P Diddy's Makin the Band.

[ElMon]

First, is this show available to watch on the net?

Second, there have been a lot of negative comments about Diddy's new tunes in this thread. Maybe I am the only one, but I give him props for actually trying something new and pushing his musicianship forward. He's always had a good ear, but his past tunes have been heavy on samples / beats, and him going "uh, yeah, uh, yeah" and then spitting some lyrics. This stuff is more advanced than that, more songwriting than beatsmithing. Sure the auto-tune is a bit much, but hell, he is at least trying to sing and write some serious melodies. And it's a concept record! I give him credit for trying.

See, I here LESS songwriting personally, and while I agree that its good for him to explore, the people around him are doing him a disservice by telling him that what he's doing is 'hot' or it has 'swag'. It doesn't. Someone needs to be like 'Diddy, I respect what your doing, but this sucks'. Plus, it attacks the credibility of all these so-called industry veterans to simply be yes-men. IMO at least.

 

[Phil Smith]

See, I here LESS songwriting personally, and while I agree that its good for him to explore, the people around him are doing him a disservice by telling him that what he's doing is 'hot' or it has 'swag'. It doesn't. Someone needs to be like 'Diddy, I respect what your doing, but this sucks'. Plus, it attacks the credibility of all these so-called industry veterans to simply be yes-men. IMO at least.

If any of those Diddy tracks are actually on the new album...I pitty him, they sound awful but the aesthetic has changed people have gotten used to garbage. I've been listening to a lot of Chic lately, with all the cash these people have on hand you would think they would employ some real song writer and arrangers, but alas, they don't.

 

[Phil Smith]

First, is this show available to watch on the net?

Second, there have been a lot of negative comments about Diddy's new tunes in this thread. Maybe I am the only one, but I give him props for actually trying something new and pushing his musicianship forward. He's always had a good ear, but his past tunes have been heavy on samples / beats, and him going "uh, yeah, uh, yeah" and then spitting some lyrics. This stuff is more advanced than that, more songwriting than beatsmithing. Sure the auto-tune is a bit much, but hell, he is at least trying to sing and write some serious melodies. And it's a concept record! I give him credit for trying.

What kind of music do you listen to? This is not a dis or anything, just trying to get a frame of reference.

 

[Phil Smith]

I doubt that Kris would have even known how to enter that notation into software or a sequencer without someone showing him what the rhythms were. But what he probably could have done given the time was work on it with one of the other drummers in the house.

Another thing on his todo list...

Have the ability to leverage available technology to offset deficencies you might have.

 

[Lo end PUNCH]

+1...in the gospel scene here in the Detroit area we call that getting "cooked". There's definitely a time and place for it. One of my favorite drummers is Chris Dave - when he's playing on a club gig with jazz cats he plays EXTRA loose and flips the beats all over the place to the point of you having no idea what the time is. But then he'll play some straight ahead jazz with Kenny Garrett, or R&B with Maxwell or Erykah Badu, etc., and he plays at various levels of restraint based on the gig.

Chris is my favorite drummer, I remember first seeing him live with Mint Condition and if you don't already know MC is a band that doesn't mind letting themselves get all over the beats. A superb musicician for a superb band. He's also toured and recorded with Meshell N'Degeocello.

 

[Terry Funk]

First, is this show available to watch on the net?

Second, there have been a lot of negative comments about Diddy's new tunes in this thread. Maybe I am the only one, but I give him props for actually trying something new and pushing his musicianship forward. He's always had a good ear, but his past tunes have been heavy on samples / beats, and him going "uh, yeah, uh, yeah" and then spitting some lyrics. This stuff is more advanced than that, more songwriting than beatsmithing. Sure the auto-tune is a bit much, but hell, he is at least trying to sing and write some serious melodies. And it's a concept record! I give him credit for trying.

Yeah, I agree that he's trying something new, but they're just not good overall songs, IMO. They're messy as hell, and I absolutely abhor autotune. But I'll agree, he's come a long way since his work with Mase in terms of musical sophistication.

 

[Rudreax]

First, is this show available to watch on the net?

Second, there have been a lot of negative comments about Diddy's new tunes in this thread. Maybe I am the only one, but I give him props for actually trying something new and pushing his musicianship forward. He's always had a good ear, but his past tunes have been heavy on samples / beats, and him going "uh, yeah, uh, yeah" and then spitting some lyrics. This stuff is more advanced than that, more songwriting than beatsmithing. Sure the auto-tune is a bit much, but hell, he is at least trying to sing and write some serious melodies. And it's a concept record! I give him credit for trying.

Just because he's trying doesn't mean we should automatically like his work. Of course, it's not like our opinions will matter anyway since most people in the general public are going to eat that stuff up anyway.

 

[Sounbwoy]

Remember that in the show, Nisan claims one of those songs as "his joint", in that I guess he composed/wrote said song...

 

[bottomzone]

Yeah, he got cut. That's my boy Kris Brooks, I've played with him and his brother Kenny for years. He has crazy chops, but he can also groove and can play drum parts exactly like the CD. His weakness is that he never learned to read music, and he got cut when that weakness was exposed.

Very good point. For those who make the cut, it's going to come down to who shows the fewest weaknesses-both muscial and emotional-and can "bring it" every time.

I'm hooked on the show too, despite the editing. It's contibuting to my re-evaluation of where I stand as a musician.



A Groove is a Terrible Thing to Waste!

 

[willgroove2]

Remember that in the show, Nisan claims one of those songs as "his joint", in that I guess he composed/wrote said song...

um no, he meant it was one of his favorites,might need to brush up on you urban colloquialisms

 

[3506string]

I'm really trying to understand why exactly he needs such a talented musician staff for this album. From the snippets I've heard on the show and the few clips on the web, I haven't heard any thing that you would need a just blazing band for. Everything I've heard has been heavily sequenced and produced not really something a live band would do the most justice. But, maybe he's planning on giving the songs a more live feel on tour. He has managed to keep clips off the web but I did dig this up.
As far as his singing, we have a saying around here "stay in your calling". Him spending hours of time and gobs of autotune in the studio trying to nail singing parts, to me is like trying to nail a bass solo on a motif. Why not just get a singer for the job?
On another note he has manage to make a show I look forward to seeing weekly.

 

[xk3smith]

I agree. Some of the tunes are killin'!

Not at all trying to flame or be mean in anyway... but what tunes do you find "killin"?? You can go to MTV.com listen and tell us at what time in the video do you hear a tune you like. You can tell us the scene and as much that's going on as possible. Maybe i'm being too harsh.

 

[DWBass]

Not at all trying to flame or be mean in anyway... but what tunes do you find "killin"?? You can go to MTV.com listen and tell us at what time in the video do you hear a tune you like. You can tell us the scene and as much that's going on as possible. Maybe i'm being too harsh.

I think you ARE being harsh! You have to have an open mind to all kinds of music. Not saying you HAVE to like it but you have to accept that there are all types of music out there and people will eat it up! This album is being marketed to the worldwide dance/club demographic and in that context, the grooves and autotune, etc. are hot! Folks are gonna be critical just because it's P Diddy but if it was anyone else I don't think there'd be that much criticism! I bet folks didn't think Danity Kane and Day 26 would sell but guess what? Platinum sales!! While this record may certainly fall under YOUR radar, there are folks already standing in line to buy a copy! Guaranteed!

 

[Phil Smith]

I think you ARE being harsh! You have to have an open mind to all kinds of music. Not saying you HAVE to like it but you have to accept that there are all types of music out there and people will eat it up! This album is being marketed to the worldwide dance/club demographic and in that context, the grooves and autotune, etc. are hot! Folks are gonna be critical just because it's P Diddy but if it was anyone else I don't think there'd be that much criticism! I bet folks didn't think Danity Kane and Day 26 would sell but guess what? Platinum sales!! While this record may certainly fall under YOUR radar, there are folks already standing in line to buy a copy! Guaranteed!

Don't get all defense now, you said some tracks were kill'n, well, which ones are they?????? Answer the question! If you can, that is.

 

[xk3smith]

I think you ARE being harsh! You have to have an open mind to all kinds of music. Not saying you HAVE to like it but you have to accept that there are all types of music out there and people will eat it up! This album is being marketed to the worldwide dance/club demographic and in that context, the grooves and autotune, etc. are hot! Folks are gonna be critical just because it's P Diddy but if it was anyone else I don't think there'd be that much criticism! I bet folks didn't think Danity Kane and Day 26 would sell but guess what? Platinum sales!! While this record may certainly fall under YOUR radar, there are folks already standing in line to buy a copy! Guaranteed!

Told ya I'm not trying to argue or sound harsh at all. The musician in me wants to hear what you hear. No from fights from me. My online flame war days are in my shameful past. Let's discuss like musicians. What tunes are killin??

(if you are truly offended ignore my post. You are my fellow TB'r, not trying to fight.)

 

[vision]

What tunes are killin??

I like the song that plays on the intro to the show. They have also played it when he was working on the album in the studio. Some of the others I didn't care for.

But asking what songs sound good is extremely subjective. Most of the pop albums out right now don't interest me at all. For example, the last Kanye album had him singing with autotune the entire album, and I didn't care for the songs at all. It still sold well though, so it was very succesful for him.

Now what we CAN talk about in an objective manner is the musicianship required to play that stuff live. They aren't gonna just run protools with everything sequenced without the musicans standing there faking it. Certain parts will be sequenced and others will be replayed. The 80's challenge they did on the show is a good example of the musicianship required to play that stuff (I'm not talking about the songwriting, but the vibe of the songs) The keyboardists have some intricate parts to reproduce, and they'll also have to do some programming to match the sounds on the album. There is syncopated percussion all over the place - I would think that the drummer will be using a combo kit with live and electronic drums, all while having to sync perfectly with the click track. The musicians overall will have to be creative with the arrangements and coming up with their parts - that music isn't for bars of E chords, four bars of A chords, four bars of B chords, etc.

Whether or not you like the music has nothing to do with the fact that he's gonna need some good musicians to pull it off live. An example to me would be Madonna - I'm not a fan at all of her music, but it is definitely tough to reproduce that pop electronica sound with a live band, and that's why she's always used top calibur musicians like Omar Hakim and Victor Bailey in her band.

 

[DWBass]

Don't get all defense now, you said some tracks were kill'n, well, which ones are they?????? Answer the question! If you can, that is.

Does it matter which ones I think are killin'?? Y'all have already made up your minds that you don't dig them. I'm not gonna waste my time re-watching a video and searching out certain segments for y'all to analyze. Y'all can do that yourselves. I personally liked all the tracks I heard. But I also like a huge range of different musical genres. I'm honestly anxious to hear his tracks played live.

Told ya I'm not trying to argue or sound harsh at all. The musician in me wants to hear what you hear. No from fights from me. My online flame war days are in my shameful past. Let's discuss like musicians. What tunes are killin??

(if you are truly offended ignore my post. You are my fellow TB'r, not trying to fight.)

I'm not offended at all! Maybe my post came off that way. To me, all the tracks are danceable and that's what they're intended to be. You CAN'T hear what I hear. I personally liked what I heard! You said you didn't! Fine! In the meantime YOU can go to MTV.com and watch & listen to the songs yourself. I'm not doing it for you!

 

[Rudreax]

You're avoiding the question. If you would just say what tracks you like and why you like them, we could look at them at a new perspective and maybe find a middle ground.

Oh, and I listen to a ton of genres too, and I'm always open to new things. That doesn't mean I'll like everything though. Having an open mind means having the patience to try out new thing; it doesn't mean you have to automatically like them.

 

[DWBass]

You're avoiding the question. If you would just say what tracks you like and why you like them, we could look at them at a new perspective and maybe find a middle ground.

Since nobody wants to read and would rather bait me into a senseless debate.............

I said I liked all the tracks I heard. I liked the sounds, the beats, the grooves and even the robot (autotune) vocal tracks. The tunes are all very danceable and like I said, the target demographic will surely eat this up! Whether you dig P Diddy or not, he's had more successes than failures! Instead of focusing on my comments, why don't you all go watch the episode again and re-listen to the tracks yourself!

 

[Rudreax]

Since nobody wants to read and would rather bait me into a senseless debate.............

I said I liked all the tracks I heard. I liked the sounds, the beats, the grooves and even the robot (autotune) vocal tracks. The tunes are all very danceable and like I said, the target demographic will surely eat this up! Whether you dig P Diddy or not, he's had more successes than failures! Instead of focusing on my comments, why don't you all go watch the episode again and re-listen to the tracks yourself!

I did, and I still couldn't find something I liked about it. That was why I asked you about it.