Naked Strings: First Impressions (Custom set .30 .45 .60 .85)

[seanm]

Hey Seanm,

We are in the process of making Stainless Steel Roundwounds now and are scheduled to launch them next month. I do see us getting into flats and tapered B's and E's sometime next year. Stay tuned!

 

[ehque]

If the string is coming off the post with the thick outer winding wrapped around, you can probably see a slight arc in the string from post to the nut. That arc is flexible because of this bowing (like a hunting bow), creating much more of a possibility for slack than a straight, taut string between these two points.

If this is the only problem you have with winding full thickness strings on a peg, i assure you that the same situation happens at your bridge and nut each time you restring, and can be rectified by gently but firmly pushing down on the string.

 

[PhatBasstard]

If this is the only problem you have with winding full thickness strings on a peg, i assure you that the same situation happens at your bridge and nut each time you restring, and can be rectified by gently but firmly pushing down on the string.

Sorry, wrong.
Those two witness points do not function the same.
Your kink at your pushing point (tuner post) becomes irrelavent if you have to adjust pitch upward, and possibly detrimental if you have to adjust downward.
Doing this at the bridge, where the string break is relatively static, is a totally different ballgame.

 

[PhatBasstard]

Wow! I have not been on here in awhile and look what I have missed! Apparently someone has determined that we make "Budget" strings and that I'm "full of it" or "deluding myself". I guess that's to be expected when entering the forums as the world is infested with Haters.

The truth is that our "Budget" strings are made from the same materials supplied by the same wire suppliers and with similar winding techniques as the rest of the American string manufacturers. If you need to pay $40 to $60 a set to boost your ego than by all means continue. But we will keep making Professional quality strings and selling them at wholesale prices to the public. If you do not get that, totally cool. Just please move on and give your money to another string company's marketing department. The response to our products has been overwhelming since we launched in September and we are now shipping orders to every corner of the world. Thank you to everyone for the support.

It's nice to see you spend the same amount of time comprehending the info here as marketing your strings.

I see you conveniently left out the parts where I said your string is very possibly of excellent quality.
It's just the problem of the one size fits all approach.

I'm not alone in this view point.
I severely doubt manufacturers like Roger Sadowsky or Mike Tobias or Mike Lull, guys that are known for puting out instruments with optimum set ups, are going to be buying strings from you in the near future for their instruments with only a 38" winding to work with.

Also, if you're paying upwards of $60 a set for any major brand of bass string (at least in the US), you need to shop somewhere else.
I pay anywhere (4 string set) from $18 to $24 bucks a set depending on source.
Where were you buying your strings before attempting to manufacture your own?!?

As far as the "full of it" comment, a little harsh and I appologize.
But no one that does any mass marketing has "zero" complaints.
Either this is a dishonest statement or you are not doing the big numbers you infer (Plus, you're early in the game. They're coming.).

You're also not going to see many potential complaints of dissatisfaction as many players that do care about an "optimum" set up will not buy your strings for their 34" Fender style set up basses because of this 38" winding.

I don't have an agenda folks.
I'm just trying to explain to those that typically don't think or comprehend this type of minutiae (and most players don't...they just play) why this can be a problem. Just trying to help.
("You need me on that wall! You want me on that wall!"...OK, maybe some of you don't...)

 

[PhatBasstard]

1. P bass for the win!

2. These strings where super stable from the start. I would go months between turning a tuner when I kept the bass in a hard shell case. Again, P basses for the win.

3. I am not super critical about intonation. If it is within a couple of cents that is good enough for me.

A P-bass is fine. One trick pony, but fine. I own one.

Regardless of how "stable" you thought your string was from the start, simple physics dictates your tuning ratio is severely compromised once the thick winding starts wrapping around the post.

 

[F-Clef-Jef]

Not "whining",
but if they're just tools for you,
I guess you're more in the Earl the Sanitation Guy camp than the Jimmie Johnson camp. Fine. Enjoy your dump truck.

Take your own advice.
If you don't like the "discussion" (TalkBass, hello?!?), go somewhere else where the details aren't so taxing.

Yeah, I must be in that camp. I'll just sulk my way back to my "dump truck". I guess you are way too smart for the likes of me...

(PS: Chaz - I still love your strings anyway! Best of luck to you!)

 

[PhatBasstard]

Yeah, I must be in that camp. I'll just sulk my way back to my "dump truck". I guess you are way too smart for the likes of me...

Glad you saw the light.
BTW, you missed a bag last Wednesday.

 

[sunbeast]

I doubt anyone expects perfection from a set of strings that cost them less than $10 a set. The information has been stated and people can make up their own minds.

Gotta love the way people will treat each other anonymously via the internet! Anyone can be an "expert", a "pro", a physicist, an engineer, or whatever they choose from the comfort of their own homes. Fortunately Jimmie Johnson never needed to troll internet forums to prove his worth to anyone.

 

[Hutzbordello]

I doubt anyone expects perfection from a set of strings that cost them less than $10 a set. The information has been stated and people can make up their own minds.

Gotta love the way people will treat each other anonymously via the internet! Anyone can be an "expert", a "pro", a physicist, an engineer, or whatever they choose from the comfort of their own homes. Fortunately Jimmie Johnson never needed to troll internet forums to prove his worth to anyone.

+1

this all seems kinda pointless

 

[PhatBasstard]

"Troll" and "pointless", huh?!

Fine. Done.

I don't have to "prove" my worth to anyone (least of all you, Jr.).
I know what I've done and am still capable of doing (trying to inform the uninformed apparently isn't part of it).

I guess you guys missed the "Talk" part in TalkBass.

Whatever.

:scowl:

 

[F-Clef-Jef]

Okay, I definitely don't completely disagree that having the E or B string with only the wire/silk core going around the tuning peg would be optimal, where do you find that length info? I was just on the Rotosound website, and although they do give the "long scale" "short scale" name, the actual winding length specs are nowhere to be found. (Edit:, I did find the Rotosound info Invalid Link Removed there is a link waaay at the bottom of the chart.) [Invalid or Expired Link Removed] only gives some vague ranges (which happen to overlap at 34" scale... )

PhatBasstard, do you know if there is a database, or, which websites give that info? While some of us aren't overly concerned with it, some players obviously are, and that info would be nice to have available.

 

[PhatBasstard]

Okay, I definitely don't completely disagree that having the E or B string with only the wire/silk core going around the tuning peg would be optimal, where do you find that length info? I was just on the Rotosound website, and although they do give the "long scale" "short scale" name, the actual winding length specs are nowhere to be found. (Edit:, I did find the Rotosound info Invalid Link Removed there is a link waaay at the bottom of the chart.) [Invalid or Expired Link Removed] only gives some vague ranges (which happen to overlap at 34" scale... )

PhatBasstard, do you know if there is a database, or, which websites give that info? While some of us aren't overly concerned with it, some players obviously are, and that info would be nice to have available.

OK, I'm calm, ohmmmmmm, ohmmmmm.
Merry Christmas everybody.

I'm not sure what overlap you're seeing.
One scale picks up were the other leaves off (kind of like underwear sizes )
This is what D'Addario has posted:
Length String Scale Required
Up to 32" D’Addario Short
32” to 34” D’Addario Medium
34” to 36” D’Addario Long
36” to 38” D’Addario Super Long
These are actually incorrect.
I've probably been through (just myself) 400+ sets of D'Addarios (Long and Super Longs)
and know for a fact the the Longs won't work for a 36" scale. They just barely (sometimes not) reach on my 35" scale (I've tried).
Pull all those scale lengths back 1.5 inches and you've got the applicable truth.

Most major string manufacturers wind their strings, for a Fender style 34" stringing, to the 36 to 36.5" range,
So figure that will be optimum (there's that word again) for most basses of this most common of configurations.

Figure this extra 2 to 2.5 inches of winding added to the max scale length of each set/string. This formula will work with almost every standard configuration of bass with a given scale length.

Are there exceptions? Sure.
I myself use D'Addarios. I also play Spectors exclusively.
The B string post on a Spector 6 string is closer to the nut than on many other 6 strings.
D'Addario's SL sets are meant to be able to be used with up to a 36" scale.
Due to this extra available inch, every so often the outer winding of the B may just starts to hit the post at pitch (any given B, E, or A may have one or two extra or less wrap arounds).
I like D'Addarios and this only happens once in a while. Plus I've devised an easy fix for this occasional small discrepancy.

The point is D'Addario realizes that this winding length is optimum ninja for most 35" to 36" scale basses.

I'm not sure of any database for this as the simple general rule seems to be 2 to 2.5 extra inches of winding over the max given scale length applicable to a basic Fender style stringing configuration.

 

[ixlramp]

That D'Addario data is often misquoted, in fact they ask you to measure the distance from ball-end to nut and then refer to the data:

"Step 1. Mark the lowest gauge string at the nut with a marker.

Step 2. Remove the string and measure from the mark to the inner edge of the ball end & refer below.

Up to 32" D'Addario Short Scale

32"-34" D'Addario Medium Scale

34" - 36" D'Addario Long Scale

36" - 38" D'Addario Extra Long Scale"

Except now they have lengthened the long scale winding to 36&1/4":

This is from Mola Ram's post: http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showpost.php?p=9931399&postcount=14

"I jsut got a response from an email I sent to D'Addario's Customer Service ..... They also included a file that contained all of their string lengths and this is what is listed for their bass series:

All string lengths are wound & trimmed at 48”
[Winding] Lengths
Short = 32” Taper
Medium =34” Taper
Long = 36 ¼” Taper
Super Long = 38” Taper"

I have replaced his use of 'Scale lengths' with '[Winding] Lengths'.

 

[ixlramp]

fourstringbliss started a string winding database here: http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=712837

Here's Circle K Strings' technical drawing pdf with measurements: Link Removed

 

[ixlramp]

"Please Note
When fitting Rotosound Bass Strings, be sure that the silked part of the string ONLY is wound around the machine post. If the speaking length of the string is wound around the post, the string may then be prone to breakage. This type of breakage is not covered by our normal warranty.

String Lengths - Ballend to Silk
Short Scale
32.5

820

Medium Scale
35.25

895

Long Scale
37

940

Extra Long Scale
39.25

995"

From Invalid Link Removed

 

[PhatBasstard]

All string lengths are wound & trimmed at 48”
[Winding] Lengths
Short = 32” Taper
Medium =34” Taper
Long = 36 ¼” Taper
Super Long = 38” Taper"

I have replaced his use of 'Scale lengths' with '[Winding] Lengths'.

Yes. This makes much more sense.
I also must have the old Long length as the winding on mine just stops literally in the middle of the nut on my 35" scale Spectors, forcing me to use the SL's.
I buy in bulk so I may still have the old winding lengths.
An extra 1/4" would make the L's just long enough for my Spectors with 35" scale.

 

[PhatBasstard]

"Please Note
When fitting Rotosound Bass Strings, be sure that the silked part of the string ONLY is wound around the machine post. If the speaking length of the string is wound around the post, the string may then be prone to breakage.

This is another negative to the outer winding being on the post I wasn't even aware of, but makes sense.

 

[Lesfunk]

Does anybody know if they make a taper wound B string? I couldn't find one on their web site

 

[ixlramp]

Lesfunk,

Hey Seanm,

We are in the process of making Stainless Steel Roundwounds now and are scheduled to launch them next month. I do see us getting into flats and tapered B's and E's sometime next year. Stay tuned!

 

[christw]

I forgot to make more samples for these. I'm considering slapping a set on my Ric too. I'll craft a "it's been some time and I think..." review for them as well later this week.