• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join freeLog in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

New developments, promising science

Somewhat related question: what was the verdict on "isobaric" cabs (e.g. Orange OBC212), which IIRC had some buzz 5-10 years ago? They seem to have since fallen out of favor.
Isobaric cabs might save space but they'll be relatively heavy, what with the second driver and interior baffle and so on. Probably not so bad for home audio, where speakers aren't going to be moved around much once they're in place, but suboptimal for pro audio.

I was thinking the head is like a speaker cab and could "throw" sound.
 
  • Like
Reactions: S-Bigbottom
They're pretty damn good and it's amazing that they're probably the best measuring mid driver and it's a 40yo design.

I lucked onto the non S pair by chance and then was offered the S, and even though I didn't have a project for them, I had to buy. The Volts are about as good as the non S in many ways and still available. Not cheap though.

I can see why they stopped selling them to the competition. I've wondered how PMC's version compares.

I have some T25A, but haven't had a chance to play with them yet. If I get some of the M75B for myself, I'll get the T25B as well and make my idea of the Yamaha NS1000M, but active and with much, much better enclosures. As I already have the amps, cost looks like being not much more than a mint set of the Yammies.

There wouldn't be much out there as revealing and dynamic in that size class. I would be tempted to print some shallow waveguides for them.

What in my dreams I'd like to see would be the Bleisma dome with the Link Removed motor. I just don't want to have to pay for it.

I want some of the Accutons too, but I'm trying to fund a Klippel rig.

It does seem like he's aiming to top his designs at Accuton. Probably just a matter of time.

Klippel rig is serious business....I'll just have to trust that Voice Coil bench tests hold up in reality.
 
I've wondered how PMC's version compares.
I have no idea, but I would expect it to be a close copy.

There wouldn't be much out there as revealing and dynamic in that size class. I would be tempted to print some shallow waveguides for them.
I'd like that but I'm trying to get the C-C as close as possible.

Klippel rig is serious business....I'll just have to trust that Voice Coil bench tests hold up in reality.
I know, I'm the same at the moment WRT VC, but I might be able to convince my partner's SO it's a good investment. She's fair, but a very hard sell especially as my current measurement rig is pretty good, just manual and I'll soon have a fantastic new outdoor measurement location.

I've been wanting to do a new fEarful type design, or a number of them; I was already using a JBL based 15/10/1 3 way when I first saw the GB design ideas so I'm a long time fan of the concept. Maybe in 12mo or so when I have some time, but I'll be doing a modular one for me using drivers I have on hand sooner than that.
 
Any chance, in regards to large-venue testing, are you guys talking about this? ( from the December Mix magazine ). Not affiliated, just jealous of the guys that can gear-up a playbox like this.

upload_2021-11-23_21-10-25.png
 
I know, I'm the same at the moment WRT VC, but I might be able to convince my partner's SO it's a good investment. She's fair, but a very hard sell especially as my current measurement rig is pretty good, just manual and I'll soon have a fantastic new outdoor measurement location.

I've been wanting to do a new fEarful type design, or a number of them; I was already using a JBL based 15/10/1 3 way when I first saw the GB design ideas so I'm a long time fan of the concept. Maybe in 12mo or so when I have some time, but I'll be doing a modular one for me using drivers I have on hand sooner than that.

That's one reason I moved back to the farm. No one calls the cops when running high level outdoor sweeps.

I've been playing with various tri/bi-amped configurations for several years now. A large format compression driver crossed at 800hz to various woofer combinations has been working out great lately.

I'm going to try an over damped vented alignment 4x8 with the horn mounted in between the two pairs.
I'll run a 1x15 under it with a more typical alignment.
Each cab will reach their respective xmax limits with the same amp channel but the 4x8 will have more mid range sensitivity.
Trying for a perceptual 3-way point source with the two channels of a GXD8. And to use up drivers on hand...

Also have a small bi-amped 15/6 planned using a BMS 15N850-4, passive radiators, and a Dayton 6" full range. Excellent results during testing. This rig makes a lot of noise in a small package if you have some good voltage swing available. Great dispersion and extension from the 6".
 
Sounds like you've been reading my notebooks.

That's one reason I moved back to the farm. No one calls the cops when running high level outdoor sweeps.
I know that feeling. I'm currently in an apartment in a large city and am moving back to a small village of maybe 1500, outside a town maybe 5x that at most. I'm surrounded by water and National Parks there, and have a flat mown football foeld size are to measure in not far from the house. Mains power there too.

I've been playing with various tri/bi-amped configurations for several years now. A large format compression driver crossed at 800hz to various woofer combinations has been working out great lately.
With few exceptions, I stopped passive speakers in the late 80s and went DSP as soon as I could in the early 2ks. All of my hifi/HT speakers are tri/quad - amped. The notebook on the desk in front of me has several dozen more designs to whittle down into final ideas. Some will be too hard to make until the CNC arrives and is sorted.

I have a large single Al horn that I want to use in a BG rig, though it's a bit heavy and the only 2" driver I have is Fe magged and also heavy, but I have the perfect NIB 15" driver to go under it, so for some wood to use it, why not? No one else will have anything like it. I might just passively cross this and use it with the HB Block 800B amp.

Also have a small bi-amped 15/6 planned using a BMS 15N850-4, passive radiators, and a Dayton 6" full range. Excellent results during testing. This rig makes a lot of noise in a small package if you have some good voltage swing available. Great dispersion and extension from the 6".
BMS are really hard to get here and the US distributor is a PITA; they wanted me to be their distributor down here when I first purchased some of the coax CDs, but I wasn't set up at the time and the market is limited. There are a few I'd like to try though. The Italian drivers are much easier to source for me; Faital, Beyma, 18Sound, RCF and B&C. I'd probably have 100+ of these brands here and about as many JBLs.

Is the Dayton the PS180? This and it's big sister and the PM series are some I want to try later.

Trying for a perceptual 3-way point source with the two channels of a GXD8. And to use up drivers on hand...
I think I know exactly where you're going here, but if I say any more my partner will kill me as he says he might want to commercialise it later, so shut up. I'm big on controlled directivity and PS designs.
 
  • Like
Reactions: fast slapper
Any chance, in regards to large-venue testing, are you guys talking about this? ( from the December Mix magazine ). Not affiliated, just jealous of the guys that can gear-up a playbox like this.
That sounds like it's going to be a great facility and I wish I had one like it locally. And I was 30y younger to take more advantage of it. Tennessee is one of the few states in the US I'd consider moving to.
 
  • Like
Reactions: CryingBass
I wonder if graphene might be useful for speaker cone material.

I do know that graphene has enormous potential for a multitude of electronics, including sound amplifiers and processors.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graphene
It's already being used in the driver's for iem's I can see it being used in all kinds of cool stuff in the future like self charging batteries
 
  • Like
Reactions: hbarcat
I wonder if graphene might be useful for speaker cone material.

I do know that graphene has enormous potential for a multitude of electronics, including sound amplifiers and processors.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graphene
Now this is innovation that might actually mean something to us. From a couple articles I read, it sounds like it's going to be too clean for a bass amp :D but I guess that's good for PA and stereo.
 
With few exceptions, I stopped passive speakers in the late 80s and went DSP as soon as I could in the early 2ks. All of my hifi/HT speakers are tri/quad - amped. The notebook on the desk in front of me has several dozen more designs to whittle down into final ideas. Some will be too hard to make until the CNC arrives and is sorted.

I have a large single Al horn that I want to use in a BG rig, though it's a bit heavy and the only 2" driver I have is Fe magged and also heavy, but I have the perfect NIB 15" driver to go under it, so for some wood to use it, why not? No one else will have anything like it. I might just passively cross this and use it with the HB Block 800B amp.

It's definitely become a life long hobby for me up to this point. More reading and tinkering than listening lately. Hope to change that soon.

Those Thomann house products look hard to beat for value. I've considered that amp and their dsp crossovers before. That would be a nice hi-fi rig at a good price. I'm using the 18Sound ND3SN on the Ciare PR614 on top of a 15NLW9300 for now.

BMS are really hard to get here and the US distributor is a PITA; they wanted me to be their distributor down here when I first purchased some of the coax CDs, but I wasn't set up at the time and the market is limited. There are a few I'd like to try though. The Italian drivers are much easier to source for me; Faital, Beyma, 18Sound, RCF and B&C. I'd probably have 100+ of these brands here and about as many JBLs.

I'll go through TLHP for most of the European brands from now on. They've been easy to deal with so far. Couldnt get an answer from the US distributor over a recone kit. BMS makes a great sounding driver but not as rugged as the Italian drivers I have on hand. Don't forget to set the hp filter....

Wish JBL sold current generation drivers.

Is the Dayton the PS180? This and it's big sister and the PM series are some I want to try later.

I tried it but the beaming was a bit much for me.

The PS65LP has better dispersion. Does well used above 400hz.
https://www.parts-express.com/Dayto...t-Low-Profile-Full-Range-Driver-4-Ohm-295-348
 
I'm using the 18Sound ND3SN on the Ciare PR614 on top of a 15NLW9300 for now.
The 18Sounds are nice drivers. I have some XT1086 and XR2064 flares and ND1090 1" CDs plus the great 15ND930. The Ciare flare had slid under my radar but it has excellent DI; looks new so it might be from after 18Sound bought them out.

I'll go through TLHP for most of the European brands from now on. They've been easy to deal with so far.
My experience too, but they can be a little spendy to here with shipping.

BMS makes a great sounding driver but not as rugged as the Italian drivers I have on hand.
Interesting. The CDs have been good but haven't had any of the cones, not for want of trying. I called and emailed Assistance multiple times years ago to try to order 2 dozen 15 and 18" drivers for a project and got no response. I used some Beyma and RCF instead.

Don't forget to set the hp filter....
Don't worry, I'm a little anal about that and always have a 2nd order just below tune.

Wish JBL sold current generation drivers.
Some of them you can get as spares, but the heaps of 2226 I have are still great drivers so I'll keep using them until I find something that measures better and is affordable.

I tried it but the beaming was a bit much for me.

The PS65LP has better dispersion. Does well used above 400hz.
https://www.parts-express.com/Dayto...t-Low-Profile-Full-Range-Driver-4-Ohm-295-348
I'd missed that one and might get one to test; just checked the local importer doesn't have them (oops, yes they do), but I need to get some other stuff from them so I'll add it to that order. Cheers.
However, it's a hifi driver and you maybe shouldn't use it as I was pilloried for using hifi drivers even for a living room practice rig.

Have a great Thanksgiving.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: fast slapper
Last edited:
Batteries. I think they will continue to evolve in capacity and lifespan, and the support technologies such as charging circuitry will improve too.

I was about to think that nothing can be invented that would improve my life as a bassist, as I'm already down to 17 pounds for amp + speaker + cables. But even further simplifying my setup would be a convenience as bands move out of the traditional bar / restaurant setting in search of playing opportunities. For instance in the past two years, I've played outdoor jams, driveway concerts, etc. And I don't need a lot of sound, so I might be ready for batteries before the rockers are.

This is what caught my eye today. I hope more of this kind of thing is on the horizon:

https://mackie.com/products/thump-go-portable-battery-powered-loudspeaker
 
I'll wait until someone brings "wire quality reliability to Bluetooth." ;)
I'm more hoping for usable latency levels they already have ldac and aptx hd wich to me sound better then CD quality they also have the ability to stream to multiple devices on Bluetooth 5.2 I'm sure with wifi6 and other new tech coming out its only a matter of time before regular radio frequency wireless is no longer the industry standard for instrument and iem wireless
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2tonic and fdeck

Latest posts