Double Bass Palatino Megathread part II

[GKon]

hi all,
got a used pal recently and have been enjoying it. i'm fighting high action but will "adjust" the nut and do some bridge work. my question is...
what's so bad about the stock bridge? it certainly needs filing/sanding for proper adjustment but why does everyone replace theirs? is the wood type too flimsy? what's up?

I haven't changed mine, either. I am by know means an expert as this is my first foray into the UB world.
As mentioned, the typical reason I've seen for people replacing their bridge is typically a matter of quality.
Mine seems to work fine but I haven't tried another for comparison either.

 

[blakelock]

hey all,
i'm getting a little buzz out of the G string. it almost sounds like the string is buzzing against the fingerboard (it also doesn't sustain very well) but i can see there is clearance between the strong and board (except where i'm actually fingering the note). i'm using the stock bridge and the G string has ~5mm clearance at the end of the fingerboard.

ideas?

 

[bassfacer22]

Ha.. These things.. Get a better bass..

But I will tell you the answer.

It's one of these or multiple..

-the neck is not straight / fingerboard is warping..

-your bridge is not carved correctly (the curve) look down from the top scroll to the floor and line up the curve of the bridge to the fingerboard curve looking from the top scroll down to the floor..

If that is lined up and curve matches the fingerboard curve, then you are left with the nut needs to be replaced/shaved..


I can guarantee you it's the worlds worst bridges they send with their products.. Especially since it's factory.. Take the thing to nearest luthier and tell him to carve the bridge to the fingerboard curvature..

I know, because I even had the company send me another factory bridge because the one (also factory!) from the store was absolutely horrid..

I wouldn't put money into the palatino though..

 

[carl h.]

Take the thing to nearest luthier and tell him to carve the bridge to the fingerboard curvature..

NO, do not do this.

NO

NO

NO

!!!

Take it to a good luthier and describe your problems with the instrument. Let them examine the instrument and LET THEM TELL YOU what needs to be done.

 

[GKon]

Ha.. These things.. Get a better bass..

But I will tell you the answer.

It's one of these or multiple..

-the neck is not straight / fingerboard is warping..

-your bridge is not carved correctly (the curve) look down from the top scroll to the floor and line up the curve of the bridge to the fingerboard curve looking from the top scroll down to the floor..

If that is lined up and curve matches the fingerboard curve, then you are left with the nut needs to be replaced/shaved..


I can guarantee you it's the worlds worst bridges they send with their products.. Especially since it's factory.. Take the thing to nearest luthier and tell him to carve the bridge to the fingerboard curvature..

I know, because I even had the company send me another factory bridge because the one (also factory!) from the store was absolutely horrid..

I wouldn't put money into the palatino though..

I've never had as horrible an experience with my bridge, or my neck or nut or fingerboard, so my
first response would not be to buy a better bass.

If you know, for sure, that the bass is set up properly, meaning that the bridge is sitting properly, not tilted
in the wrong direction, and you're still having problems, then take it to a luthier as is. Let them
play it and look it over so that they can give you their prognosis.

It may be the bridge. It may be the fingerboard. It may be the nut. It may be the string. You won't
know till a professional looks it over.

I don't think negative comments like the above are at all helpful or necessary. Although I can see that bassfacer22 had a bad experience
with his, which happens with all things - basses, guitars, cars, houses - MOST of the people that have posted about their Palatino/Harley Benton,
myself included, have had good experiences. Don't get scared off by one bad unit one person had a problem with.

 

[DoubleMIDI]

This has nothing to do with the curvature of the bridge!

It is also not the nut when the note is fingered.

If it is a fingered note and only happens in this area (and probably only on this string) it is a bump in the board. It is possible to correct it yourself, but only if you have some experience or knowledge how and where to correct that.

If you are not completely sure how to do that, let a luthier correct that or you may have ruined your fingerboard which basically means ruined the whole instrument.

One problem with cheap EUBs is that the fingerboard is often totally straight which leads to buzzing with a low string action. The manufacturers either don't know that the fingerboard needs a camber of think the trussrod, which doesn't do anything on a thick DB neck, would take care of it.

So the cheap EUB can get a lot more expensive by letting a double bass (!) luthier do a good setup, but becomes much more playable that way. Don't bring the bass to a guitar or bass guitar luthier. In most cases they have no idea what is really needed. (There are some exceptions here on Talkbass...)

 

[GKon]

Oh, I forgot that the Palatino has a truss rod!

Are you saying you don't thing trying to use the truss rod on these would do much because of the thickness of the neck?

 

[DoubleMIDI]

I'm not sure with the Palatino, but it does nothing on my Stagg, even if completely loose (except rattling) or as tight as possible (without breaking the thread).

The Stagg neck is a bit thick for my taste, but as far as I know the Palatino has a fingerboard glued on and a working trussrod might separate the fingerboard from the neck since the wood parts are much thicker and don't bend as well as on a bass guitar.

These cheap things seem to be constructed by bass guitar builders that never worked on a double bass in their life or the head of development decided that he knows better than the double bass guy...

 

[carl h.]

Palatino has a history of making furniture grade instruments.

This EUB is the only thing they make that is worth anything, and it is worth some basic setup by someone who knows what they are doing. It can be a giggable rig that is better than an upright in some circumstances.

 

[GKon]

Palatino has a history of making furniture grade instruments.

This EUB is the only thing they make that is worth anything, and it is worth some basic setup by someone who knows what they are doing. It can be a giggable rig that is better than an upright in some circumstances.

I can gig mine right now, as is, that's for sure.

I've just not messed with the truss rod is all

 

[bassfacer22]

This has nothing to do with the curvature of the bridge!

Doublemidi, you know I respect you and your information and experience.

However, I can definitely argue about the curvature of the bridge part.. it does need to line up with the fingerboard.. why would you argue that?

Ok, I will give you 1 valid star for reminding us all that in the many times you mention "cheap" EUB in your posts, you mention the Truss rod and how Real Upright basses don't' have them.

So, It's my error that I forgot the Truss Rod on this "cheap" EUB. Yes it has one, and I did fiddle with it plenty and found out that it does make a difference. The G-string will feel tight and loose as well as farther away and different when you turn it. (Ofcourse all the strings are affected.) It can help actually. I do remember that with this ...... . .. thing.. ha.

Now, I've taken my more "expensive EUB" to David Gage in New York and they re-shaved the top of my "factory bridge"... lining it to the curve of the fingerboard!

(by the way, no Truss Rod on mine.. and while I still don't like the bridge, it's thicker and more stable than your Pally one..)

You can see my bridge even needs a little shift the right and that's because I take off the bridge and strings a lot since I travel.. So it's always unfortunately not set exactly perfect due to traveling..


and by the way here is the curvature you should look at..

 

[DoubleMIDI]

I didn't say the curvature of the bridge is nothing you should care about, I said that it had no influence on buzzing or not. String height (action) has an influence, but not curvature.

Maybe the Palatino has a thinner neck or weaker wood and the trussrod works there. Then by tightening you are able to get a camber. On my Stagg(s) I tried it several times and it didn't work at all. So I got a cheap rosewood fingerboard Stagg, the fingerboard had a total negative camber (= global bump) of 1 mm, so I took out the scraper and made the camber myself (after watching a luthier doing it on my acoustic bass and very carefully correcting a last little bump on that instrument myself). But doing it the first time on my rather expensive acoustic DB made me sweating and took a lot of time, always checking after a few scrapes if it got better or worse. I don't have the camber as deep as I wanted (now 1 mm in the right direction), but it plays a lot better than before, about as well as my other Stagg which has the same camber depth from the beginning.

If the buzz is only on a little region of the fingered notes it is nonetheless a bump in the fingerboard that should be corrected. A higher action might reduce the buzz or area of it and maybe it vanishes totally, but this is at best a temporary solution.

If all notes up to the fifth or sixth buzz, a deeper camber should help, or different strings maybe if there are still some cheapos on there.

The nut might be the culprit if the string buzzes with an open string only but not with fingered ones.

 

[funkbass187]

Doublemidi, you know I respect you and your information and experience.

However, I can definitely argue about the curvature of the bridge part.. it does need to line up with the fingerboard.. why would you argue that?

Ok, I will give you 1 valid star for reminding us all that in the many times you mention "cheap" EUB in your posts, you mention the Truss rod and how Real Upright basses don't' have them.

So, It's my error that I forgot the Truss Rod on this "cheap" EUB. Yes it has one, and I did fiddle with it plenty and found out that it does make a difference. The G-string will feel tight and loose as well as farther away and different when you turn it. (Ofcourse all the strings are affected.) It can help actually. I do remember that with this ...... . .. thing.. ha.

Now, I've taken my more "expensive EUB" to David Gage in New York and they re-shaved the top of my "factory bridge"... lining it to the curve of the fingerboard!

(by the way, no Truss Rod on mine.. and while I still don't like the bridge, it's thicker and more stable than your Pally one..)

You can see my bridge even needs a little shift the right and that's because I take off the bridge and strings a lot since I travel.. So it's always unfortunately not set exactly perfect due to traveling..


and by the way here is the curvature you should look at..

View attachment 800607 View attachment 800608

Its funny how you troll this thread and complain about having to put any work into this Bass, and on the other hand based off of your posts in the eminence thread, you are dealing with just as complicated problems on an instrument that costs 5 times as much....

 

[bassfacer22]

Nice try funkbass187.

You seem to forget the bass I currently put "work" into, is a bass worth putting work into..

If you want to go there, let's go.


We can start with the weight and hardware and strings of the palatino..

Or even the fact that you can remove the neck or have a 5-string version of "my bass" as you say..

But yeah, let's not go there..

Enjoy the palatino

 

[GKon]

Nice try funkbass187.

You seem to forget the bass I currently put "work" into is a bass worth putting work into..

If you want to go there, let's go.


We can start with the weight between the eminence and the palatino..

The removable neck feature.. The fact that I hSve the option

I have no idea what you comments or issues are with the Eminence, nor do I care, but I have to agree that
all of your posts regarding the Palatino/Harley Benton EUB are negative and border on trolling.

 

[funkbass187]

Nice try funkbass187.

You seem to forget the bass I currently put "work" into, is a bass worth putting work into..

If you want to go there, let's go.


We can start with the weight between the Eminence and the palatino..

Or even the fact that you can remove the neck or have a 5-string version of the Eminence..

But yeah, let's not go there..

Enjoy the palatino

For the record I don't even own a palatino. Your pretentious attitude just bothered me enough to call you out... To even bring up a single comparison between something that costs several hundred dollars to something that costs thousands of dollars is just asinine. Good day sir

 

[bassfacer22]

Don't fret, You can be assured I won't be posting here anymore, I only did post to save a poor soul that may be thinking to sink $800 in something that in the end, is heavy and comes with the cheapest hardware, Bridge and Strings and requires, I mean absolutely requires "mods".

My "work" on my current EUB is purely for my taste and my style, but the palatino was unfortunately a truly flawed design. Good idea but That's all.

(I'm not actively trying to "troll" this thread but I forgot to remove it from my subscriptions)

 

[carl h.]

Do you also go to Taco Bell and try to impress people that you know it isn't real Mexican food too?

I bet they care as much about your opinion as we do.

 

[blakelock]

thank you, thank you, thank you, ...everyone.

some great/useful info...and some not so useful. anyway, it only buzzes when fretted so it's not the nut. i tried to adjust the truss to get a ~flat board (i am an EB player, after all). not sure the adjustment did much at all but i'll try to loosen it to see if buzzing decreases. i'll also check to see if buzzing only happens over a narrow range of positions or everywhere and report back.

i did buy a replacement bridge (the eminence) but it needs quite a bit (~13mm) taken off to match the height of the stock bridge so i have my work cut out for me. anyone have picks of how they shaved the eminence bridge to fit?

cheers!

 

[DoubleMIDI]

You shouldn't loosen it, but tighten it. There needs to be a one to two mm space between string and fingerboard in the middle (approximately) when the string is pressed down on the fingerboard at the end of it.