new amp day!!! Ashdown Little Bastard

[Bassman62]

Um, yeah.

So you can do one of two things for live work...

1. Mic it.

2. Run a speaker level DI between the speaker out and the cab.

I used to do #2 but the mic works a million times better IMHO. Of course, not getting the concept of the B-15 or LB, you probably don't get the concept of micing a bass cab, either

EDIT: Just saw your equipment list..Orange and Fender tube heads...maybe you DO get the concept of micing a cab

I've never put a mic in front of a Bass cab always used di.
Can you explain your item 2.

 

[KPJ]

So in reality your LB is just a stage monitor your FOH is still solid state. and that is the point I'm making it is not a stand alone true backline amp.
No disrespect meant to LB owners.

For YOUR purposes it may not be a stand alone backline amp, but it is for ME. It sounds great on stage and I will mic it in the future to get more of the tube tone, or use a DI box in line with the speaker out. Even using the amp's DI, I am utilizing the tube preamp and it sounds damn good through my FOH. JimmyM is definitely my inspiration in going this route. Love low powered tube amps!

 

[KPJ]

I've never put a mic in front of a Bass cab always used di.
Can you explain your item 2.

Radial JDI

Plug a DI like this one in line with your speaker and engage the -30db pad.

 

[Downunderwonder]

Having played a handful of gigs with my 50W tube amp I sold it and got a big bugger. Loved the tone but clean power was lacking for playing with a big band.

It's not easy to judge how loud you need to be for a band until you're playing with the band and even then you can come unstuck. Rehearsals were great, but the band was so much louder on stage it couldn't provide monitoring.

I think you'll find two groups gigging these Ashdowns. First are serious professionals playing with other serious professionals who can keep the stage volume in check. Like Jimmy. The other is rockers in little pubs in UK where the full on grindy tone is what's wanted. Like McSleasy.

Some might think the same amp pleasing both groups is a ringing endorsement to go buy one. Sadly Ashdown didn't bend the laws of physics with James Deans' mojo.

 

[rodl2005]

Radial JDI

Plug a DI like this one in line with your speaker and engage the -30db pad.

Forgive my noobiness I've never used one like this, so....
You go OUT of tube amp - from the speaker out jack- INTO the RADIAL JDI, then outta the JDI - INTO your cab... is this correct?

As tube amps must have a LOAD does this 'act' as a load- i.e. can you then use the amp WITHOUT a cab, or does the cab HAVE to be "in the line"???

 

[KPJ]

Forgive my noobiness I've never used one like this, so....
You go OUT of tube amp - from the speaker out jack- INTO the RADIAL JDI, then outta the JDI - INTO your cab... is this correct?

As tube amps must have a LOAD does this 'act' as a load- i.e. can you then use the amp WITHOUT a cab, or does the cab HAVE to be "in the line"???

You need to plug in to the cab still for a tube amp. The DI does not present a load to the amp.

 

[rodl2005]

Ok. Thanx. Still, be nice to get the total amp sound...

 

[JimmyM]

I've never put a mic in front of a Bass cab always used di.
Can you explain your item 2.

Wow, what a shame, dude. Got those nice tube amps and you never mic'ed the cab. Try it sometime.

Item 2 was already explained.

 

[rodl2005]

I play probly 50-60% of the time
D.I'd
Whenever the S.E. mic'd the cab, they've always remarked that it's a better bass tone out front. Most of those times,I , of course, don't hear the F.O.H., but at least I know that the sound outta my whole rig's going out front.

 

[Bassman62]

Wow, what a shame, dude. Got those nice tube amps and you never mic'ed the cab. Try it sometime.

Item 2 was already explained.

This was my 70s rig:-

Along with my 65 Jazz Bass arguably the best I've owned, very few bands used FOH support, even the Orange Graphic 120 would struggle on many of the larger the UKs Working Mens Club concert rooms.
Arguing that a 30 watt amp can really cut it on it's own makes a mockery as to why more powerful amps were built, right now I'm looking at either a 200 watt Matamp (Matamp® - Welcome to the official MATAMP Amplification Factory Website) which are the true gems of the UKs hand built all tube/valve amps or a 200 watt custom built version of the Fender Bassman 100.
What I do have to fall back on is 49 years of continuous gigging through too many rigs to remember.

 

[Downunderwonder]

A 30W can cut it if the band is relying on FOH to make the big noise and happy to play down to the bass amp's dynamic.

 

[Korladis]

And what are you going to use to drive them.

The B-15, obviously.

 

[sad_katz]

And what are you going to use to drive them.

The B-15/LB-30? Any single watt of input can generate sound from the 810. A 2500 watt 8-PRO or 200W Matamp will of course be louder (and cleaner), but that doesn't mean a low watt amp can't dance with the big cabs. Just because the LB-30 can't fill your needs, doesn't make it a total crap for everybody else

And as already stated, small amps like these are not designed and/or purposed for filling big rooms with loud, clean sound. It's for people who like the tube tone but can't be arsed to carry or buy the big ones and have other means to reinforce the sound (like miking the cab into the FOH).

One can buy the bigger LB-200 head or the 427 head from Ashdown and still have a nice chunk of change. No one should get stuck with the puny LB-30 if they want tube tone.
Last I check, ~£500 is cheaper than £1500+

 

[Bassman62]

A 30W can cut it if the band is relying on FOH to make the big noise and happy to play down to the bass amp's dynamic.

So what is the point of boasting an all valve/tube head that is actualy being 90% augmented by a solid state PA?
May make sense to those who believe in perpetual motion like "My LB 30 will power an 8x10 without breaking up, getting hot etc".
I like a backline that will stand alone in most situations which is what most uk none stadium gigs are, in most venues FOH is overkill and time consuming unless you're still in the novelty years of gigging and still fantasising about being stadium 'Rock Gods'.

 

[Bassman62]

The B-15/LB-30? Any single watt of input can generate sound from the 810. A 2500 watt 8-PRO or 200W Matamp will of course be louder (and cleaner), but that doesn't mean a low watt amp can't dance with the big cabs. Just because the LB-30 can't fill your needs, doesn't make it a total crap for everybody else

I never said that they were crap, but denying logic and common sense is what products like these are based on. Lounge amps and stage amps are two different things, I put them in the same catagory as the silly 15 watt stater amps that parents are conned into buying.
If you believe that the LB30 can power an 8x10 at performance level then it is either subdued music or an awful loud tone (while the output stage lasts) that is the order of the day.

 

[Bassman62]

It's for people who like the tube tone but can't be arsed to carry or buy the big ones and have other means to reinforce the sound (like miking the cab into the FOH).

I'd rather tote a 200 watt all valve head than a FOH rig.

 

[JimmyM]

This was my 70s rig:-

Nice looking rig and even nicer looking bass!

Along with my 65 Jazz Bass arguably the best I've owned, very few bands used FOH support, even the Orange Graphic 120 would struggle on many of the larger the UKs Working Mens Club concert rooms.
Arguing that a 30 watt amp can really cut it on it's own makes a mockery as to why more powerful amps were built,

Well I guess I need to get out of the business then, because I regularly make a mockery as to why more powerful amps were built, and I couldn't give a rat's ass.

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right now I'm looking at either a 200 watt Matamp (Matamp® - Welcome to the official MATAMP Amplification Factory Website) which are the true gems of the UKs hand built all tube/valve amps or a 200 watt custom built version of the Fender Bassman 100.
What I do have to fall back on is 49 years of continuous gigging through too many rigs to remember.

What does that have to do with anything? So you're saying that because you couldn't make a B-15 work, nobody could? Total crap and nonsense. Not only have I made it work with PA, I have made it work many times WITHOUT PA, in as large as an 800 seat theater. My band is not extremely loud, but we're not quiet, either. The only time I ever came close to struggling was when I played a 150 seat nightclub doing classic rock. Started out just fine, but then the guitarist kept turning up and up, so I did, too At the end of the last set, I was distorting a little. Sounded good, though.

Some of need more wattage...some of us don't. But don't try to tell me I do when it's painfully obvious that I and many of us who gig our B-15's don't. Thank you.

BTW, my B-15 is the 25w version, so there!

 

[JimmyM]

I never said that they were crap, but denying logic and common sense is what products like these are based on. Lounge amps and stage amps are two different things, I put them in the same catagory as the silly 15 watt stater amps that parents are conned into buying.

You put the most recorded bass amp of all time in the same category as 15 watt starter amps? Totally insane.

If you believe that the LB30 can power an 8x10 at performance level then it is either subdued music or an awful loud tone (while the output stage lasts) that is the order of the day.

Wow, what a shame...here it is Christmas and you've done lost all your credibility. That so-called "awful" loud tone is a tone enjoyed by tons of bass players, including me. And like I said, I've played 800 seat theaters with mine using stage volume, and I still had plenty of clean headroom left.

Oh, and about that 15w starter amp? Well mine is a little more hefty than that (25w), but it's most definitely a starter amp. A starter amp that sounds pretty freakin' awesome for low volume stuff. And here it is on my weekly 30's-40's jazz gig:

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I'd quit while you're behind.

 

[Korladis]

So what is the point of boasting an all valve/tube head that is actualy being 90% augmented by a solid state PA?
May make sense to those who believe in perpetual motion like "My LB 30 will power an 8x10 without breaking up, getting hot etc".
I like a backline that will stand alone in most situations which is what most uk none stadium gigs are, in most venues FOH is overkill and time consuming unless you're still in the novelty years of gigging and still fantasising about being stadium 'Rock Gods'.

PA's are designed to (ideally) transparently put out the same sound that you put into them, only louder. Bass amps and cabs generally are not (though there are some exceptions). If the PA is working well enough, and you mic the cab of the LB30, then you are getting the tube amp's (and the cab's) tone, only louder.

Last gig I did, I could have used a 25 watt head and had plenty of clean headroom. In fact, a 5 watt head might have been better. Sometimes I play tiny venues where the band can't be that loud.

 

[Korladis]

I never said that they were crap, but denying logic and common sense is what products like these are based on. Lounge amps and stage amps are two different things, I put them in the same catagory as the silly 15 watt stater amps that parents are conned into buying.
If you believe that the LB30 can power an 8x10 at performance level then it is either subdued music or an awful loud tone (while the output stage lasts) that is the order of the day.

From what I've read on here, a 30 watt tube head will be about half as loud as a 300 watt one (takes 10 times the power to get twice as loud).

An 8x10 is a serious cab. It can get pretty damn loud without much power.

As well, that distorted tone you're calling "awful" is what some people are going for with a tube amp (don't say "use a pedal"; I guarantee you that the vast majority of players who get overdrive from their amp have already heard and probably tried that suggestion). Getting 300 watts of tube amp to distort nicely requires turning up a bit louder than most venues are really happy with.

Just because an amp doesn't suit your needs doesn't mean that nobody should use it or might like to have it.