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One racist remark?

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#62
I go back and forth on this. I totally get why you'd quit but part of me thinks it would have been better to stay and continue to confront the ignoramus anytime he went that direction.

But then again, I've avoided trying out for groups after doing a little social media surfing on existing members to see if there is any level of crazy amongst them. If their public Facebook/Twitter/Instagram feed is filled with propaganda/misogynistic/sexist/racist posts, I politely decline the offer to get together.

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#65
No offense, but I feel like you went about this all wrong.

Number 1. You made it seem like he was trying to get a reaction out of you. You made it seem like his only goal was to get you riled up so you would quit. In which case, he won and you lost.

Number 2. This may seem insensitive but its a word. It's a silly little word. It's a series of letters arranged in a specific order. It's a word that I would even use myself if it wouldn't get me an infraction on this site. Sticks and stones man. If you really are going to let a word (which wasn't even directed at you) get you so worked up that you couldn't play with these guys, then you are seriously over reacting. Now if he showed up to a gig in a white bed sheet and set fire to a crucifix as part of his performance, I could see how that would be a big issue. But what he was doing was simply childish provocation.

Number 3. Even if you did take offense, he's the newest member of the band. Couldn't you have talked to him first? Couldn't you have at least tried to get him booted out instead of you booting yourself out? I mean it seems like the rest of the band respects you, maybe if you had talked to them before resigning they would have rather kicked him out. It's a similar situation to sexual harassment in the workplace, you're supposed to tell the person to back off before you go reporting them because that person might think the feelings are reciprocated. He might not have known that it would offend you, even though all the evidence said he did.
 
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#67
Jim Carr said:
It was quite clear from a couple years of working with the band that if the others had heard his remarks, they would not have batted an eye.
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Then it sounds like a bad fit for you.

There are some issues that come up in conversation for some of my band members (although not race related), that I know we have differing opinions upon but for the most part I write it off as 'working with hippies'... ;) Race and gender stuff won't fly with me. And I've called out people on the gender thing before, just not had the opportunity on the race thing. One of our ancillary members would post a lot of FB memes that while intending to be humorous put down women and played on some of the now elderly stereotypes of women. I would quietly post replies suggesting that 'you wouldn't post a similar thing about men'. Eventually those posts stopped.
 
#68
I wud say yes to your question. If there is something as simple as a single word that wud make you quit and make the the band start looking then by all means let them know how you feel before your audition. Don't allow that word to get the glory its asking for by putting added stress on a music group.
 
#71
Jim Carr said:
I recently quit a band over hate speech. It was a successful ensemble with plenty of Festival and Pub gigs that paid well, doing a mix of originals and covers.

I quit because of a single remark made by the newest member. To summarize it, he referred to U.S. President Barak Obama as an "n-word." This was during setup for a rehearsal when only he and I were in the room. He showed by his voice, body language and facial expression that he knew I would be offended. The other band members never make political or religious remarks to me, but I know they are very conservative. One guy works for local FOX TV affiliate. The man who made the remark is a long time friend of the guy who works for FOX.

Showing no emotion, I said, "I'm sorry. What did you say?" He then gleefully repeated his racist remark. I was quiet, but lowered my head and shook it sadly. I really was sad.

Perhaps he wanted me to quit? I gave it some thought and decided to oblige. A few days later I quit. I explained that the racist remark was so offensive that I would not be able to participate any more. They have a couple of things on the books, but can likely sub them.

I received a polite message "accepting my resignation." No acknowledgement of the hate speech incident.

What I am wondering is if I should state explicitly my zero tolerance for hate speech when agreeing to work with a new group of people?
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holy moses Even the world renowned bigot "got over it" did not know that Archie played in bands now.....

it's that kind of A-hat that i had to deal with when i was dating a Lovely Ebony model... OMG--- she was a bit of a redneck too so GEEZ what we had to contend with at motorcycle races rodeo's ETC...
And even worse at Heavy metal shows IGNANTS...

(in breeding will do that)
why would they acknowledge the "incident" the rest of the group apparently tacitly/passively approving this behaviour--- you did the righteous thing--- to quote Ron White "You can't fix Stupid"

I guess i should Add that I'm in the liberal left coast and a tall Pale white dude who at the time had waist length hair and she was a size 0 6' BABE.......

SHE got Crap from the "bro's, rednecks and sisters"-- i only had negativity on one front the Ignants.... and this was 10 years ago... in Southern California.


there ain't a hole big enough to bury all this prejudice--

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#72
NYCbassist said:
This person sounds like he was trying to get under your skin. Is there some previous circumstance that led him to it. IOW has the topic come up before? was there any reason for him to poke a stick in your cage? IMO you should have stayed and told him to quit.
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I was well paid and appreciated, though the gig was a bit on the dull side. "The person" had shown hostility before, but all in a "joking" tone. He had never used such explicit language before, but it was becoming clear from his remarks about various music styles and pop artists that he had a problem with people of color, especially women. He also was always late, never prepared, his gear malfunctioned a lot, yet he was never criticized by the band leader. The BL and "the person" are old friends. The BL considers "the person" a star.

The bottom line is that I am not willing to tolerate hate speech. This was not a "teachable moment." The racist remarks came from an adult over 50 years old. One hears this kind of talk frequently in my region, and I can't turn the other cheek. If it happens again in a band I am in, I will walk. I take it personally.
 
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#73
Hopkins said:
The same way every news organization panders, they know their target audience and they deliver the "news" in a way that is spun to what their audience wants to hear. I can't really fault them for it.
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I agree that they do "cater" to their audience but pandering to the "kook fringe" stereotype, no.
 
#76
Sixgunn said:
I agree that they do "cater" to their audience but pandering to the "kook fringe" stereotype, no.
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Both words would work just as well, as they have very similar definitions. I use the word pander in the case of the more extreme ends of the news spectrum because it seems they often take a rather extreme and hardline stance just to please their target demographic. MSNBC is equal and opposite to FOX.
 
#78
Jim Carr said:
What I am wondering is if I should state explicitly my zero tolerance for hate speech when agreeing to work with a new group of people?
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I wouldn't think you would HAVE to mention that; that it would be sort of a given.
Bands are very small businesses and as such need to be environments that are respectful of all the participants. Its not like people don't know that the "N" word is a charged one and will generally illicit a response one way or another. You don't just drop the N bomb casually.
If you aren't comfortable with that environment, regardless of whether or not you were being purposefully provoked, you need take steps to make sure you are. If they aren't willing to admit fault in that instance then it will only get worse as you are around them more. I know it is trite around here to say "leave", but you probably did the right thing here.
When you are looking for a new band, you don't need to mention this up front, that might look a little weird, but you can mention in passing your reason for leaving your last band. See what they do with that.
 
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#79
Jim Carr said:
The bottom line is that I am not willing to tolerate hate speech. This was not a "teachable moment." The racist remarks came from an adult over 50 years old. One hears this kind of talk frequently in my region, and I can't turn the other cheek. If it happens again in a band I am in, I will walk. I take it personally.
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Yessir.


If a man stands for nothing he will fall for anything.
 
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