boost, even if the boost ends up being too much, I would still have room to bring them back a little bit and set them nicely into the mix.

So yeah, keep in mind things like phasers, filters, octavers, compression, and of course any sort of gain pedal is going to change both your signal level and perceived volume. So matching signal level is a good starting point, and then you can try to match perceived volume (with adjustments as appropriate (ie you might want your grindy fuzz sound for when the band is really rocking out to be a little hotter than your normal sound).

 

[Wasnex]

Hey!

I am slowly turning into a tone snob, and for someone that tries to play a variety of styles in a single show, I have some questions from experienced gigging musicians on how they deal with keeping a nice mix when switching basses and streamlining going back and forth without having to dance on pedals or completely re-EQ your amp.

As far as my rig goes, here's what I got

Amp: Mesa Strategy 8:88 (425 tube watts)
Cab: Markbass 2x12
Pedals:
- Mesa Amp Footswitch (Mute, Solo (boost), Voice (EQ preset on/off), EQ (amp's 9-band EQ on/off), and EFX on/off)
- MXR Compressor
- MXR Bass Octave
- MXR Envelope Filter
- MXR 10 band EQ
- MXR Bass DI
- EH POG
Guitars:
- Mayones Viking 5
- Fender American Elite P Bass
- MG Bass Desert Custom 5

I feel like besides maybe an A/B switch if I wanted to leave all my guitars plugged in, I doubt I need more gear, though open to recommendations if there are good solutions. These are all great basses with great tones, but I have such a tweaker's amp and so many EQing options that sometimes, dialing in a very specific tone for one bass will make my other basses sound like total crap. I'd love to hear opinions about switching easily and how others go about this.

Ideally you would use three DIs and three channels on the mixing console, but that's a lot of resources.

I used to switch between three different basses by using a rack mixer and power amp as my rig. The rack mixer gave me individual gain and EQ for each instrument. FOH got an output from the mixer.

Many mixers are not set up to handle High Z instrument level. The way around this is the use line matching transformers, so you can plug straight into the mic input. I used Shure A95U which can be found for about $39.
A95U - Line Matching Transformer (Male XLR to ¼” Male Plug/Female Jack)



The rack mixer I used was an Ashley MX508. The channel had a button to switch between line and mic inputs. Since I didn't use the line input, I used the button as a mute. Each channel also had Bass, Treble and a sweepable Mid control. The tone controls on this mixer are obviously not as powerful as the tone controls on your amp, so some degree of compromise will be necessary if you want to play all three instruments.


To summarize I think it's important to have individual gain, EQ, and mute functions for each instrument.

 

[John6]

One the other hand, probably almost no one (except you) notices the difference in your carefully tweaked tone settings. Especially 1) when competing with drums and guitars in an ensemble setting and 2) using PA support for your bass and having a dedicated sound guy.

I can take wildly different instruments to my cover band gigs and no one comments on the specific sound, everyone just says, "the bass sounds great." This includes our sound guy, who is very good at his job. Sometimes I pick a bass for the night simply based on how it will look on stage and how it will go with the shirt I am wearing. I understand and accept that you are probably more picky about your sound than I am.

Exactly most people can not even pick out the bass sound especially if you are locked in with the kick.
I go to a lot of local bars and it always amazes me how many times I hear the sub woofers feeding back.
I always go tell the sound guy but some of them can not hear that either.

 

[s0c9]

Exactly most people can not even pick out the bass sound especially if you are locked in with the kick.
I go to a lot of local bars and it always amazes me how many times I hear the sub woofers feeding back.
I always go tell the sound guy but some of them can not hear that either.

One venue I play (about 5 times a year) has SIX dual-18" subs under the WOODEN stage. I don't know how anyone says they can tell the difference between bass a or b! It makes no difference which bass I use. It's all boosted low frequency. It's why I love my IEM's. I can hear my bass clearly and FOH deals with the mud.