Once again walking bass: playing standards on the spot

[Todd Johnson]

Thanks very much Todd, I appreciate your comments.

I'm not trying to score points here, it's not about coming out on top in some argument. There is a way to get to where your solo and accompaniment lines are organic, are personal and have meaning and intent. But you have to work at it.

Ed!

Absolutely!!!!....I too have been pursuing this whole business of playing what I hear. It apparently it takes some time. Ha! (30 years in my case).....

God Bless,

 

[Pacman]

When the old-school bassists would sit down with a peice, I highly doubt they'd spend time on what the original bassist was doing. They'd see how the chords moved and how they could accentuate that.

And again, you'd be wrong. I'm surprised I"m the first to bring this up, but when the old-school bassists would learn a new piece, they'd get it from the record. They'd literally learn the original part first - by playing along with the record. By analyzing the parts they learned, they learned the changes.

So yeah, completely wrong. Keep digging - there's an issue of credibility here, and you're only proving other's point.

 

[Ed Fuqua]

And again, you'd be wrong. I'm surprised I"m the first to bring this up, but when the old-school bassists would learn a new piece, they'd get it from the record. They'd literally learn the original part first - by playing along with the record. By analyzing the parts they learned, they learned the changes.

So yeah, completely wrong. Keep digging - there's an issue of credibility here, and you're only proving other's point.

Or from the cats they were playing with. A buddy of mine's teacher was a guitarist from NC, came up with Tal Farlow. When those guys were coming up, somebody would know the melody (or as close as they could hear to the melody) and then they would figure out how to harmonize the melody. It may not have been the composer's chord changes, but they worked with the melody. Cause they were using their ears, cause they worked on using their ears...

 

[Bruce Lindfield]

I was at classes with Martin Speake - a great UK-based Alto player - and he got the group to transcribe together. So - he would play us a recording and then say - OK horn players work out the head and rhythm section players work out the chords and feel etc. Nothing written down - then we would play the piece!

Hard stuff - but can pay dividends!

 

[nickmo007]

Some great points have been made here. Just want to add my 2 cents.

I think the important relationship between the bassist's line and the soloist is really worth exploring. You can go all out and transcribe the bass, (accompaniment, piano, guitar, etc) and soloist and see how this plays out. Check out some of the Miles Davis quintet Live at the Plugged Nickel. I found great value in comparing Wayne's Shorter solo to Carter's bass line on "If I were a Bell"

Some of Ron Carter's interviews are very insightful on how pivotal the role of the bass is in influencing the course of improvisation. Check those out. Point is, there is MUCH MUCH MORE going on than the bassist outlining chord tones in quarter notes. This is people truly conversing rhythmically and harmonically on the highest level.

Another story I want to mention. During my final year completing my master's, I was blessed to have the opportunity to participate in a group led by legendary jazz trumpeter Clark Terry through the school. When he was teaching new tunes, he would always sing me walking lines, never once did he mention a chord change such as F-7 Bb7 Ebmaj7. He would sing me super swinging bass lines in his grumbly voice and I had to respond quickly. He was an excellent bass player LOL. This was pure aural transmission. Doing this weekly over the course of the year was so valuable to me. So were his stories!!

 

[Ed Fuqua]

+1

 

[Stumbo]

As someone who has read many hundreds of books over the years, the parallel to music is obvious. One must study what has been created before to gain understanding. Just learning certain words that fit a profile won't get you very far and pretending that they do will only lead to frustration and humiliation (by thinking you are original when you're not).

Great writers/musicians may have been given a bigger dose of talent, but they also took what was known and moved their creations to a different level.

If one goes beyond just listening and moves into the realm of understanding, not only will you not reinvent the wheel, you'll be able to discern when you are the creator and not just "playing the notes". Any you will be able to know when someone with less knowledge is still on the path to understanding.