My Day at D. Lakin basses

[StuartV]

People pay huge crazy prices for Ibanez and Yamaha basses (non USA basses!!). I don't hear any complaints about those.

They are generally not P and J clones, either...

 

[Smooth_bass88]

They are generally not P and J clones, either...

Yeah, but they're imports at a certain price point, and people play 'em and love 'em.

 

[GregC]

The way that I read it was that he pulled out G&L and Carvin as more or less random examples of USA bass companies falling within the price range of Lakin.

Then it appeared that your response was directed at G&L specifically when it could have been applied to nearly any major US bass maker.

I think I may have read more into your reply than was intended. I apologize for that.

You definitely did. Apology accepted.

 

[awilkie84]

Whoa there. "Handmade" is admittedly a vague term, but I think it's a real stretch to say that G&Ls are handmade.

Handmade is a stretch with MOST builders, including Sadowsky, Fodera, etc.

 

[nostatic]

Handmade is a stretch with MOST builders, including Sadowsky, Fodera, etc.

How is it a stretch with Fodera? They glue up and shape their own bodies and necks from scratch.

 

[Tommy Lotus]

Are you saying G&L and Carvin don't have as much experience as Dan? Or they aren't offering products at the same price point? Or what?

If you are going to quote me, quote the whole statement. I'm sorry if the period confused you. G&L basses in this price range only come in 3 or 4 colors and Carvin has an upcharge for certain colors, matching headstock and bone nut. Based on the sucess of the Skyline series in 2001, G&L introduced the Tribute series in 2003. I say all this not to put this companies down but to establish Dan Lakin's contributions and give him the honor he deserves.

 

[awilkie84]

How is it a stretch with Fodera? They glue up and shape their own bodies and necks from scratch.

Not from what I was reading. They use a CNC machine for the rough cuts, as do most high end builders.

 

[fourstringdrums]

G&L basses in this price range only come in 3 or 4 colors

Wrong. If you count their standard AND their premium (translucent) finishes, they have at least 41. I say at least because there are at least one or two finishes that they don't usually mention, but they'll do if you ask. The premium finishes are an upcharge, but even with the upcharge, they're still within this price range...cheaper actually and they come with a hardshell case.

 

[nostatic]

Not from what I was reading. They use a CNC machine for the rough cuts, as do most high end builders.

Maybe splitting hairs but use of CNC isn't really what I'd use for a demarcation line between "factory/mass produced" and "handmade." I believe they use CNC to rough the body shape, but the bodies are all glued in-house as are the necks. Then final carving is by hand. Rob Allen uses CNC to cut rough bodies and necks, but then a lot of hand work goes into getting those pieces (all done in-house, not sourced from some other distributor) into a finished piece.

I'm sure there are factories around the world where CNC isn't used and instead they just throw cheap/unskilled labor at the problem. The key is the quality of the materials and the experience/execution of the builder. It is a sliding scale, but if you calculate the number of hours a well-trained human puts his/her hands on an instrument during construction, you'll find Fodera at the upper end of the scale.

 

[jim nolte]

Maybe splitting hairs but use of CNC isn't really what I'd use for a demarcation line between "factory/mass produced" and "handmade." I believe they use CNC to rough the body shape, but the bodies are all glued in-house as are the necks. Then final carving is by hand. Rob Allen uses CNC to cut rough bodies and necks, but then a lot of hand work goes into getting those pieces (all done in-house, not sourced from some other distributor) into a finished piece.

I'm sure there are factories around the world where CNC isn't used and instead they just throw cheap/unskilled labor at the problem. The key is the quality of the materials and the experience/execution of the builder. It is a sliding scale, but if you calculate the number of hours a well-trained human puts his/her hands on an instrument during construction, you'll find Fodera at the upper end of the scale.

Well, I think Fbass ,my main bass, is still hand carved from scratch and no cheap labor! Look, I wish Dan all the luck in the world, he is truly one of the good guys in the business and am personally astounded by some of the acrimony directed toward his new adventure here. Just give us more options for pickguards other than white,make a great 5 string in either 34, 34.5, or 35 inch scale, and I think all will be well for him! Jim

 

[Tommy Lotus]

Wrong. If you count their standard AND their premium (translucent) finishes, they have at least 41. I say at least because there are at least one or two finishes that they don't usually mention, but they'll do if you ask. The premium finishes are an upcharge, but even with the upcharge, they're still within this price range...cheaper actually and they come with a hardshell case.

G&L Tribute series basses are only offered in 3 or 4 colors like I said. The USA series of basses has a variety of colors for an upcharge. Last I checked this series starts off at around $1400. Lakin basses offer hundreds of colors at no upcharge.

 

[fourstringdrums]

G&L Tribute series basses are only offered in 3 or 4 colors like I said. The USA series of basses has a variety of colors for an upcharge. Last I checked this series starts off at around $1400. Lakin basses offer hundreds of colors at no upcharge.

The USA series is in the same price range as Dan. The only upcharge is for premium finishes and it's $100. But even with the upcharge, it's still in the price range and a little cheaper. My LB100 was 1200 with a premium finish and a case. Dan is selling for 1250 with no case. And I actually asked him about a natural gloss and that would have been an upcharge. The only problem where they might seem more expensive is if you go to the wrong dealer. Some places like Jim's Music in Tustin, CA offers them for less than other dealers.

 

[awilkie84]

Maybe splitting hairs but use of CNC isn't really what I'd use for a demarcation line between "factory/mass produced" and "handmade." I believe they use CNC to rough the body shape, but the bodies are all glued in-house as are the necks. Then final carving is by hand. Rob Allen uses CNC to cut rough bodies and necks, but then a lot of hand work goes into getting those pieces (all done in-house, not sourced from some other distributor) into a finished piece.

I'm sure there are factories around the world where CNC isn't used and instead they just throw cheap/unskilled labor at the problem. The key is the quality of the materials and the experience/execution of the builder. It is a sliding scale, but if you calculate the number of hours a well-trained human puts his/her hands on an instrument during construction, you'll find Fodera at the upper end of the scale.

I didn't say factory/mass produced, but they're definitely not all hand-made. That's not to say they're a poor product, far from...they're just not done all by hand, as some would believe.

 

[StayLow]

I haven't read the thread---just snippets---and I'm not a Jazz or P guy either. Haven't played Dan's basses either. We ran into each other in the store and he was telling me about the basses.

In talking to other uber high end custom bass makers, it seems that the paradigm that we associate with Korean made stuff might need some rethinking. One guy that I won't mention used all of the most expensive, high end pickups out there in his basses. He heard about a great Korean pickup manufacturer out there gave them specs and the pickups they made were much better in sound and quality than the uber expensive US and European pickups. And for a lot less money. I think that Korea is where Japan was in the 70's. It was viewed as "cheap" but evolved into the highest quality production in the world.

I'll make it down to Dan's to try them. I remember when Dan called me to come over when the first Skyline prototype arrived. He opened the door and was shaking his head. I said "that bad?" and he said "no, that good".

And I think that production in Korea has improved a lot since then.

I'd love to know how pickups anywhere can be made "much better" than the best US or European pickups.

I've nothing against products made overseas. Ridiculous hyperbole does chap me, however.

 

[awilkie84]

I'd love to know how pickups anywhere can be made "much better" than the best US or European pickups.

I've nothing against products made overseas. Ridiculous hyperbole does chap me, however.

The ridiculous hyperbole is the belief that the USA & Europe will always produce exponentially better products than anywhere else in the world. We don't live in the 1960's anymore, people.

 

[StayLow]

The ridiculous hyperbole is the belief that the USA & Europe will always produce exponentially better products than anywhere else in the world. We don't live in the 1960's anymore, people.

That has nothing to do with my post(s) on the topic, or the post I quoted.

Would you care to suggest how a pickup made anywhere, including in the USA, could possibly be "much better", empirically, than those already made by the best pickup makers in the US or Europe?

 

[awilkie84]

That has nothing to do with my post(s) on the topic, or the post I quoted.

Would you care to suggest how a pickup made anywhere, including in the USA, could possibly be "much better", empirically, than those already made by the best pickup makers in the US or Europe?

"The Best" when it comes to music is completely subjective to the user's tastes. There's no way to empirically prove that one is "Much better" or "made by the best". It's all in the users' hands/head.

 

[NWB]

G&L Tribute series basses are only offered in 3 or 4 colors like I said. The USA series of basses has a variety of colors for an upcharge. Last I checked this series starts off at around $1400. Lakin basses offer hundreds of colors at no upcharge.

I didn't see it anywhere, but are the Lakin basses Plek'd like a US G&L?

 

[basspraiser]

I didn't see it anywhere, but are the Lakin basses Plek'd like a US G&L?

No they are not pkekd .... Dan checks the frets and hand finishes any issues
As an aside the frets on all of the basses I saw were great.

 

[StayLow]

"The Best" when it comes to music is completely subjective to the user's tastes. There's no way to empirically prove that one is "Much better" or "made by the best". It's all in the users' hands/head.

Exactly, so if people STFU with ridiculous hyperbole they might be taken seriously and their posts or threads might not backfire.


Say it straight up, "I'm a teen-aged fanboy" or "I'm prone to extreme exaggeration mis-wrapped in objective assertions" and people can respect that and take their grains of salt instead of understandably and justifiably raging against the BS.

That's the best way to help your builder friends/heros out.