Pretty sure the waveguilde has significantly wider dispersion with the cab in the upright position.
If you have the HF level turned to a lower level, your audience might not hear any difference.
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Official Barefaced Bass Cab Club
- Thread starter Stumbo
- Start date
If you have the HF level turned to a lower level, your audience might not hear any difference.
alexclaber
Commercial User
An upside down SC on a BB2 will look really weird to most people and any sonic benefit is likely to be outweighed by the visual downside!
I wouldn't lift any of our cabs off the floor unless you have to because of uncontrollable boom due to a hollow and undamped stage - basically keep it simple, stack the cabs straight on the floor in the obvious order and alignment - you don't need to overthink it.Fortunately it doesn't!
With the cab turned sideways the horizontal dispersion is fractionally wider at lower treble frequencies and fractionally wider at higher treble frequencies. You would struggle to hear a difference in an ideal listening situation let alone on an actual gig, even with the HF control all the way up and a very bright tone.
When playing these BB2s as a stack, I turn them sideways to align the horns and woofers for optimal projection. Also more stable than a tall stack.
If I were doing a vertical stack, I'd invert the top cab so the horns were close together in the middle. Maybe turn the horn down on the bottom cab?
All this "wisdom" was gleaned from advice on Fearless/Fearful cabs, and I assume it applies here.
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If I were doing a vertical stack, I'd invert the top cab so the horns were close together in the middle. Maybe turn the horn down on the bottom cab?
All this "wisdom" was gleaned from advice on Fearless/Fearful cabs, and I assume it applies here.
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This is what inspired me to stack my SC in the BB2 in this orientation.
That rig is dreamy!
An upside down SC on a BB2 will look really weird to most people and any sonic benefit is likely to be outweighed by the visual downside!
I personally don't really care how the stack looks. If others do, that is fine with me as well.
Done a lot of gigs in a lot of venues with a fair variety of different cabinets - de-coupling gives me a more consistent starting point than not, plus I like my drivers as close to ear level as possible. Again, do whatever works for you & I'm fine with that. Just offering up my perspective on what works for me.
DSFDF!!!
So sitting upright, you have the waveguide oriented to benefit the player on the stage slightly more than the audience?Fortunately it doesn't!
So is it a 90 / 120 degree (horizontal / vertical) waveguide or what?
Maybe it's just the English major in me, but I am guessing maybe Alex meant to say dispersion is fractionally wider at one treble freuqency, (hi or lo) and fractionally narrower at the other (lo or hi). It'll be interesting to find out which.
On the other hand, maybe I am entirely wrong.
.
I understand different patterns for different frequencies (though not sure why that is desirable, unless you're trying to slot the overall output around other instruments in the band: guitars, crash cymbals, etc), but I would still expect the horn to have some dispersion specifications including overall horizontal coverage & vertical coverage.
alexclaber
Commercial User
The dispersion specifications for horns are nominal, just like impedance. And as you'll know, a 4 ohm nominal impedance cab can vary from <3 ohms to >50 ohms across the working bandwidth, and likewise a horn that is nominally 80 deg dispersion can vary from <40 deg to >120 deg across the working bandwidth. Simple number specs are rarely much use in practice, it's the detailed graphs that show much more of the truth. Sadly it's impossible to make a horn that is, for example, 100 deg dispersion across a working bandwidth of a few octaves, the true dispersion pattern will always vary with frequency.
You can measure the pattern difference of our horn but the difference is too small to be heard in most scenarios.
Well, I am excited. My Big Baby II, originally scheduled to arrive at the Fedex location for me to pick up Tuesday, has already arrived there.
I will be able to pick it up on my way to a gig tomorrow, and will be playing through it about 1 1/2 hrs after picking it up. Can't wait. Still gonna bring the Aggie SL-112's just in case of technical difficulties.
I will be able to pick it up on my way to a gig tomorrow, and will be playing through it about 1 1/2 hrs after picking it up. Can't wait. Still gonna bring the Aggie SL-112's just in case of technical difficulties.
Pushed the BB2 tonight at the apartment. Everything here is buzzing. I did notice some buzzing from the cab and found a twist of the grille screws sorted it out. Guess it has been shipped and played before I got it, so perhaps things jiggled. The low/bass is huge. It doesn't feel terribly loud in the ears, but the shaking walls, doors, floors, and everything else shows I'm clearly moving air. I may have two jams next week. I'm excited to hear the plutonium gig report.
Ok first gig in the 350+ person theatre done (2 more today). I tried the Super Midget and it did fill the space, but the low end had to be EQed to deliver the warmth I was looking for. Brought the BB2 and it delivered the warmth with a flat EQ.
So I guess I found the first limitation of the SM, that in mid sized, balconied theaters it needs a bit of EQ to fill it out across the spectrum. If I didn't have the BB2, I'd have been fine. But it's nice to have the option.
So I guess I found the first limitation of the SM, that in mid sized, balconied theaters it needs a bit of EQ to fill it out across the spectrum. If I didn't have the BB2, I'd have been fine. But it's nice to have the option.
The fact that a 112 cab can deliver that is impressive.
Spector Forte > Agro > Demeter > BB2
Are you kidding?!
Wave guide driver turned up and no nasty sounds (Agro presence way down).
Are you kidding?!
Wave guide driver turned up and no nasty sounds (Agro presence way down).
Running my laptop audio through the Genz Shuttle Aux In into the BB2. Very nice sound. I'm finding I like to use the built-in iTunes equalizer "treble booster" preset to boost things starting at 1k just slightly, then ramp up at 2, 4, 8, through 16k (ending at about 6db boost). Crossover all they way on. This seems to keep the Highs and Lows where I like them. Maybe I've got 40 year old metal ears, so I've probably killed some of those frequencies in my head holes.
Maschine into it sounds lovely. The piano presets are delicious.
Maschine into it sounds lovely. The piano presets are delicious.
I was running it hot - probably at 3pm gain and 2pm on the master (GK MBF800) for the SM.
With the BB2 I backed down to 12 on gain and 10 on the master. Definitely a different beast, but both could handle the power and delivered. Coulda ran 'em both, but honestly didn't need to!
I'll ask here too...
Does anybody have a Gen 3 BB2 or Retro two10 they wouldn't mind selling and/or trading? I have lots of cool stuff...
I'm having some cab issues at the moment and need something for my gigs next weekend. I might be able to get the issues sorted by then but I'd rather have s good backup plan. Sure I can pick up any cab to use it is much rather just get what I want in the first place.
Thanks!
Does anybody have a Gen 3 BB2 or Retro two10 they wouldn't mind selling and/or trading? I have lots of cool stuff...
I'm having some cab issues at the moment and need something for my gigs next weekend. I might be able to get the issues sorted by then but I'd rather have s good backup plan. Sure I can pick up any cab to use it is much rather just get what I want in the first place.
Thanks!
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So, picked up the BB2 from the Fedex office on the way to the gig last night. Played through it for the first time (running a Aggie TH 350). Impressions:
The cab is quite small, smaller than I expected actually. Although I'd done the calculation a while back and determined that BB2 is 5% larger in volume than my Aguilar SL-112's, all the discussion about BB2 being the "bigger" box (thus giving it a "bigger" sound) relative to SM and SC somehow got me expecting a larger cab. Obviously, easy portability at 29 lbs.
Sounds fantastic! Another bass player who is a friend of the band, former member, who now does African, reggae, and r&b gigs based out of Brooklyn NY happened to be in town and came out, so in addition to playing through it, I got to listen to it from the audience as well, which was convenient for assessing this monster.
The tone is really clear, uncolored. Much more clarity in the high mids into treble than the Aggie SL-112's, not a nappy high-mid but a nice warm high-mid. Felt like every note was distinct, I was hearing (for better or worse) every note as it came off my hands.
The depth of the bass/ low notes was extremely impressive. From the audience, it almost sounded as if there were some PA support for bass (there was none, vocal and sax only through the PA), very deep bass that would make things vibrate in the room without seeming overly loud, you know the sound I'm talking about. It filled the room with sound, and was using a TH 350, so 175 W at the 8 ohm load of this cab. Both myself and the other bass player were using 5-strings and it handled these lowest lows beautifully.
I ran the tweeter around 50%, very tight space on stage so I wasn't able to get behind to dial it in and out. I think next time I will try the horn 100% on, from what I heard I don't think there will be any of that harsh horn sound that I sometimes hear, it seemed very organic (as you turn the horn down it sends the frequencies down to the 12" driver so you don't lose the frequencies, just reproduces them differently).
Alex at BF generally suggests having the cabs on the floor; with such a small cab, unless you have 2 of them, the tweeter (as well as driver of course) is low to the ground. I'd almost like to have 2 of these so that there is a horn and driver closer to ear level. But, really, there is just no need for two for the vast, vast majority of situations. I will experiment with it off the floor as well, in coming gigs. As good as it sounds with one, the desire to have it closer to ear level is not reason enough to get another. This one cab will cover just about everything I do.
Well, long story short, this is a fantastic cabinet. But, $1100 retail is a lot. Is it worth it? In a word, yes. Extremely impressed.
The cab is quite small, smaller than I expected actually. Although I'd done the calculation a while back and determined that BB2 is 5% larger in volume than my Aguilar SL-112's, all the discussion about BB2 being the "bigger" box (thus giving it a "bigger" sound) relative to SM and SC somehow got me expecting a larger cab. Obviously, easy portability at 29 lbs.
Sounds fantastic! Another bass player who is a friend of the band, former member, who now does African, reggae, and r&b gigs based out of Brooklyn NY happened to be in town and came out, so in addition to playing through it, I got to listen to it from the audience as well, which was convenient for assessing this monster.
The tone is really clear, uncolored. Much more clarity in the high mids into treble than the Aggie SL-112's, not a nappy high-mid but a nice warm high-mid. Felt like every note was distinct, I was hearing (for better or worse) every note as it came off my hands.
The depth of the bass/ low notes was extremely impressive. From the audience, it almost sounded as if there were some PA support for bass (there was none, vocal and sax only through the PA), very deep bass that would make things vibrate in the room without seeming overly loud, you know the sound I'm talking about. It filled the room with sound, and was using a TH 350, so 175 W at the 8 ohm load of this cab. Both myself and the other bass player were using 5-strings and it handled these lowest lows beautifully.
I ran the tweeter around 50%, very tight space on stage so I wasn't able to get behind to dial it in and out. I think next time I will try the horn 100% on, from what I heard I don't think there will be any of that harsh horn sound that I sometimes hear, it seemed very organic (as you turn the horn down it sends the frequencies down to the 12" driver so you don't lose the frequencies, just reproduces them differently).
Alex at BF generally suggests having the cabs on the floor; with such a small cab, unless you have 2 of them, the tweeter (as well as driver of course) is low to the ground. I'd almost like to have 2 of these so that there is a horn and driver closer to ear level. But, really, there is just no need for two for the vast, vast majority of situations. I will experiment with it off the floor as well, in coming gigs. As good as it sounds with one, the desire to have it closer to ear level is not reason enough to get another. This one cab will cover just about everything I do.
Well, long story short, this is a fantastic cabinet. But, $1100 retail is a lot. Is it worth it? In a word, yes. Extremely impressed.
