New Musicman Nut Design

[giglawyer]

Amazing how brash one can be with a team of corporate lawyers to back you up.

Cameron

Amazing how brash you can be when you obviously don't have the slightest clue.

 

[cdef]

I'm thinking this must be a system equivalent to the one advertised on http://www.earvana.com/

 

[Ampeg SVT]

it does look similar

 

[bovinehost]

Ha-ha-ha-ha! You've GOT to be joking. They are about as 'family' a business as GM or Pepsi. Maybe it's 'the big family' you're talking about; now that I could believe, but they don't exist.

Um.... It is, in fact, a family business, owned by Sterling Ball, son of Ernie (and friend of mine). Both the older sons work there as well; Scott Ball has been doing some excellent design work lately in conjunction with genius designer/engineer Dudley Gimpel.

In fact, we (by we, I mean the EBMM guys and my family plus quite a few people who loiter here) just had a big party on 4 November. No stockholders were noticed.

So the family certainly does exist, and a better family would be hard to find. They all play instruments and are very passionate about getting good tools into our hands.

Get real, man, they are giant, nameless, faceless corporations, only out for profit.

Link Removed

Can a giant, nameless, faceless corporation play slide with a glass of ice water? That's me on bass, by the way, and the giant, nameless, faceless guy is Sterling Ball. Go figure.

Instruments got better - they didn't - in fact, they got worse. I have owned 4 Fenders - Gibson has never made a decent bass so I never bothered with them - and Music Man's were never really my bag, although the early ones were quite good.

The early ones were quite good, indeed they were. The later ones are even better. QC has improved. Some of the early ones weighed 12, 13, even 14 pounds. That doesn't happen anymore. Plus the Customer Support is top notch.

Amazing how brash one can be with a team of corporate lawyers to back you up.

Once again, you're talking about something you know nothing about, absolutely nothing. He has a team of non-corporate lawyer - one. He plays guitar, too.


Here we see the team of corporate lawyer at work:

Link Removed

Anyway, I've always tried to comment on things I know about. When I'm entirely clueless, I might ask questions or just read some stuff and do some research.

You really hung yourself out to dry on this one. Are you SURE you're a bass player?

Cheers!

Jack

 

[syciprider]

And the Uddered One isn't some big shot corporate CEO that Sterling Ball has to woo. They're just friends enough that Mr. Ball sees it fit to throw a birthday party for him (with average Joes like me invited to go).

 

[bovinehost]

And the Uddered One isn't some big shot corporate CEO

Boy, if that ain't the truth!

 

[ras1983]

if there is any complaint that can be made about EBMM, its that the owner of the company needs to get new shirts!

 

[Jiggybass]

I think they should stop calling it a nut, because the nut has too many either funny, or negative connotations. I think the nut should start getting the respect it deserves and be called something like "the piece that holds the strings in place at the top of the neck", or something more descriptive like that.

my nut is fanned.
i have a plastic nut.
my nut is made of bone.
my nut is thicker in some places.
i just filed my nut.
got a new nut this week.
ernie ball has new nuts.
i have a compensated nut.
my nuts help my intonation.

arrrgh! it just ain't right.

Or, "My nut fell out"

 

[Don Harris]

Compensated nuts aren't a gimmick and are not a new idea, or inspired by Buzz F. It's the specific design that is patented by EB or Earvana, not the concept. Custom guitar builders have done compensated nuts for years, and country acoustic players were known to stick a match stick under the E string next to the nut to help the intonation so that an in tune E string would also play in tune when playing the 3rd fret G. I have done compensated nuts on some of my acoustic and electric guitars and it makes a huge difference, especially on the low E and the B string. It's much easier to not "pull" notes sharp in a chord. I've not done my basses because it doesn't seem to be as much of a problem. But do a test. Tune your open E and then see if an F or an F# isn't just a tad sharp. This is made worse if you tend to play with a lot of left hand pressure on the string. This is what a compensated nut fixes and has nothing to do with the bridge saddle adjustment.

 

[yellofury]

after reading this entire thread I think I need my nuts compensated

who cares?
Is it for the betterment of bassists everywhere? hmm?
then hallelujah amen
now shaddap and play the bass

 

[Bassflute]

Um.... It is, in fact, a family business, owned by Sterling Ball, son of Ernie (and friend of mine). Both the older sons work there as well; Scott Ball has been doing some excellent design work lately in conjunction with genius designer/engineer Dudley Gimpel.

In fact, we (by we, I mean the EBMM guys and my family plus quite a few people who loiter here) just had a big party on 4 November. No stockholders were noticed.

So the family certainly does exist, and a better family would be hard to find. They all play instruments and are very passionate about getting good tools into our hands.

---
Can a giant, nameless, faceless corporation play slide with a glass of ice water? That's me on bass, by the way, and the giant, nameless, faceless guy is Sterling Ball. Go figure.


The early ones were quite good, indeed they were. The later ones are even better. QC has improved. Some of the early ones weighed 12, 13, even 14 pounds. That doesn't happen anymore. Plus the Customer Support is top notch.



Once again, you're talking about something you know nothing about, absolutely nothing. He has a team of non-corporate lawyer - one. He plays guitar, too.


Here we see the team of corporate lawyer at work:

----

Anyway, I've always tried to comment on things I know about. When I'm entirely clueless, I might ask questions or just read some stuff and do some research.

You really hung yourself out to dry on this one. Are you SURE you're a bass player?

Cheers!

Jack

I do know that Ernie Ball is a small company. I was referring to Fender and Gibson which he talked about.

And, yes I know that compensated nuts have been around forever - the idea was revised and improved upon by Feiten, just like zero frets have been around forever but were revised (in the bass world) by Tobias in the 80's - then everyone jumped on board like it was their idea.

And yes I am a cranky old opinionated bass player: and yes I do know what I am talking about. I have two degrees in music, play classical, jazz, and funk with the best players in my city, and I have played bass, flute and piano since I was 10, coming from a family of professional musicians. I can play Brahms, Bartok, and Scriabin on the piano, have studied advanced music theory (theory 500) at university, and read fluently in all clefs.

You can defend your friends by insulting me all you like; the truth is Buzz Feiten was the first to improve upon the old nut design with a compensated nut, and the Ernie Ball corporation is jumping on their bandwagon. Nobody else had thought about it for years. Fender and Gibson will be next - too cheap to pay a licensing fee, but gladly piggyback someone else's marketing and designwork. But quite frankly I couldn't care less about them because their instruments are simply awful. The new Musicman's aren't awful, just very dated and mediocre. They need some intonation help because their frets are too big, causing problems in the low register.

I do, however, love the Bongo - fabulous, except for heavy neck dive and it needs 24 accessible frets and wider (or adjustable) string spacing. Then you'd have a good bass on your hands, and if they ever built a 6 string, I might just get one.

BTW, I bought my first Ernie Ball volume pedal in the early 80's - 25 years ago or so, could be longer than that - a fabulous product, and still in production, and still really good. I have never, however, liked their strings. Its just my opinion, and I am free to voice it here, just like you are free to like them and insult me if you like.

Just don't insult my musicianship because I voiced my opinion on a mass produced mediocre product or you will have a (verbal) fight on your hands.

Twit.

Cheers,
Cameron

 

[jobo4]

\
You really hung yourself out to dry on this one. Are you SURE you're a bass player?

Whoa, SNAP! Best zinger in a long time! Bravo, Bov!

 

[spudmaster34]

Or, "My nut fell out"

All 4 of my nuts are synthetic

 

[Jiggybass]

All 4 of my nuts are synthetic

Bwahahahaha Invalid Link Removed

 

[KarateKid25]

wooooo Lot of attitude kicking around in this nut thread!!


PS: I like nuts

 

[Figjam]

My G string gets caught on my nut.

 

[Alistair R]

My G string gets caught on my nut.

My G string falls out of my nut if I go too hard....

I'm serious!

The new nuts are great, I'm quite annoyed that the older nuts on the older MM's can't be replaced with the newer nuts

 

[Smallequestrian]

I do know that Ernie Ball is a small company. I was referring to Fender and Gibson which he talked about.

Actually, I apologize, there was a typo in my original post, I left off the word "not" as in Ernie Ball is not a huge faceless corporation like Fender or Gibson. Regardless, you still don't know what you are talking about.

And, yes I know that compensated nuts have been around forever - the idea was revised and improved upon by Feiten, just like zero frets have been around forever but were revised (in the bass world) by Tobias in the 80's - then everyone jumped on board like it was their idea.

So by your logic, it was okay for Buzz Feiten to revise and improve on something that was already being done, but if somebody else, god forbid a successful company, wants to revise and improve the same idea, you have determined it is somehow underhanded?

Its a good thing other industries don't work that way, we'd all be driving big V8 fuel inefficient cars and our computers would be about a quarter as powerful.

And yes I am a cranky old opinionated bass player: and yes I do know what I am talking about. I have two degrees in music, play classical, jazz, and funk with the best players in my city, and I have played bass, flute and piano since I was 10, coming from a family of professional musicians. I can play Brahms, Bartok, and Scriabin on the piano, have studied advanced music theory (theory 500) at university, and read fluently in all clefs.

And your point is? There are quite a few of us here that can play more than one instrument. Being talented doesn't excuse ignorance.

You can defend your friends by insulting me all you like; the truth is Buzz Feiten was the first to improve upon the old nut design with a compensated nut, and the Ernie Ball corporation is jumping on their bandwagon. Nobody else had thought about it for years. Fender and Gibson will be next - too cheap to pay a licensing fee, but gladly piggyback someone else's marketing and designwork. But quite frankly I couldn't care less about them because their instruments are simply awful. The new Musicman's aren't awful, just very dated and mediocre. They need some intonation help because their frets are too big, causing problems in the low register.

He is not really defending his friends, he is trying to let you know who these people are. You questioned the assumption that Ernie Ball was not a family run business. Bovine tries to tell you otherwise with examples and facts, and you choose to ignore it. That is being obtuse.

I see you have a pair of Bergantion 1x12's, me too. I don't know how, but somehow I manage to tolerate my mass produced, mediocre Bongos through them.

 

[bovinehost]

I do know that Ernie Ball is a small company. I was referring to Fender and Gibson which he talked about.

That's not what you said initially. Unless you go back and edit your posts from earlier, anyone with rudimentary reading skills can go back and decide whether you're in reverse now.

Let's see.....your exact words regarding EBMM were: "Ha-ha-ha-ha! You've GOT to be joking. They are about as 'family' a business as GM or Pepsi. Maybe it's 'the big family' you're talking about; now that I could believe, but they don't exist."

Hmm. This is the problem with making these grandiose, sweeping statements - they should be grounded in fact because someone might come along and call you on it.

And, yes I know that compensated nuts have been around forever - the idea was revised and improved upon by Feiten, just like zero frets have been around forever but were revised (in the bass world) by Tobias in the 80's - then everyone jumped on board like it was their idea.

So then Buzz ripped someone off? Cutting corners, is he? He wouldn't happen to have a team of corporate lawyers making him all big and brave, would he?

A compensated nut is not very different from an adjustable bridge. Someone came up with the idea and then a lot of other people realized it just might work and - voila. As you say, they've been around a long time. You just thought it would be fun to single out Ernie Ball?

And yes I am a cranky old opinionated bass player: and yes I do know what I am talking about.

You had no idea what you were talking about a little earlier.

I have two degrees in music, play classical, jazz, and funk with the best players in my city, and I have played bass, flute and piano since I was 10, coming from a family of professional musicians. I can play Brahms, Bartok, and Scriabin on the piano, have studied advanced music theory (theory 500) at university, and read fluently in all clefs.

I can play "Smoke on The Water" without looking at my hands.

My comment, "Are you SURE you're a bass player?" had nothing to do with your talent, degrees or whether or not you can actually play anything at all.

It was about attitude.

See, I like to think we're better than, say, keyboardists.

You can defend your friends by insulting me all you like; the truth is Buzz Feiten was the first to improve upon the old nut design with a compensated nut, and the Ernie Ball corporation is jumping on their bandwagon.

My friends, if we're talking about that giant nameless faceless guy, don't need my defense. I was just pointing out that you were and remain entirely wrong. And either Buzz invented the "new" nut design or he didn't. Not that I really care either way, but if he didn't, then he's jumped on someone's bandwagon, eh?

The new Musicman's aren't awful, just very dated and mediocre. They need some intonation help because their frets are too big, causing problems in the low register.

Dated and mediocre. Frets too big. Well, maybe for Bartok, but for "Smoke on the Water", hey, no problem at all. You should learn this tune.

BTW, I bought my first Ernie Ball volume pedal in the early 80's - 25 years ago or so, could be longer than that - a fabulous product, and still in production, and still really good.

Well, golf clap, then! Cheerio! Good on you, old feller.

I have never, however, liked their strings.

I knew you'd bring me back down to earth.

Just don't insult my musicianship because I voiced my opinion on a mass produced mediocre product or you will have a (verbal) fight on your hands.

Reading for comprehension and knowing what you're talking about will save you every time. (I'm using the colloquial 'you' here.)

Now you're really, really a bassist?

Jack

PS: Keyboard player.

 

[Joe Nerve]

I do, however, love the Bongo - fabulous, except for heavy neck dive

Wow. Jack said it all wonderfully. The above statement will confirm a lot of what he said with anyone who owns a Bongo. Don't know where you get yer stuff from, but you really are making yourself look stupid. We don't even have to say anything - you're doing it all on your own.

I too consider myself a friend of the EB family. They're not personal friends of mine, but Sterling knows of me and if I needed to discuss anything with him I wouldn't have to jump through any hoops to do it. I've spoken with his son Brian a handful of times. I know a lot of what goes on in the company - I really do feel like part of the EB family. I even feel like I'm friends with Jack and I still haven't met him. Hopefully NAMM this year. Heck - my naked girlfriend was in the 2006 EB forum calendar! Which reminds me... gotta get my camera snappin again.

This thread is nuts. I'm lovin it. I really like threads that get derailed and get some fire goin in them. This is the second one I lucked into today. JT lambasted someone over in the show your fretless thread. It was awesome.