Pedal "coupler" question...

[Honch]

I thought couplers would be a good idea too. Oops, in the bin they went.

View attachment 1037626

See there, you can see that the line these three pedals form is that the middle pedal RAISES the ones next to it. You can see them slightly taking off from the floor at the outer edges of their case. If you throw more in line, all it will do is kind of a massive see-saw effect that whenever you press on the outer pedal, it will act as a lever for the rest of the pedals in the chain, and LIFT up the outer ones. Now, try cramming all these pedals down with velcro and screws, and you - literarelly - screw up all input jacks as there will be enormous stress on them.

EDIT: That pic is a perfect exhibit A. Think of how they fare, if you stick them firmly onto any pedalboard, so they will not move? Flat. They will produce enormous stress on the circuit board inside, and will forever induce excess force downard at the circuit board inside, which you don't see from the outside. Well, the offset couplers will work... for a while. Guess what happens every time you step on them?

Avoid. I use them as dummy plugs for putting into input jack 1&2 to get some sound out of some tube amps, and get "just a load" in front of a volume pedals used as an Delay expression. I'll use George L plugs for this purpose too. George L plugs sux big time. But that's OT. Enough of threads already on that one.

 

[Honch]

But I still hate solderless plugs...that's OT, and that's another question. Use solder as much as possible wherever/whenever you can. I challenge everyone to a proper blindfold test if you can tell the difference in sound of small patch cables if they're soldered or not. Period. I'd challenge even Eric Johnson any day.

 

[ShadowImage]

Does anyone have a link to a good deal on EBS patch cables?

 

[eriky4003]

I've used the offset and the back-to-back male couplers to good effect on my board. Nice to save space on a small board and also a nice aesthetic.

 

[hintz]

OP, i tried the one on the right, where there is wiggle room. I put it on my board, and when i tried to reposition the pedals i broke it. No pedal took damage. Went to buy these EBS cables then. I use George L.'s for the longer strips on the board and the EBS for the shorter ones.

Great idea!!

FWIW, I can't see the space saving made on this video, at all, it's even more distance between the two pedals...



Also, take a guess which of his pedals he can rock loose from the velcro, and lift straight up in the air? ...yes, none... except the first one.

Thanks, I am abandoning the coupler idea . This had nothing to do with space but reliability since I've had cables go bad on gigs and I've read all the bad things and was wondering I there was a safe way to do this! It seems even the slightest movement with these will eventually destroy the circuit board connection to the jack....apparently even bolted down and level, so I get it!!

So dont worry!! . I gotcha

 

[walterw]

I've used the offset and the back-to-back male couplers to good effect on my board. Nice to save space on a small board and also a nice aesthetic.

uh, have you read through the thread?

especially this perfect example of what happens even with identical pedals with apparently straight sides?

I thought couplers would be a good idea too. Oops, in the bin they went.

solid couplers are pretty much the devil

 

[gregmon79]

Does anyone have a link to a good deal on EBS patch cables?

Invalid Link Removed

Or you could go this route. This is where a lot of us get them I think. Bass strings online rules. Jason is the man!!

Invalid Link Removed

 

[hintz]

Really, if there was a multifx unit that could satisfy all my needs and wants id go that route!! I'm surprised a company like Source Audio or TC Electronics (with their toneprint stuff)haven't made a convincing yet programmable multi....

Of course they'd have to charge *alot* to not lose money! I know people rave about that one system(name escapes me, popular with guitarists as well)...edit: AxeFX!! Thats it....but I've heard even that has its drawbacks!

Just thinking out loud!! Thanks everyone!

 

[Honch]

Luckily I live in Sweden, the EBS cables are in abundance! At good prices too, although they aren't maufactured here at all! Different lengths too. The only thing I hate is that they changed out the desing slightly - to these ones with the lighting bolt on it - without notice. They were made better. I bought a couple of spares too. But I tell you, don't go too long with them, because then the "small footprint" design of them will start to show itself. The signal loss on small short cables is neglible, but as fast as you go up to 40-50 cm or 1 meter it may start to show itself, and no shielding or cunning "complete mold" will save you from it. I've made the effort to solder George L cables onto PANCAKE plugs. The George L cables are great, however, their angled plugs not. But I definitely use solder. At all times. Open copper strands to air will oxidize in a couple of years, and in some places on the earth (coastal areas) they will just take a month or two. A verdigris on any copper strand will put a veil over the sound - eventually - way more than any soldered plugs will. If you have proper solder it will protect the copper strands from oxidizing, and - actually - keep a firmer grip on the actual surface, and be a slight pull/push protection too, stress relief. Solder protects the copper wire from oxidizing. And those who tells you that you can hear a difference on patch cables without soldering and with soldering may very well go and pound sand. You MAY hear it on longer cables though, but not short patch ones, for sure.

- - - - - - - - - -

Mind you that those people I've encountered who've changed from hard couplers to short patch cables, have complained that they have had same problems with patch cable too later on provided they use it on the same pedals. And blames them patch cables! However, when scrutinizing the intestants of their pedals, it was the old couplers who had ripped up the circuit board joints in the solder to the output jacks, and you had to resolder them to make a firm connection again. When trying their patch cables on other pedals, no problem occured at all, no matter how you wiggled or turned on them.

Just a caveat or warning, if you should make that switch. I wonder why "That Pedal Show" hasn't brought up this as of yet.

 

[Honch]

Really, if there was a multifx unit that could satisfy all my needs and wants id go that route!! I'm surprised a company like Source Audio or TC Electronics (with their toneprint stuff)haven't made a convincing yet programmable multi....

MulitFX was tried in the 90s, and eventually the fad wore thin. Guitarists/bassist wants to change out effects all of the time. If a new phaser hits the shores, or pitch shifter, or whatever fuzz, overdrive, amp sim etc you will go for that, and change out your old ones one at a time. Line6 has multifx, for sure, TC made one unwieldy huge pedal board (the steel one with overdone switches) and there's actually a lot more, like BOSS, KORG and the like. Tech21 has their slimmed ones with just the "swiss army knife" fx onboard. People just wants to change and swap out effects all of the time whenever they get tired. I went through my pedalboard, and concluded that I basically just use three ones. I want Didigtal Delay with program presets, that can take care of loopers, and mimick old tape analog units, and a reverb, and an "all around" overdrive. I changed each year, finally, until I found the one I've used for 7 years by now: It's a Klon Centaur -> Digitech TimeBender -> Strymon Blue Sky. Prior to that, I used TC Electronic, T-Rex, yada yada, never ever coming to that sweet spot, or just "leave it on" pedals. The Klon is on its way out by now. Due to aliasing and heterodyning induced on the other pedals, but this is very OT. Found out that I don't use flangers phasers, ring mods, or wahs. I e mostly concetrating on time based "after amp sound" effects. I don't want too much happening at the input, but likes sounds that are post amp, like delays and reverbs. Chorus I hate these days, especially on bass. Just takes away that "oomph" in the bass and leaves phase artifacts and holes in the frequency spectrum.

The thing is, that people thought with mulitFX, that you could use a lot of effects in a chain, and pile 7-8 on top of each other, only to find out it turned out like a watered down washed out sound, that you couldn't use anywhere.

 

[hintz]

MulitFX was tried in the 90s, and eventually the fad wore thin. Guitarists/bassist wants to change out effects all of the time. If a new phaser hits the shores, or pitch shifter, or whatever fuzz, overdrive, amp sim etc you will go for that, and change out your old ones one at a time. Line6 has multifx, for sure, TC made one unwieldy huge pedal board (the steel one with overdone switches) and there's actually a lot more, like BOSS, KORG and the like. Tech21 has their slimmed ones with just the "swiss army knife" fx onboard. People just wants to change and swap out effects all of the time whenever they get tired. I went through my pedalboard, and concluded that I basically just use three ones. I want Didigtal Delay with program presets, that can take care of loopers, and mimick old tape analog units, and a reverb, and an "all around" overdrive. I changed each year, finally, until I found the one I've used for 7 years by now: It's a Klon Centaur -> Digitech TimeBender -> Strymon Blue Sky. Prior to that, I used TC Electronic, T-Rex, yada yada, never ever coming to that sweet spot, or just "leave it on" pedals. The Klon is on its way out by now. Due to aliasing and heterodyning induced on the other pedals, but this is very OT. Found out that I don't use flangers phasers, ring mods, or wahs. I e mostly concetrating on time based "after amp sound" effects. I don't want too much happening at the input, but likes sounds that are post amp, like delays and reverbs. Chorus I hate these days, especially on bass. Just takes away that "oomph" in the bass and leaves phase artifacts and holes in the frequency spectrum.

The thing is, that people thought with mulitFX, that you could use a lot of effects in a chain, and pile 7-8 on top of each other, only to find out it turned out like a watered down washed out sound, that you couldn't use anywhere.

Thanks, and I couldn't agree more ...., I know a tiny bit about pedals and multiFX, bought my first pedal in 94'(DOD Bass Grunge) and owned a few different BOSS multi's(neither did it for me)and played with many guitarists who used multifx, all of which were sterile to my ears!

I just watched some demos of the AxeFX stuff, I gotta say WOW!! It nails everything!! Too bad thats way outta my price range and I'm picking up the Darkglass 900 amp tomorrow(they "attempted" deliver while I was working and didn't knock on the door so the wife had no clue!? ). Dammit!!

 

[hintz]

a buffer. a looper, or line driver maybe in order. Hell an eq or boost can do the same thing. you only need one buffer inline. put it at end to lift your signal a bit. Active/Passive input volume matching. is a personal issue, and sound is subjective. hope this helps.

You gave me another idea! So I've *always * put the tuner first! But check this out....

I must confess, I *was* in fact using a few couplers I lying around(also why i ordered them and thought running a bunch might be fail safe) and this looks like it might be damage from it being it won't plug in all the way(compare to where I plugged in my bass)

You mentioned using a buffer of some sort at the end of my chain....What if I got another BOSS TU2 or 3 and ran that right before my compressor considering all of these are true bypass(I think they all are anyways?), it'd kill two birds with one stone!!(in theory anyways?!)

it'd definitely kill yet another with you talking about the dangers of running longer cables and the fact that I could move the Saturnworks loop where the SA PEQ is and that where the tuner is(I use this to ensure even output to my touch sensitive FX by feeding them equal levels)....

Just a thought, but what do you think??

 

[hintz]

For visual reference Adienn7

if having a buffer meaning *any* pedal like the BOSS ones?

I've never ran the tuner last, but have seen many do it! And the SA BEF, MWBD and an incoming Tech21 bass chorus will all be in a loop, so moving the Saturnwkorks will ensure two roughly even cables rather than one a bit longer(which you mentioned)....

That Ibanez wont be on this BTW! Only for measurement....

 

[ShadowImage]

MulitFX was tried in the 90s, and eventually the fad wore thin. Guitarists/bassist wants to change out effects all of the time. If a new phaser hits the shores, or pitch shifter, or whatever fuzz, overdrive, amp sim etc you will go for that, and change out your old ones one at a time. Line6 has multifx, for sure, TC made one unwieldy huge pedal board (the steel one with overdone switches) and there's actually a lot more, like BOSS, KORG and the like. Tech21 has their slimmed ones with just the "swiss army knife" fx onboard. People just wants to change and swap out effects all of the time whenever they get tired. I went through my pedalboard, and concluded that I basically just use three ones. I want Didigtal Delay with program presets, that can take care of loopers, and mimick old tape analog units, and a reverb, and an "all around" overdrive. I changed each year, finally, until I found the one I've used for 7 years by now: It's a Klon Centaur -> Digitech TimeBender -> Strymon Blue Sky. Prior to that, I used TC Electronic, T-Rex, yada yada, never ever coming to that sweet spot, or just "leave it on" pedals. The Klon is on its way out by now. Due to aliasing and heterodyning induced on the other pedals, but this is very OT. Found out that I don't use flangers phasers, ring mods, or wahs. I e mostly concetrating on time based "after amp sound" effects. I don't want too much happening at the input, but likes sounds that are post amp, like delays and reverbs. Chorus I hate these days, especially on bass. Just takes away that "oomph" in the bass and leaves phase artifacts and holes in the frequency spectrum.

The thing is, that people thought with mulitFX, that you could use a lot of effects in a chain, and pile 7-8 on top of each other, only to find out it turned out like a watered down washed out sound, that you couldn't use anywhere.

My experience is much different from your own. Both myself and the guitarist in my band always use multiFX combined with individual pedals. Personally I currently always have flanger and chorus on for bass. She prefers BOSS where as I use Line 6 and ZOOM.
I agree that it's easy to over layer fx with these units and create a wash but they have great uses. We travel a lot, so none of us use traditional amp heads. This means playing on backline and borrowed gear where a multiFX allows us to create our tone with a small box. MultiFX are great for air travel which we do at least every few months.
Just my experience.

 

[gregmon79]

Luckily I live in Sweden, the EBS cables are in abundance! At good prices too, although they aren't maufactured here at all! Different lengths too. The only thing I hate is that they changed out the desing slightly - to these ones with the lighting bolt on it - without notice. They were made better. I bought a couple of spares too. But I tell you, don't go too long with them, because then the "small footprint" design of them will start to show itself. The signal loss on small short cables is neglible, but as fast as you go up to 40-50 cm or 1 meter it may start to show itself, and no shielding or cunning "complete mold" will save you from it. I've made the effort to solder George L cables onto PANCAKE plugs. The George L cables are great, however, their angled plugs not. But I definitely use solder. At all times. Open copper strands to air will oxidize in a couple of years, and in some places on the earth (coastal areas) they will just take a month or two. A verdigris on any copper strand will put a veil over the sound - eventually - way more than any soldered plugs will. If you have proper solder it will protect the copper strands from oxidizing, and - actually - keep a firmer grip on the actual surface, and be a slight pull/push protection too, stress relief. Solder protects the copper wire from oxidizing. And those who tells you that you can hear a difference on patch cables without soldering and with soldering may very well go and pound sand. You MAY hear it on longer cables though, but not short patch ones, for sure.

- - - - - - - - - -

Mind you that those people I've encountered who've changed from hard couplers to short patch cables, have complained that they have had same problems with patch cable too later on provided they use it on the same pedals. And blames them patch cables! However, when scrutinizing the intestants of their pedals, it was the old couplers who had ripped up the circuit board joints in the solder to the output jacks, and you had to resolder them to make a firm connection again. When trying their patch cables on other pedals, no problem occured at all, no matter how you wiggled or turned on them.

Just a caveat or warning, if you should make that switch. I wonder why "That Pedal Show" hasn't brought up this as of yet.

I noticed that too, that design change. I liked the first ones they came out with better. It's like they're the same thing but not totally.

I also use George L’s as well as the newer Disaster Area ones. I like the DA’s quite a bit better. I found that with George L’s, I had to redo a handful of patches almost every time I revamped my board. They have a habit of going bad most times over time from movement alone. And I do have a lot of that going on at certain times. But those DA’s have a more rubbery feel so they feel like they’d old out longer and the connections feel more solid and simple. I like the DA’s a lot actually.

 

[gregmon79]

You gave me another idea! So I've *always * put the tuner first! But check this out....View attachment 1038520

I must confess, I *was* in fact using a few couplers I lying around(also why i ordered them and thought running a bunch might be fail safe) and this looks like it might be damage from it being it won't plug in all the way(compare to where I plugged in my bass)View attachment 1038521

You mentioned using a buffer of some sort at the end of my chain....What if I got another BOSS TU2 or 3 and ran that right before my compressor considering all of these are true bypass(I think they all are anyways?), it'd kill two birds with one stone!!(in theory anyways?!)

it'd definitely kill yet another with you talking about the dangers of running longer cables and the fact that I could move the Saturnworks loop where the SA PEQ is and that where the tuner is(I use this to ensure even output to my touch sensitive FX by feeding them equal levels)....

Just a thought, but what do you think??

I strongly recommend the Boss TU3 man. I went from using a TC Poly Mini for a few years thinking I'd never move on from it, and got a TU3 about 4 months ago. I will never look back. Yeah it's bigger but it doesnt matter. I like the Boss a lot more and it has that nice buffer. Plus you can power other pedals off of it. I know you can do that with the bigger TC ones thought too. I do miss the bigger LED screen, but that’s it. And it’s not a big deal when you get a superior tuner in many ways. I say you should go for it man. One of the better decisions I’ve made.

 

[hintz]

I strongly recommend the Boss TU3 man. I went from using a TC Poly Mini for a few years thinking I'd never move one from it, and got a TU3 about 4 months ago. I will never look back. Yeah it's bigger but it doesnt matter. I like the Boss a lot more and it has that nice buffer. Plus you can power other pedals off of it. I know you can do that with the bigger TC ones thought too. I do miss the bigger LED screen, but that’s it. And it’s not a big deal when you get a superior tuner in many ways. I say you should go for it man. One of the better decisions I’ve made.

I've had the TU2 and that was more accurate too!!

 

[gregmon79]

I've had the TU2 and that was more accurate too!!

It does seem more accurate. I was using it in the studio in conjunction with the studios tuner, which is supposedly HIGHLY accurate. The TU3 was matching it down to the smallest measure. I was impressed. Plus, my mini was causing noise on my board towards the end. Like white noise noise. It kinda sucked. I'm very happy with the TU3 now.

 

[Honch]

They have a habit of going bad most times over time from movement alone. And I do have a lot of that going on at certain times.

Yes, + 2000 powers of ten. My experience too. I use George L's cables soldered onto someone elses plug. Mainly pancakes, and or Neutriks. Neutriks are large though, too large on boards, but perfect for instrument cables/plugs. However, when using bass, George L cables dimes the bass a bit compared to others. The only thing that George L cable "keeps" is the high end. Treble and high mids are great on these. But not at expense on bass.

 

[Honch]

Regarding tuners, yes, I've heard of many people moving away from TC's somehow. It's a fad, you get the hang of it, but after a while you'll start to think...what's the point, the other ones are more accurate anyway. Actually I am the one to avoid too accurate tuners on stage, like Petersons, and Sonic Research Strobe Tuners. At the repair desk, and doing intonation at home, there's simply nothing better, but it takes ages to tune up live on stage with too accurate tuners. Say, a Turbo Tuner, when that red "roulette wheel" stops spinning/rotating you're in tune. But as it spins up sharp at the beginning of the note, to slowly decay out to go flat, you're in for a major chore finding that sweet spot. It will never stop and freeze! I'll say anything at 0.1 cent, even 0.5 cent is ok...for me. On bass, and live.