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mtd 535 cut through the mix?

#61
pickles said:
I don't see the point in getting a 535 with traditional woods. .......
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Well for me, it has to do with the range of tones a bass can make. For the last couple of years, my gigging tone has been that of a P bass. It was all I used last year.

This year I decided to get an MTD. While I didn't use the term "P bass", I kind of described that tone when telling Mike how I wanted my MTD to sound. And he delivered. I can get very, very close to a P bass tone from my MTD. Plus a whole lot more tones that my P bass can't get.

That said, I can't get that snap, crackle and pop tone that some MTD's can (or maybe even what MTD's are known for) but that's ok with me. Those are tones I'll never need/use.
 
#62
If you have to struggle get heard with an MTD regardless of the woods then dont get one. I had 3 of them and had the same results in a live setting. Pretty wood but that was about it. Sold them all and was dissappointed after reading and hearing all the hype about them. Turning up the trim pot will result in more noise from the pre. Choose your bass acording to your type of music. Traditional basses like Fender, Spector, etc., great for most rock and the like. $6000 for a bass and you have to fart around with being heard and cant get "that tone" then save the bucks. The audience and your band mates dont give a hoot what your bass looks like. We've all seen beat up basses sound marvelous and some of the fancy wood basses were like....meh.

All the MTD apostles will swear by them. Its all good.

I personally have stopped looking to buy basses after get a Wyn 6 string. And gentlemen I've had over 20 basses, 90% of them I got on TB. FINALLY, I have a bass that gave me what I was looking for tonaly and egronomically and in all honesty I have absolutely no desire to buy any other. My GAS has been cured. I have a Smith BSR6MW which I'll keep also.

So, find what is right for you and your genre of music and go with it. :bassist:
 
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#63
Pick any bass company and test twenty of their basses. Some are going to work well in a mix and some probably won't. It's wood. It's not 100% predictable and that's part of the beauty of it (and yes, sometimes the frustrating part as well). This is why when someone finds an instrument that really speaks to them it is such a momentous occasion. It doesn't happen every day - and it can take a lot of time to find that special bass. I've been very lucky in that two of the MTDs I've ended with have been perfect for me (and one of those was the first one I bought). I could easily have ended up with my third MTD first off - one that, while it was still a great instrument, didn't give me what I was looking for. If that had been the case I may have dismissed MTDs as being "not my thing". The point is to take a lot of the above comments with a grain of salt.
 
#65
bass12 said:
I've owned and gigged seven MTD 535s. I've only had "cutting through the mix" issues with one of them: an ash/walnut/ash/maple combination. Over the past three years two of my main gigging basses have been 535s - an alder/maple/maple/rosewood and an ash/maple/wenge/wenge. I've played these basses in all kinds of rooms from small bars to large event halls (seating thousands), as well as at outdoor festivals ranging from small to large. I've never had a problem with my MTDs in such circumstances - whether using an amp or in-ears (headphones in my case). One of my main gigs is with a fourteen piece corporate band and I've had no problems at all sitting in the mix. I regularly work with one of the best sound guys in Montreal and he's told me that he loves the fact that, with my MTDs, all he has to do is raise the fader. Every bass is different and some are going to sit in a mix more effectively than others. There are no guarantees with any brand, but I'd be wary of any sweeping statements made by people who have only ever gigged one or two MTDs. ;)
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Well I've owned 2 MTD's ( alder/rosewood and ash/rosewood ) and it wasn't the fact they both didn't sit in the mix because they were wonderful in the mix, it was just more so my ears had started to change away from the hifi modern bass sound so I'm just playing my old Jazz bass that I've always played for over 27 years. I don't know but it seems to me that a real good sound man ( or woman ) should be able to make damner any bass sound good no matter who makes it IMO.
 
#67
What I've noticed is that a lot of folks haven't noticed that you can get a much fuller sound out of most basses if you turn the bass and rig up and don't boost the treble. At volume, if the bass has treble, it'll likely be there and not at the expense of the mids. OTOH if you boost the treble it can make your bass sound loud before it can sound full. I've been gigging like this for years with a variety of basses and my sound checks are typically a breeze.

I was trying to imagine what I'd have to do to make a basic Fender Jazz with a decent set of strings not cut through in the mix. Whatever it was, it would've most likely been been my doing IME.
;)
 
#68
hands5 said:
Well I've owned 2 MTD's ( alder/rosewood and ash/rosewood ) and it wasn't the fact they both didn't sit in the mix because they were wonderful in the mix, it was just more so my ears had started to change away from the hifi modern bass sound so I'm just playing my old Jazz bass that I've always played for over 27 years. I don't know but it seems to me that a real good sound man ( or woman ) should be able to make damner any bass sound good no matter who makes it IMO.
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There's the rub... good sound people seem to be in short supply. Bass players who know how to work with sound people too. Sending a whack signal, playing inconsistently, lack of volume control onstage... many don't even realize they're part of the problem.

Lately I've gotten into it with a sound person who wouldn't listen to my suggestions and both times the fix was what I was talking about in the first place. One time my DI was supposed to be bad. The fix? Replaced his cable. Next time my signal was distorted so he wanted me to EQ my bass, which sounded great through the rig. The fix? Pad the input at the board. That gets old when you're trying to get ready for a gig.
 
#69
I've had two (ash body) MTDs and they were both awesome, in a band setting. I did usually boost the lows and cut the treble a bit, but nothing too extreme. I ended up switching to Roscoe, for something less aggressive, but really miss the clarity and consistency of the MTDs. The slap tone was just as loud as fingerstyle, which is certainly not the case with most basses.

EG
 
#70
I don't know where al this 'MTD is great sounding alone, but sucks in a band' starts from.

First of all, I'm not an MTD dealer for a living, I became Mike's dealer coz he's a great guy, and I love his Basses, and we're both New Yorkers :D Well, he's upstate, and I don't even live there anymore... So anyways, what I'm saying doesn't give me anything, just saying MY Opinion and Experience.

I played with whatever amp, mixer the venue has, different sound guys, band members, etc. I used to bring my Tecamp Puma, don't have a cab, but unfortunately I have to sell the Puma, now I'm down to my MTD, a 78 Jazz and a Yamaha Silent Bass (Elec. Upright).

Sometimes I doubled, switching from Electric to Upright with the same Channel on the mixer, etc, I don't even bother changing my amp setting, and I found that especially for these occasions, my MTD 535 is a better choice then my 78 Jazz, I can switch between the two, and the sound guy doesn't even know. The 78 Jazz works well too, but the 535 is just more right.

On those gigs that I doubled, it's almost certain that I have horn(s) and a string section, with Grand Piano, THE instrument that annoys the hell out of me when the player plays too much on the lower octave, add a cello to that and you have a bad time hearing yourself, and on these gigs we never rehearse, show up, sound check for 30mins, set list check, and play. I sometimes don't even know who I'll be playing with.

And again on those ocassions, I prefer my 535, with or without my upright to switch around. For Gospel, I play in church almost every week, different churces, never bring an amp, DI whatsoever with me, the 78 Jazz and 535 is as fun, never heard people comment that they like the one better then the other. A 'real' Gospel Band I was in was about 2 years ago, I had a different MTD back then, but it's the same, everyone loves the way it sounds, that time I was carrying around an Eden WT400, no specific cabs.

So, based on those facts, I don't know where all these prejudices come from, but yeah, some players' no 1 Instrument is another's gear I'll never buy list. I remember playing Kim Stone's Roscoe and don't like it, and he told me that he can't live without it. And I never liked a P-Bass in my life :hiding:

For me, if I like an Instrument, that instrument will give a level of comfort that allows me not to think of anything, and just enjoy playing, and that made my playing and hence, my sound better, I never heard someone sound bad if they play with all their harts and minds, and that made their Instrument 'sat well on the mix'.

So, just give it a shot, sorry to say, you don't need any fancy amp or DI, I've been doing it without my Tecamp, and IMO my 535 sounds even better just with any DI to the mix, the true color really shines. I'm lovin' it
 
#71
I haven't a clue as to how someone could say that MTD's sound good at home but can't cut the mix. I have owned 3. I have also owned Ken Smith, Roscoe, fender Jazz, Yamaha Nathan East Signature, Skjold, Gary Willis fretless....you get the idea. I get more compliments from FOH sound guys and other bassist in the audience about my MTD's and Skjold bass that I own, than from all of the other basses combined. Maybe they did not know how to use the gain on the bass. But there is nothing about that bass that would cause anyone not to be heard in a mix. I didn't mention that my band has 3 horns, keys, guitar, drums and 5 singers. Have you not heard Gouche in concert, or Haslip?
 
#72
Virgil said:
I haven't a clue as to how someone could say that MTD's sound good at home but can't cut the mix. I have owned 3. I have also owned Ken Smith, Roscoe, fender Jazz, Yamaha Nathan East Signature, Skjold, Gary Willis fretless....you get the idea. I get more compliments from FOH sound guys and other bassist in the audience about my MTD's and Skjold bass that I own, than from all of the other basses combined. Maybe they did not know how to use the gain on the bass. But there is nothing about that bass that would cause anyone not to be heard in a mix. I didn't mention that my band has 3 horns, keys, guitar, drums and 5 singers. Have you not heard Gouche in concert, or Haslip?
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I wish that was the case all the time so that i could just go for it but i keep hearing it. Whats your wood combination btw?
 
#73
antontanzil said:
I don't know where al this 'MTD is great sounding alone, but sucks in a band' starts from.

And I never liked a P-Bass in my life :hiding:
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IMO, it all depends on who you're playing with and the venue. Under ideal circumstances, any bass can work. Unfortunately, ideal and I never play at the same place.

One place I play, the amps and musicians are under a seven foot overhang. Once you get past the overhang, the ceiling is thirty feet high. You do your best at a four minute sound check. Then in the middle of a set, the place goes from eight people to 100 people and the guitarist puts down his scooped acoustic guitar and picks up his mid heavy electric. And the bass just disappeared.

It seems the more complex the bass tone, the easier it is to get lost. When I'm going to be at a place like this, the MTD stays home and the P goes to the gig. (I never liked P basses till I started playing at places like this.) With the MTD, I'd be changing the eq on every song. With the P, it's plug and play.

If this wasn't the case, Mike T. probably wound't have developed the Saratoga.
 
#75
Margus Alviste said:
MTD has such a wonderful preamp that I just cannot understand how one can't get out the sound that doesn't cut through the mix?! Just turn the knobs and it cuts through the mix like a sharp knife! :)
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Many likely don't know how to do this. I'd be willing to bet that if you asked most bassists how to get more highs with an active 3 band bass it wouldn't dawn on them to reduce the mids. Or that highs can make you seem loud but aren't really what cuts through live in many applications.

The last time I got lost in the mix was years ago playing a great looking boutique bass that was seriously deficient in the mids, even with a full treble cut. Massive mid boost at the amp brought it up to where my mids would normally be. Long gone.
:D
 
#77
Brad Johnson said:
Many likely don't know how to do this. I'd be willing to bet that if you asked most bassists how to get more highs with an active 3 band bass it wouldn't dawn on them to reduce the mids. Or that highs can make you seem loud but aren't really what cuts through live in many applications.

The last time I got lost in the mix was years ago playing a great looking boutique bass that was seriously deficient in the mids, even with a full treble cut. Massive mid boost at the amp brought it up to where my mids would normally be. Long gone.
:D
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Well, that will give you more perceived upper treble for sure..... that is the logic behind the dreaded 'enhance/contour' knobs on amps. I guess there are many ways to get a sound that works for you, but cutting midrange so that the upper treble speaks better is more likely to get most (many) into trouble, and IMO is one of the primary reasons that you hear that 'click and boom and not much else' from so many players in a live setting using these modern basses with multi-band preamps.;)

The other issue I've found with using an on-board pre to radically change the tone of a bass (i.e., to try to muscle a tone into an instrument that is not particularly inherent in its natural voicing) is that the Q's of the midrange are typically narrow enough that you get some very strange 'peaks and valley's. Boosting the bass on some on-boards is also problematic, since they are shelving controls without hi passing, so all of a sudden you bass sounds good on stage through a little bass rig, and the front of house has massive 40hz and under pumping through the subs. Should a sound person be able to deal with this.... in the best case, yes. In most cases, they won't, unfortunately.

Again, 'cutting through the mix' has lots of definitions. If cutting through the mix is the classic 'sitting above the bass drum and below the cymbals', that is a very different thing than 'putting a massive pillow of low end under the band, and then getting all your attack above 4K'.
 
#78
I have no experience with MTDs. But seems there are differing opinions about MTD's tone in the mix because MTDs with different woods each have their own character.

That's one of the reasons I've been reluctant to dive into the used MTD market.
 
#80
just a thought - when someone asks me to turn up the highs, I don't turn up treble, I turn up presence areas (upper mids). One some basses that's hard/impossible to do which is why I'm going through this love of vari-mid semi-parametric controls on my active basses.

For me, highs on a stage are upper mids, not fret/finger noise treble (or at least not exclusively).

I definitely don't turn DOWN the mids when someone asks for more treble in a live gig. but maybe semantics are involved here...
 

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