Obsolete bass amps

[ezstep]

Recently ancient, SWR.

Much older, ancient, Lab Series. I had one cab, but I was not able to get the head to go with it. Gibson amps.

 

[Ostie]

I knew a guy who had two Acoustic 360s back in the day. They were so dang heavy. I couldn’t physically move one at this stage of my life. So I’ll keep my modern gear, thank you.

 

[neddyrow]

Yeah...my iAmp 800 is not obsolete by any means but, when my three other heads fit in a gig bag and have the same power and tone, it became obsolete to me.

 

[39-Bassist]

Wow I remember having an SUNN Coliseum 100 SS amp. sounded ok till you went past 7...then here comes the distortion. (I guess some guys may like that now...lol)
I really miss my Carvin BX1500, now that amp sounded fantastic when in dual mode. Of course it helped to run a SWR Megoliath cab.

 

[Gary Stevens]

I don't quite follow the supposed logic of this topic. In some form of thinking newer amps and technologies will obsolete the older ones but in another form of thinking we may find - if not usefulness - then at least nostalgy and appeal in the older stuff. Musical instruments and technology doesn't neccessarily "age" like common household Items such as dishwashers and microwave ovens.

If we, for example, compare good modern violins to Stradivarius the modern ones are built better and in a blind test the modern ones even sound better. By all means in theory modern bulk instruments should have obsoleted the Stradivarius violins but in practice it just didn't go that way. In other fields of life people are still getting their kicks from more than 50-year old tube technology or 200 years old steam engines. Art and hobbies are a strange thing.

Even from old amps with horrible reliability and very limited functionality some folks will always find some sort of vintage appeal or just the right unique tone that works in that single specific arrangement and nowhere else.

You are exactly right. Beauty is in the ears of the beholder.

 

[bassdude51]

If a bass amp still works, it's not obsolete.

Today's amps and speakers are fantastic and "stuff" just keeps getting better and better. Especially in the weight department.

Old amps. Many times, they need to be rebuilt. The capacitors go bad. I read once that speakers are good for a couple of decades and then they decorate and should be replaced.

IMHO, we are gonna get the best sound from "state of the art" equipment. And then we have all of these bass pedals that allow us to sound just about anyway that we want.

I can see being hung-up on vintage bass guitars but not on vintage bass amps. A volume, a passive bass tone pot and a passive treble tone pot and tons of midrange. No thanks.

I saw Jack Bruce playing bass with Cream back in the late 60s through Marshalls..........he sounded horrible! Like all of the speakers were blown out or something. Ahh, the vintage sound!

 

[Al Kraft]

I think of obsolete as being that point where a product I might otherwise still want to own and use can no longer be repaired by anyone. From a manufacturer's perspective I think obsolescence is that point where they have offered new products and are now discontinuing support of any type for the older line.

As for a style, tone, or voicing being obsolete, I think that is a personal decision or in the broader music industry a choice made by the buying public in terms of what they pay to listen to. I'm not sure the output produced by any vintage of instrument/equipment can ever be labeled as obsolete as long as someone still appreciates it. Saying it's no longer mainstream or in vogue would probably be a more accurate characterization IMO.

 

[GazzBass]

I sold a SWR Super Redhead last year for peanuts. I needed the cash and my Markbass was getting all the gigs. I regretted it immediately. I miss SWR. Such a shame they disappeared.

 

[bassdude51]

I don't quite follow the supposed logic of this topic. In some form of thinking newer amps and technologies will obsolete the older ones but in another form of thinking we may find - if not usefulness - then at least nostalgy and appeal in the older stuff. Musical instruments and technology doesn't neccessarily "age" like common household Items such as dishwashers and microwave ovens.

If we, for example, compare good modern violins to Stradivarius the modern ones are built better and in a blind test the modern ones even sound better. By all means in theory modern bulk instruments should have obsoleted the Stradivarius violins but in practice it just didn't go that way. In other fields of life people are still getting their kicks from more than 50-year old tube technology or 200 years old steam engines. Art and hobbies are a strange thing.

Even from old amps with horrible reliability and very limited functionality some folks will always find some sort of vintage appeal or just the right unique tone that works in that single specific arrangement and nowhere else.

I like your illustration about the Stradivarius violin. And, I am not taking issue with it. A good point to remember about "vintage" especially with old string instruments. Perhaps the basic instrument is 200 to 300 years old but usually many repairs and replacement parts have been added. Wood cracks. Fret boards wear out. Tuners go bad. Etc. We're not going to find a Stradivarius that is 100% original or untouched.

Which leads us to the subject of vintage bass guitars and bass amps. Old amps sometimes need speaker replacement, capacitor replacement and sometimes transformers and other electrical parts replaced.

New stuff is hard to beat. YMMV

 

[PWRL]

There is some stuff that still clings to life, no matter what. I remember when the first super-duper little cabs were coming out. I bought my Ampeg 810 for $500 used at a Music Go Round, because nobody wanted one. they must have given the seller $150 for it. They were supposedly becoming obsolete back then. But for me, I'd always wanted one, and that was my moment. Fast forward a year, and the prices went back up to where they were before. It's PITA to move, but it sounds like an Ampeg 810 should and it's built like a T-34 tank. However, I pair it with a modern amp, having had too many problems with tube heads in the past.

 

[Manticore]

I still own a mountain of bass amplifiers and speakers. They are each fun in their own way; there's really nothing quite like strapping on a big valve amp with 810 cab and riding the lightening. However, when the advantages of consistency, reliability, ease of use, variety of quality tones, saved time and portability are considered, for me my Kemper has made everything else obsolete.

 

[Spectrum]

Not a bass amp, but pretty obsolete. Also really cool-looking, though it reportedly sounds like isht.

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[BobKos]

I apply what I call the 'Bose Factor' to modern amps. Bose home speaker arrangements are amazing for their size and weight compared to larger speakers of more traditional size. Same with modern amps. But are they truly head and shoulders above the traditional components in a side by side comparison? I am not so sure. I have never kept a Bose speaker setup over my old Infinity RS4b's. My Littlemark II was nice enough that I sold my Eden WT500 but in retrospect that may have been a mistake. It was different and simpler but not necessarily better. I currently have the LMII over Eden (2) 4X10s next to a Subway WD800 over (2) 1X15s. The newer Mesa setup is a bit more versatile control wise but IMO it is not THAT much better than my old setup. I use both depending on my mood and in some instances the LMII / Eden seems to be the better setup.

 

[Killing Floor]

The way I see it all my gear is obsolete as soon as I see something cooler!
Even if that "cooler" new thing is 50 years old and working by a thread.

 

[Medicine Man]

Obsolete, not really. Impractical, absolutely. Its been years since i hauled out the fridge. For many, any amp on stage is obsolete. I went from just a Kemper and iem back to a class D and 2x12. Much happier that way, as occasionally we play a venue with an underpowered PA.

 

[Mantis Tobaggan]

I have the SVT AV and I wanted one for 20 years before I got it. I love it. I also have always been intrigued by the Fender Super Bassman.

 

[mattj1stc]

If you define obsolete as discontinued, then I play one. I have a Carvin BX1200 and the corresponding 4x10neo cabinet. I chose this amp not really for its tone, but for its relative lack of tone - it's pretty transparent. I've mostly used it more as a power amp, with a preamp (VT Deluxe) going into the effects return in the back of the head.

Technologically, it's a class A solid state amp and it still functions just fine, but the newer class D amps now predominate, so it's somewhat technically obsolete. Commercially, it's definitely obsolete as it was discontinued and the manufacturer is now out of business.

It's funny because today there are a few main amp ideas. There are legacy companies that both make new versions of their older, popular designs (Ampeg, Orange, Marshall, etc.), there are a few boutique manufacturers who make the old school designs (Verellen, Reeves, etc.), and there are the newer designs like the class D designs. Still, the tone most of us seem to want is the old school one. Even I use the VT Deluxe to emulate tube sounds.

 

[HolmeBass]

I think older amps are obsolete ONLY in terms of form factor and weight. The tone and functionality they provide seems comparable to modern amps. Well some really old amps are not as safe as modern ones but that is easily fixed with small upgrades to the input side of the power supply.

For cabinets, however, it is a completely different story. That’s where the tech improvement has benefitted not only form factor and weight, but also tone. Progress in material science has really lead to a new class of speakers that allow cabinet designers to, if not break the Iron Triangle, at least deform it significantly, or make it a lot bigger - insert appropriate analogy here please.

 

[dbsfgyd1]

Ok, we know the SVT and V4B are still viable but what about all of the other brands (mostly SS amps) that appeared in the 80's until the latest class D amps sort of 'took over'?

I have an Eden Metro and a GK 800RB both of which i think are solid even today....even my Music Man HD150...getting into bass from a guitar world i was taken with the number of brands to choose from that i saw on stages thru the past decades.

Which of these amps that were at one time considered 'top tier' are now relegated to the scrap heap, possibly in terms of weight and size being a factor?

Are many not even worth repairing even though they may have been among the preferred examples just a few years back?

The old Fender, Vox and Marshall circuits have survived in the guitar world...but what is still viable in the bass amp world?

I traded my Eden Metro for my 800RB a dozen years ago, so I can comment. Part of it is that the calculus of how heavy is too heavy has changed. The Metro is a heavy combo, full of features, but with a 1990's sounding scooped cabinet that defines its tone.

That's the other part -- the tone. The Parametric EQ seems, in retrospect, best designed to decide what kind of scoop you want. The Metro/XLT tone is of an era, and not really a classic.

The 800RB on the other hand is a classic. It's still on the lighter side of class A/B solid state amps, and having the portability and flexibility of a head, is less likely to be obsolete. I sold mine off in favor of a 700RBii, but mainly to skip out on likely upcoming maintenance with a few scratchy pots. The 700RBii responds and sounds basically the same.

Some solid state amps are true classics and will see long use, just like some of the Ampeg tube gear. I've been to giant festivals within the past decade and seen 800RB's in the rack (Levon Helm's bassist at the Vibes in 2011, iirc)

John Rider of Max Creek still rocks his Eden preamp -- the same preamp as the Metro basically. Lesh was using his forever, not sure what he plays now.

But the old Acoustics aren't in use in the same way -- GK's eighties stuff seems to be the inflection point of solid state obsolescence.

That Metro you had was a load for sure. I tried lifting one of them when I checking out Eden gear, and said no thanks.

That said, I don’t play with a “scooped 90’s sound” with my Eden gear. Just a slight bump at 120-150 hz. Everything else is at flat. My Fender PJ is wide open, tone and volume controls.

Mostly I play in larger vocal/horn band ensembles 90% of the time with FOH support. I just need tight clear punchy tone that sits in the mix without creating a lot of unnecessary low end for the sound men to deal with. It works really well in that setting.

Probably more towards you point, I might have issues if I played in a power trio when I needed to fill a lot of sonic space. Death Metal?? I don’t think so.

 

[Spirit of Ox]

I have a 91 and 93 GK 400RB as my main heads and I have yet to find a head to replace them. I've tried some of the newer Class D heads but I feel like the ones I've tried sounded to processed to me. I'm interested in the GK class D heads and the Darkglass ones but me 400RBs are so tried and true. If anything, I would probably get an 800rb if I can find one in good shape.