To the OP, some people take right to a metronome, even more I would venture to think, don't. It will train you to know where the beat is so you can play anywhere in relation to it in context for a particular piece, as Havic5 said.
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Normal to have HORRENDOUS timing when first metronoming?
- Thread starter Tupac
- Start date
- Jun 25, 2007
- 4,531
- 135
- 63
- Disclosures
- Artist:TC Electronic RH450 bass system (original test-pilot)
That's interesting. I had a bass teacher tell me a long time ago to set the metronome to half the speed and place it's clicks on 2&4. At first just counting in was a challenge but with time I realized I was getting better at "owning the "1"" and my time was improving faster than when I was practicing with clicks on all 4 counts. Horses for courses and anything that increases understanding potentially aids our playing.
To the OP. When working with the metronome. Start with easy stuff like scales. Then move into rhythm exercises. Go slowly. Part of improving your time is understanding how the rhythm relates to the clicks. Then you can internalize the pulse and place the rhythm around the pulse. Easy and slow and it'll get less difficult and better quickly. Fast and hard and it'll stay difficult for much longer.
Mugre
bassman314
I seem to be a verb, an evolutionary process...
I've learned vocal music this way. It's particularly effective when you are singing in another language than your native (or fluent) language, as the breaks in syllables come more naturally. You also learn where to put your breaths.
Once you have the rhythms and the pitches, you add the lyrics.
I do the smae on bass, especially on slow songs.
At 1st playing with a metronome was hard for me.
Then it became easier, but still it was harder to play with a metronome than without one.
Then it became just as easy to play with a metronome as without one. And sometimes it feels easier to play with a metronome than without one, especially when set to play only on the 2 & 4, that way it feels like the back beat of a drummer playing the snare.
If you can make the metronome feel like it's grooving, that's a good feeling.
It's a journey with a bumpy road at first for some.
Then it became easier, but still it was harder to play with a metronome than without one.
Then it became just as easy to play with a metronome as without one. And sometimes it feels easier to play with a metronome than without one, especially when set to play only on the 2 & 4, that way it feels like the back beat of a drummer playing the snare.
If you can make the metronome feel like it's grooving, that's a good feeling.
It's a journey with a bumpy road at first for some.
Playing with a metronome or click track is one thing. Playing with a drummer is another. A bass player who can do both will get a lot of work.
I like Jazzdog's 1&3, 2&4 technique.
I often like to set a metronome to eighth notes, straight or triplets to practice listening to the hi hat. A drummer taught me years ago to listen to the hi hat instead of the kick. By the time the kick comes around it's too late to adjust to a tempo drift, but you can hear it in the hat ( or the ride cymbal or snare stuff in a train beat ).
I like Jazzdog's 1&3, 2&4 technique.
I often like to set a metronome to eighth notes, straight or triplets to practice listening to the hi hat. A drummer taught me years ago to listen to the hi hat instead of the kick. By the time the kick comes around it's too late to adjust to a tempo drift, but you can hear it in the hat ( or the ride cymbal or snare stuff in a train beat ).
Schpector said:
Yeah, OK.
Moving right along- put your bass down and see if you can tap your finger steadily and in time with your metronome. I'll bet you can. Betcha. If so, you HAVE good time- no worries. Your problem is you simply haven't learned the instrument yet, which is all about coordination and good technique, which comes with PRACTICE. No metronome required.
As taught to me when I was learning to play drums.
Start off slow.
Practice to a metronome at every practice, but not the entire time.
Vary the tempo during each practice so you don't just master 120 bpm.
If you want a challenge go really SLOW. Believe it or not it can be harder to stay on time at low speeds because your mind wants to fill that silence with sound. You have to resist the urge to rush. Ever catch a drummer speeding up? This is why.
Using a drum machine/software is nice because you can vary the sounds, and also have it do a couple of bars of "clicks" and a couple of bars of silence. This lets you know if you're relying on the metronome too much. You need to develop your inner sense of rhythm.
Don't end a session with metronome practice. Jam out a bit so your last memory is pleasant. It keeps you from dreading practice.
It WILL get easier, I promise. After a while it becomes much more relaxed as you get used to it. (That's not to say you'll always nail everything 100%, but it won't feel so eye-gougingly frustrating all the time at least
)
Start off slow.
Practice to a metronome at every practice, but not the entire time.
Vary the tempo during each practice so you don't just master 120 bpm.
If you want a challenge go really SLOW. Believe it or not it can be harder to stay on time at low speeds because your mind wants to fill that silence with sound. You have to resist the urge to rush. Ever catch a drummer speeding up? This is why.
Using a drum machine/software is nice because you can vary the sounds, and also have it do a couple of bars of "clicks" and a couple of bars of silence. This lets you know if you're relying on the metronome too much. You need to develop your inner sense of rhythm.
Don't end a session with metronome practice. Jam out a bit so your last memory is pleasant. It keeps you from dreading practice.
It WILL get easier, I promise. After a while it becomes much more relaxed as you get used to it. (That's not to say you'll always nail everything 100%, but it won't feel so eye-gougingly frustrating all the time at least
)
Jazzdogg
Less barking, more wagging!
For those interested in exploring this concept in more detail, check out what Hal Galper has to say in his Youtube master class videos:
Invalid Link Removed
I agree with the post about practicing slowly.
When learning a tough passage or fill, it is easy to fool yourself when playing - even to a metronome - that you have it nailed. But if you keep slowing the click down, your ears will let you know if you are holding notes for the right duration, and how to accent certain notes, etc.
Keep at it - no matter what, the metronome can't hurt you - IMO, others might disagree.
When learning a tough passage or fill, it is easy to fool yourself when playing - even to a metronome - that you have it nailed. But if you keep slowing the click down, your ears will let you know if you are holding notes for the right duration, and how to accent certain notes, etc.
Keep at it - no matter what, the metronome can't hurt you - IMO, others might disagree.
Yes. Practice makes better.
How do you know a drummer is at the door?
The knocking keeps speeding up.
How do you know a drummer is at the door?
The knocking keeps speeding up.
I suggest turning down the tempo so that you can play along and make as few mistakes as possible. Get that down and slowly get up to speed.
Possibly get some slow downer software for the tunes you're learning if you need it like the free Best Practice that plays MP3 or Wav files and does a bunch of other things. If you like the plug-in approach, WinAmp can do a lot, as well.
Here are some threads you may want to check out:
Metronome info
1 Slow downer software or training devices
2
3
4
BestPractice-PC based, free, easy to use, slow downer/pitch shifter/looper/vocal remover/bass isolator/ backing track maker
There's also paid version software that usually have more features and more support such as Transcribe, Song Surgeon(audio ripper included), Slow Down Gold, etc.
Possibly get some slow downer software for the tunes you're learning if you need it like the free Best Practice that plays MP3 or Wav files and does a bunch of other things. If you like the plug-in approach, WinAmp can do a lot, as well.
Here are some threads you may want to check out:
Metronome info
1 Slow downer software or training devices
2
3
4
BestPractice-PC based, free, easy to use, slow downer/pitch shifter/looper/vocal remover/bass isolator/ backing track maker
There's also paid version software that usually have more features and more support such as Transcribe, Song Surgeon(audio ripper included), Slow Down Gold, etc.
wow, jazz dog, I gotta try that!
to the OP, dont give up . thats easy. those other hobbies suck! hahaha this hobby is cool!
now, I had some timing problems. I didnt even know it. I had a teacher tell me, after I went a few (million) auditions, and didnt get in a band.
one drummer was nice enough to say I sucked. I got a teacher. again.
he listened to me play. gave me some areas to focus on, including timing.
he said " you need this , this and that"
I said, "oh, can you fix this and that?" I seriously thought my career in music, (weekend warrior) was OVER!
he said, " no I cant fix it, but YOU can"
read that sentence up there, one more time. "you can fix it. we cant. listen to the good advice. and get off of talkbass, and back to your metronome! hahaha
I play with my bass, and my metronome, everyngiht before I go to bed at least 5 to 10 mins. even that little amount, every night, will help.
if you get frustrated, take a break. using longer or shorter beats, with different value notes. play just one note, or just an open string, for a looooooog time. dont try to get fancy.
that isnt what this hobby is all about. its not fancy. its solid, and true, and is the foundation of the music, you play and enjoy.
so, that is the constant, pulsing beat. like the blood thru your body. pumping by your heart.
you stuck with it this long. dont stop.
ask away , if you need more guidence......each player on here can add something to keep you on track, but you have to push to keep moving down the track.....
Rokkitt
to the OP, dont give up . thats easy. those other hobbies suck! hahaha this hobby is cool!
now, I had some timing problems. I didnt even know it. I had a teacher tell me, after I went a few (million) auditions, and didnt get in a band.
one drummer was nice enough to say I sucked. I got a teacher. again.
he listened to me play. gave me some areas to focus on, including timing.
he said " you need this , this and that"
I said, "oh, can you fix this and that?" I seriously thought my career in music, (weekend warrior) was OVER!
he said, " no I cant fix it, but YOU can"
read that sentence up there, one more time. "you can fix it. we cant. listen to the good advice. and get off of talkbass, and back to your metronome! hahaha
I play with my bass, and my metronome, everyngiht before I go to bed at least 5 to 10 mins. even that little amount, every night, will help.
if you get frustrated, take a break. using longer or shorter beats, with different value notes. play just one note, or just an open string, for a looooooog time. dont try to get fancy.
that isnt what this hobby is all about. its not fancy. its solid, and true, and is the foundation of the music, you play and enjoy.
so, that is the constant, pulsing beat. like the blood thru your body. pumping by your heart.
you stuck with it this long. dont stop.
ask away , if you need more guidence......each player on here can add something to keep you on track, but you have to push to keep moving down the track.....
Rokkitt
