Mostly because people either are using crappy preamps or a preamp that colors the tone.
A great passive bass will sound as same with a good preamp. A sucky passive bass will suck no matter the preamp you put in there.
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Passive vs Active
- Thread starter TheArchitect
- Start date
Mostly because people either are using crappy preamps or a preamp that colors the tone.
A great passive bass will sound as same with a good preamp. A sucky passive bass will suck no matter the preamp you put in there.
Generally speaking, active for modern, passive for old-school.
But there are definitely exceptions. My passive J-bass has so much sizzle, I sometimes wonder when I should replace the nonexistent battery.
I find one of the key ingredients of the old-school sound is a passive tone knob, and a lot of active basses don't have that. The active boost/cut treble control is NOT the same thing IME.
Fortunately, there's no legal or electronic law that says you can't have a passive tone knob on an active bass. So a small but growing number of makers sometimes do. (Ibanez, Sadowsky, Roscoe & Dingwall on some models that I am aware of.)
Failing that, I suppose one could try a lo-pass outboard effect for more "thud" less "slice" - or just get good at thumb plucking.
But there are definitely exceptions. My passive J-bass has so much sizzle, I sometimes wonder when I should replace the nonexistent battery.
I find one of the key ingredients of the old-school sound is a passive tone knob, and a lot of active basses don't have that. The active boost/cut treble control is NOT the same thing IME.
Fortunately, there's no legal or electronic law that says you can't have a passive tone knob on an active bass. So a small but growing number of makers sometimes do. (Ibanez, Sadowsky, Roscoe & Dingwall on some models that I am aware of.)
Failing that, I suppose one could try a lo-pass outboard effect for more "thud" less "slice" - or just get good at thumb plucking.
Why choose?
It's like saying, "What's the best hammer? Framing or ball peen?"
Basses are tools and you need to bring the right too for the job. If you play several different types of music and need different tones on the fly...an onboard preamp is very handy.
I have both active and passive basses and I don't ever think about it. The battery in a passive bass doesn't just "die" suddenly (unless you leave it plugged in). You can usually tell that that the output is lower or you get a bit of break up when you dig in. If that happens, change the battery. I probably change mine twice a year and that's just to be safe. It's not difficult to do. My 18v preamp seems to never die because the preamp in that bass will run from 7v to 18v...so as both batteries drain....you have a LONG time before they get below 7 volts. I have a battery life monitor on the bass that shows me when the batteries start getting low and I know I have literally WEEKS of life left in the batteries when that light starts blinking.
Lastly, almost all my active passes have an active/passive switch with a passive tone control. So with the pull of a pot, I have a completely passive instrument. Not only for a fail safe, but it also gives me a darker tone, less bright tone.
One isn't better than the other unless you apply a context.
It's like saying, "What's the best hammer? Framing or ball peen?"
Basses are tools and you need to bring the right too for the job. If you play several different types of music and need different tones on the fly...an onboard preamp is very handy.
I have both active and passive basses and I don't ever think about it. The battery in a passive bass doesn't just "die" suddenly (unless you leave it plugged in). You can usually tell that that the output is lower or you get a bit of break up when you dig in. If that happens, change the battery. I probably change mine twice a year and that's just to be safe. It's not difficult to do. My 18v preamp seems to never die because the preamp in that bass will run from 7v to 18v...so as both batteries drain....you have a LONG time before they get below 7 volts. I have a battery life monitor on the bass that shows me when the batteries start getting low and I know I have literally WEEKS of life left in the batteries when that light starts blinking.
Lastly, almost all my active passes have an active/passive switch with a passive tone control. So with the pull of a pot, I have a completely passive instrument. Not only for a fail safe, but it also gives me a darker tone, less bright tone.
One isn't better than the other unless you apply a context.
Ignorance at first: I fell for the false promises of advertisements.
I thought you couldn't get a good tone unless you had a pre-amp installed.
But, after tinkering around with several pre-amps, I've gone back to just a standard tone control.
As for pickups, I use both.
All my bass are passive, I find it easy to find a sound I like in most situation.
My first bass was active (Ibanez SR700 PJ). Tone was ok but I never loved it, ended up in the closet once I bought a few passive bass. One day I removed the preamp and wired it VVT, and loved it at once: it became my number 1 again.
Sure, the stock preamp was probably crap. IMO it was mudding up the PU and coloring the tone in a very incosistent way, accentuating the difference in tone between the different area of the fretboard, in a bad way.
I also have a delano sonar preamp sitting around but I am so happy with it in passive configuration, I can not think of a good reason to install it.
I have EQ on the amp, and one at the end of my pedal chain. Why would I want one on my bass too? I am a set and forget kind of guy anyway.
My first bass was active (Ibanez SR700 PJ). Tone was ok but I never loved it, ended up in the closet once I bought a few passive bass. One day I removed the preamp and wired it VVT, and loved it at once: it became my number 1 again.
Sure, the stock preamp was probably crap. IMO it was mudding up the PU and coloring the tone in a very incosistent way, accentuating the difference in tone between the different area of the fretboard, in a bad way.
I also have a delano sonar preamp sitting around but I am so happy with it in passive configuration, I can not think of a good reason to install it.
I have EQ on the amp, and one at the end of my pedal chain. Why would I want one on my bass too? I am a set and forget kind of guy anyway.
I no longer throw a preamp at a passive bass simply to add onboard EQ, which is mainly what preamps do. Plenty of other opportunities to shape tone along the signal path.
There are certain basses that have preamps very deliberately designed to deliver the expected tonal character of the instrument, Stingray being the primary example. On those, the preamp makes sense to me.
There are certain basses that have preamps very deliberately designed to deliver the expected tonal character of the instrument, Stingray being the primary example. On those, the preamp makes sense to me.
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I have two passive basses that use a Creation Audio Labs Redeemer circuit. It's designed to address that issue as well as capacitance loss with long cable runs.
Honestly though, the passive basses I have which do not include the device don't really seem to hum any more than the ones that do, and I am certainly not playing any places where long cable length would be a factor.
Also, the Redeemer requires a battery and therefore I'm not sure a bass that uses one is truly passive. But I thought I'd throw it out there since it was relevant.
I have one of each. I think if you have a good EQ on your amp, unless you need the convenience of adjusting your tone only the fly, and or or your rig has a baked in tone that needs to be modified, having an onboard preamp with tone controls IMO doesn’t make much sense.
As for my active bass, it’s almost always set to flat, with the exception of soloing the bridge pickup and adding some bass boost is a pretty cool jazz sort of sound, but I don’t play much smooth jazz.
My PBj is always wide open tone and volume controls, with a slight boost at 165 hz on the EQ.
Like all of us, I started on passive. My 1st 5 string was a Korean made LTD B205 3 band eq.. Sounded MUCH better than the 2 passive basses I previously had. I do not use a pedal. A pedal kinda defeats the original bass sound. With Active EQ I can get the nice big low sound, control the mud, and have a little punch on top. Perfect. I have since bought and sold a Fender jazz & P bass. P was muddy, jazz, lacked the 'big sound' I have been playing a Sterling ray4 at all my gigs for 3+ years, 2 band active eq, good sound, kinda have to push the lows a little to get a big enough sound. But it is clean. I just recently got another Fender P bass,,
My main player is a bass with an active/passive switch and a 3 band EQ. I have a Sansamp that I use for most of my tone shaping, but I usually run the bass in active mode with all the knobs set flat. It just makes my sound a little more clear and defined, which is useful on the lower notes
My first active bass was an Ibanez BTB Ingot when I was a teenager playing drop tune metal. I didn't realize it had batteries until they died and my uncle, a my local bass god, told me that instruments with EQ systems used internal batteries. I went on to own a few SoundGears with active electronics, one of which I still own. When my uncle passed away he left me his active bass. Aside from my fretless SR and the inherited Yamaha, I don't keep active basses; I found that my batteries always died when I was about to gig, and I spent too much time fiddling with knobs to dial in tones. When I was an active (pun!) gospel musician, the tonal flexibility of active basses fit the music. Now they I mostly play reggae, ska and freaky looping solo bass stuff using pitch shifters and what not, nothing sounds better than a passive bass. I'm looking at some more gospel opportunities, so I may get back to playing actives again, but that's a bridge to be crossed later.
I find the active tone knobs actually do something and you can hear a change even in small increments like going from 1 to 2.
My DJ4 with Nordy NJ4s and a D-Retro from John East is my go-to gigging bass. For gigging, I prefer to have some EQ options at my fingertips so that I don't have to turn around and fiddle with the amp. Also good for jam or other "sit-in" situations where I may not want to change EQ settings on the amp. I sometimes flip the switch to passive mode for the heck of it and it's not like the preamp is adding a bunch of color or otherwise drastically changing the sound of the bass. I see the preamp as giving me flexibility and not a tone-changing thing.
Recording is a whole other beast.
Recording is a whole other beast.
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I've got both, and don't much care. Main gigging basses are a passive P style and an active J style with an audere pre that is pretty neutral sounding. I really don't change tones much, but It is nice to have the option with the active. The main thing I like about actives is that I prefer blend pots to V/V on 2 pickup basses, and my understanding is that active works better here.
This was my perception as well, but now in the past. I have three passive Fenders (one for decades) and recently acquired a Sadowsky Will Lee RW4. Whereas the tone of a Precision is always unmistakable, especially with a tube amp, the Sadowsky compares very well with its template, the passive Jazz Bass. Tone options are broad yet easy to dial in and forget. Significant perhaps is its pickups are single coil passives into the onboard Sadowsky preamp. A Spector I have on order is significantly hotter with active EMGs into its HAZ Labs preamp to produce the trademark Spector growl. Still, EQ is everything. I expect to get the clean deep tone I favor over a metal buzz saw sound.
Horses for courses.
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A lotta folks use their basses plugged directly into preamp pedals which are then plugged directly into the front end of their amp head. In many ways, doing this is kinda like employing active electronics.
Michael Jewels, your picture brings back fond memories of my old Ibanez Musician - I think around 1986.
For the OP's question on active/passive...similar to what others have said, back in the 80s, the "better" boutique basses all/most were active. For me, I stepped up to both the Ibanez and a few years later - an active Warwick Thumb - from a Gibson EB-3 and a mid 70's Fender P-bass (both passive). I've never looked at passive again.
I just finished my second Warmoth build and its outfitted with an active set of pickups and preamp: Seymour Duncan Steve Bailey Active Jazz Bass System (with 18v battery).
For me, having the additional tone shaping controls on the bass is very handy. Having to keep a fresh set of batteries on board is just part of the gear set up. I don't find it anymore bothersome than keeping my small pedalboard in working order.
As a former trombonist, one of my tonal goals when playing jazz or enjoying other solo opportunities on bass is to have sustain and smooth connections between notes, when I want them, without resort to compression or dirt. Yea, verily, getting this is very much an "in the hands" thing, but I've generally found active basses get me there more easily. The flip is that I think a lot of active circuits, particularly 3-band circuits, can introduce a cardboard timbre in the mids, or provide creamy sustain at the expense of a compressed effect that reduces nuance, particularly as to the attack and overall envelope of any given note. In getting more serious about bass, over the last 16 years I've been in and out of maybe 60-70 basses, as I migrated from four to five-string, tried out 35" scale, different wood formulations and ergonomic solutions - and realized that is not not a mortal sin to own a great bass without being a master player - almost all of those instruments have been active. And, frankly, a lot of them were not gonna be satisfying over the long haul. But I'm now playing in a straight-up rock band rather than doing a jazz/latin/rock/folklorical thing, and am re-visiting my goals and biases.
Of the few passives I've had, the only ones I've loved have been old Yamaha BB2000s, and a G&L JB-2 with Nordstrand single-coils. I'll probably stick with active, for the most part. On the cream/nuanced envelope continuum, the Sadowsky preamp consistently satisfies; 20% bass boost and 10-15% treble, and I'm often changing the pickup blend or VTC setting between tunes. Right now, a Japanese Metro WL5 is knocking my socks off in this rock context, and the mid-range boost is very useful. I've also had good experiences with Aguilar and John East preamp circuits, and at some point will try a Nordstrand. Pretty much everything else just doesn't sound right to me -- too much knob-twiddling for a desirable tone.
But, here's the kicker. I recently took a flyer on a Fender Roscoe Beck V,which features passive single coil/parallel/series for each pickup. I'd owned one once before and was frustrated by the weight and thick neck, but this one is a fretless, defretted and coated by H.G. Thor. This bass is a beast, and I'm hearing a purity of tone and envelope response that is really blowing me away, and leads me to revisit this passive thing. After the New Year, I'm planning to spend a lot of time with that bass, and to also explore passive settings on the Sadowsky.
One thought - I'm in my mid-60's, and my hearing took beating from arena/stadium/large theater gigs in my trombone years without ear protection. For many years I preferred dual hum-cancelling pickups, so my new-found affection for single-coils may indicate increased loss of high-frequency information. But for where I'm at right now, single-coils and a smart Sadowsky preamp are floating my boat, and I'm looking forward to further exploration of the RBV.
Of the few passives I've had, the only ones I've loved have been old Yamaha BB2000s, and a G&L JB-2 with Nordstrand single-coils. I'll probably stick with active, for the most part. On the cream/nuanced envelope continuum, the Sadowsky preamp consistently satisfies; 20% bass boost and 10-15% treble, and I'm often changing the pickup blend or VTC setting between tunes. Right now, a Japanese Metro WL5 is knocking my socks off in this rock context, and the mid-range boost is very useful. I've also had good experiences with Aguilar and John East preamp circuits, and at some point will try a Nordstrand. Pretty much everything else just doesn't sound right to me -- too much knob-twiddling for a desirable tone.
But, here's the kicker. I recently took a flyer on a Fender Roscoe Beck V,which features passive single coil/parallel/series for each pickup. I'd owned one once before and was frustrated by the weight and thick neck, but this one is a fretless, defretted and coated by H.G. Thor. This bass is a beast, and I'm hearing a purity of tone and envelope response that is really blowing me away, and leads me to revisit this passive thing. After the New Year, I'm planning to spend a lot of time with that bass, and to also explore passive settings on the Sadowsky.
One thought - I'm in my mid-60's, and my hearing took beating from arena/stadium/large theater gigs in my trombone years without ear protection. For many years I preferred dual hum-cancelling pickups, so my new-found affection for single-coils may indicate increased loss of high-frequency information. But for where I'm at right now, single-coils and a smart Sadowsky preamp are floating my boat, and I'm looking forward to further exploration of the RBV.
That is my favorite era of Ibanez basses. The Musician Series (Is that what they're called ?) look so perfect, elegant, and sleek. I still want to own one someday, even though I am determined to downsize. (Yeah, right...)
Alembic was the first to pioneer and use active electronics, and I'm sure this bass and others like it like the Aria Pro II , although passive, were a nod to Alembic.
I love the sound of both passive, and active, but I hate the annoying 60 cycle hum of single coils, hence my lean towards active.
Nice bass AND duds there, @BSatt .
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