more streamliner 900 tone voicing tests

[johnk_10]

i really love my streamliner 900, but as some of you might also know, i REALLY love the sound of my UA 6176 channel strip when used as a bass preamp.

last week, i experimented with a presonus EQ3B to make my streamliner sound closer to my SVT with good results, but having to unplug the speaker back and forth between the heads, flip the SVT in and out of standby and switch playing thru the STM900 & SVT to compare them was very time consuming and actually pretty difficult. since i like my UA 6176 just as much as my SVT, plugging the UA into the STM900's aux in made it super simple to go back and forth until i got them to sound identical. all i had to do was plug into the UA and then plug into the 900's input jack to compare them, using the 900's power amp for both preamps.

for those of you that own one, you probably have realized that the streamliner has a very 'voiced' preamp, and IMO, a very nice sounding one, however, for me, there are a few areas in it's tone that are a bit more 'voiced' than what i'm used to playing thru. the presonus EQ3B works great in the 900's send receive jacks and it allowed me to 'flatten' some of the STM900's 'peaks and valleys' to capture the sound of my 6176.

here's a pic of the eq settings on both the streamliner 900 and EQ3B that i found that make it sound indistinguishable from the UA:

some of you might ask, why go to all the trouble, but to me, adding a tiny parametric to the super lightweight 900 in order to make it even more versatile is hardly any trouble at all, especially since this little $100 parametric makes the STM900 rival the tone of a $2800 channel strip.

 

[Jazzdogg]

Thanks, John!

I have an EQ3B I can take with me when I test drive the Streamliner; If I can get the Streamliner to sound good with DB and 5-string electric, I'll be ecstatic!

 

[johnk_10]

you should be able to very easily with the EQ3B. IMO, it's a match made in heaven. it may look like i'm eq'ing alot but it's really not that drastic (-3db at various frequencies here and here), but for me it really smooths out the STM900's tonal properties.

for me, it was just taking my favorite hybrid head to the next level. i just velcro'd the EQ3B to the top of my STM900 and connect it with two 8" 1/4" to 1/4" patch cords.

 

[Jazzdogg]

Cool! I've been thinking about making a dovetailed wooden case that'll hold the Streamliner, EQ3B, cables, and a small power strip.

 

[johnk_10]

i was also doing some A/B testing using the headphone out with headphones and got them to match even closer. i'll try and post a couple of comparison clips btween the 900 and the UA soon.

tomorrow, i'm going to run some TrueRTA tests on them to get a visual of exactly what is going on while sweeping a 20hz-20Khz test signal thru them.

 

[johnk_10]

i had some time this morning to do a few RTA tests on the STM900 with and without the EQ3B, comparing it to my UA 6176. using the TrueRTA program made it quick and easy to get the STM900 to sound exactly like the 6176.
first, here's the graph of the UA and the STM900 with its eq and the EQ3B's setting to get them as close as i possibly could. (the UA is the green line and the 900/EQ3B is the blue one):

you can see that they match very well, with the exception that the STMM starts a steep rolloff at 30Hz. even with the rolloff they actually sound basically identical thru headphones and my speaker cabinet.
here's a pic of the settings on them to get the graph to look that way:

next, i wanted to bypass the EQ3B to see how close i could get the 900 using only its eq. the graph below shows the UA in green, the 900 with the EQ3B in violet and the without the EQ3B in blue:

and here's the 900's setting to get it to look like the blue line:

without the EQ3B, you can hear the loss of low end starting at about 80Hz, and it's a good -5db down at 30Hz, sharply rolling down from there.




and here they are with an 'insert' pic of the settings:

with the EQ3B:

without the EQ3B:

 

[Jeffrey Wash]

A tip of the hat to you, sir. I admire your methods and diligence.

 

[Passinwind]

i had some time this morning to do a few RTA tests on the STM900 with and without the EQ3B, comparing it to my UA 6176. using the TrueRTA program made it quick and easy to get the STM900 to sound exactly like the 6176.

Cool John. By any chance did you do an RTA of the Streamliner's baked-in curve with all EQ controls at noon?

I had a brief encounter with an STM600 at the last New England GTG. By far my favorite of the GB amps I've tried thus far.

 

[johnk_10]

Cool John. By any chance did you do an RTA of the Streamliner's baked-in curve with all EQ controls at noon?

I had a brief encounter with an STM600 at the last New England GTG. By far my favorite of the GB amps I've tried thus far.

i did make some graphs of it with everything at noon a while ago but i can't find the charts. it'll be easy enough to make some new ones.

 

[johnk_10]

here you go Charlie :

the STM900 with all controls at noon:

 

[Passinwind]

here you go Charlie :

the STM900 with all controls at noon:

Thanks John. Nice to see that vs. the nominal flat settings. Cool that you can get it so flat and still have pretty decent control range left too (with your external EQ at least).

 

[johnk_10]

yeah, i actually have a ton of eq range left for the room, but i found that i was running the UA flat at every gig and it always sounded best that way.

 

[f.c.geil]

This is really cool, thanks. I'd really like to hear it, though. You know how it is, just because you can get it to sound like something you like doesn't mean it's the sound I'm looking for...

 

[rodl2005]

Great stuff John.
I wonder why, when I used the STL, no matter HOW I played with the EQ, I couldn't get the boominess out??? - Well, it DID lose boominess with the bass OFF, but then out had NO bottom end
I tried with different cabs (this gave SOME OK results but not enough to make me want to keep the amp for use with just one cab), tried different basses, different rooms & each time, our sound engineer AND everyone else said the same thing- 'you're muddying the whole stage sound' !
I was & didn't want to admit it, new amp, wanted to love it etc.....
After a couple months & LOTS of trying & fiddling, I had to let it go
I liked it's sound by itself, but in a band mix.... Couldn't get it to be not all bass bloomy, boomy, no definition in notes etc...
I'm just curious, as I get my Walkabout sounding great thru any cab, have used all tube amps all my 35 yrs gigging.......
I know, some just work with some & some don't ........ But, count me curious!

 

[OldogNewTrick]

Very nice... I love a good TrueRTA chart to visualize voicings.

How did you arrive at your flat? With internal EQ as good as it gets and then the rest with the external parametric or the other way around ?

 

[christw]

rodl, what cabinet were you using?

John, thanks for all of the information. The STL900 was already on my future try/buy it list and EQ3B will probably be a companion to that. I really appreciate you sharing all of your testing with us.

 

[johnk_10]

Very nice... I love a good TrueRTA chart to visualize voicings.

How did you arrive at your flat? With internal EQ as good as it gets and then the rest with the external parametric or the other way around ?

i started by getting the amp as close as i could get it by itself, then added the EQ3B to help flatten it, and then went back to the STM900 to touch it up.

when you're doing it visually, it's ALOT easier.

 

[will33]

rodl, what cabinet were you using?

John, thanks for all of the information. The STL900 was already on my future try/buy it list and EQ3B will probably be a companion to that. I really appreciate you sharing all of your testing with us.

This^^

Rodl- his blue line shows the amp flattened out without the help of the external eq. Notice the bass control is way down but not quite all the way off. If you've got a speaker that's adding anything to the boom, you're out of wiggle room between "good" and "off".


As usual, cool stuff Johnk.

 

[johnk_10]

yes, and you have to remember that its eq is interactive.

here's a few quick clips that i made (excuse the clams) but i used big & long notes to show the tone and bloom of them. tis clip is with a 7 3/4lb p bass with fender 9050SL flats with all of the controls wide open:

UA set flat with STM900 poweramp

STM900 with EQ3B set to simulate the UA

STM900 using only its EQ as flat as i could get it

STM900 with all controls at noon


with all of the controls at noon you can see how 'wooly' it can get.

 

[will33]

yes, and you have to remember that its eq is interactive.

here's a few quick clips that i made (excuse the clams) but i used big & long notes to show the tone and bloom of them. tis clip is with a 7 3/4lb p bass with fender 9050SL flats with all of the controls wide open:

UA set flat with STM900 poweramp

STM900 with EQ3B set to simulate the UA

STM900 using only its EQ as flat as i could get it

STM900 with all controls at noon


with all of the controls at noon you can see how 'wooly' it can get.

Pretty telling samples. Should note here how different basses, pickups, strings, etc. will send the amp a very different signal to begin with, but I'm most familiar with the P. It may be a combination of my ears, a phone, cheap ear buds, etc. but I don't know that I coukd really pick the first 3 apart, at least not listening this way. There is something slightly different about the character in the top end of the real UA. Ironically, the most pleasing to me, on this end, is the knobs at noon Streamliner, although, you can hear how it could get too woofy with the wrong speakers. Have to listen to this again later on better speakers. I think it's great you take the time to do all this stuff.