• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Please educate me on fretless side markers...

Claymore

Claymore

Nov 10, 2019
924
2,154
Rhode Island
#1
So, I have quite a few basses but as of yet, I don't have a single fretless. In fact, as I think about it, I'm not positive that at any point in history I've ever played a fretless. But I feel the need to add one to my collection because... well, it's nice to have options. I keep hearing people saying about certain models "The side fret markers are in the wrong place." I don't want to buy my first fretless and find out that this is the case with my new purchase. So, TBers, how do I determine if any prospective fretlesses have the markers in the right/wrong place? Extra points if you can give examples of brands that have markers in the right places and ones that are totally off. (also, specifically wondering if Wolf brand basses are correct/incorrect) I want to buy a fretless that will make my transition as easy as possible. Thanks in advance! :D
 
  • Like
Reactions: CaribooBass
#2
Claymore said:
So, I have quite a few basses but as of yet, I don't have a single fretless. In fact, as I think about it, I'm not positive that at any point in history I've ever played a fretless. But I feel the need to add one to my collection because... well, it's nice to have options. I keep hearing people saying about certain models "The side fret markers are in the wrong place." I don't want to buy my first fretless and find out that this is the case with my new purchase. So, TBers, how do I determine if any prospective fretlesses have the markers in the right/wrong place? Extra points if you can give examples of brands that have markers in the right places and ones that are totally off. (also, specifically wondering if Wolf brand basses are correct/incorrect) I want to buy a fretless that will make my transition as easy as possible. Thanks in advance! :D
Click to expand...
The side dots are either going to be placed as though the bass had frets (dot between frets) or dot where fret would be placed.
It is easier if the dot is placed where the fret would be, but I play either.
This problem completely goes away if you get a lined fretless
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Lance Bunyon, GrapeBass, gzarruk and 15 others
#3
There's a lot of controversy about this topic, but in my experience a lined fretless is the most practical way to go. You'll completely avoid the dot issue, because the lines will be exactly where the frets would be. So you'll basically know where you're at, and since your fingers aren't as precise as lines your ears will do the rest. Unlined fretless gives you style points I guess, but it's easy to play an out-of-tune note right when you come in, before you have a frame of reference. Studio time is expensive so why waste takes trying to look cool, that's just my opinion of it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: GKon, timplog, Gilmourisgod and 12 others
#4
B-Mac said:
They side dots are either going to be placed as though the bass had frets (dot between frets) or dot where fret would be placed.
It is easier if the dot is placed where the fret would be, but I play either.
This problem completely goes away if you get a lined fretless
Click to expand...
Assuming I'm leaning towards unlined fretless (because I'm looking at Wolf basses), will the markers being basically shifted a half-step off mess with my finger positioning? I mean, if I know the double marker is the 12th fret, my instinct tells me to finger just above that. Again... please forgive my ignorance because I know nothing about fretless. I just don't want to make a purchase I'll regret later.
 
#6
If you think in terms of a factory built bass (Fender, Ibanez, Yamaha, MusicMan, etc.) the dots, inlays, fret slots, neck bolts, routings, all that stuff is pretty controlled. The side markers go on the neck based on a fixed design. Since fretless necks are a very low runner compared to fretted there's no cost incentive for a factory to make a different neck build just for a 2% item. For a hand-built instrument the builder has more flexibility. Best thing to do with side dots in "fretted" location is to use them like a landing light. You learn to adapt pretty quickly. Yes, it's kinda goofy to think of it as something that you and the factory know is a little nuts. Personally I just see it as a "humanizing" element. It's an imperfection that you can learn to love or ignore but short of paying premium it is something that's quite common.
Some brands get it, but most don't have any real reason to change.
 
#7
Claymore said:
Ok, let me narrow this down... Out of the 4 brands that I am looking at, which ones have side markers in the "correct" locations?
Squire, Wolf, Ibanez and Sire.
Click to expand...
If you know the actual model name or model number google it and check the images that come up. You should be able to tell right away by comparing to one of your own fretted basses.
 
#10
B-Mac said:
No
It really isn’t that difficult
One will be just like your fretted bass
One will be obviously different
Either or

post the other ones you mentioned and I’ll help you out.
Click to expand...
02149D4C-26BB-4C46-BCF7-D054055CDF8C.jpeg
 
#11
OP, you're overthinking all of this: get the unlined fretless that you want. if the side dots are incorrect* = blot them out (paint, magic marker, fingernail polish, yada yada) and put them in the correct location based on the string/note intervals but also taking into account where your finger pad(s) lies when the pitch is sounded. if you think you need to experiment with this before you make more permanent markings: use tape for a while (to mark the correct locations) and check your accuracy. easy peasy!

good luck! :thumbsup:



* even if they're correct per the factory: they may not be quite correct for your fingering style, view of the fingerboard, etc.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: shojii, thedovewarlord, comatosedragon and 11 others
#13
JRA said:
OP, you're overthinking all of this: get the unlined fretless that you want. if the side dots are incorrect* = blot them out (paint, magic marker, fingernail polish, yada yada) and put them in the correct location based on the string/note intervals but also taking into account where your finger pad(s) lies when the pitch is sounded. if you think you need to experiment with this before you make more permanent markings: use tape for a while to check your accuracy. easy peasy!

good luck! :thumbsup:



* even if they're correct per the factory: they may not be quite correct for your fingering style, view of the fingerboard, etc.
Click to expand...
Mind... blown. :wideyed: I've been looking for an excuse to get the magic markers out.
 
  • Like
Reactions: equill
#17
Claymore said:
I'm sorry but to me, that looks in between. The markers appear to be in the exact same position as on the fretted. Second opinion, anyone?
Click to expand...
no they are not in the same location.

the fretless has the octave dble dots lower.

They are not in the same location.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Glazenn, MonetBass, Mili and 1 other person
#19
Claymore said:
I'm sorry but to me, that looks in between. The markers appear to be in the exact same position as on the fretted. Second opinion, anyone?
Click to expand...
Nope, I clearly see a difference. Look at the relationship to the upper horn cut where it contacts the neck and the dot placement -
Capture3.JPG

The dot on the fretted is almost exactly in line with where that horn contacts the neck. The dot on the fretless is clearly "down" some.

@B-Mac is right, the fretless has the dots located where the fret line would be.
 
  • Like
Reactions: B-Mac, Bassdirty, Sixgunn and 5 others
#20
I play upright, no markers of any kind, I have a deferetted PBass with dots in the middle between where the frets were, I also had an unlined fretless RBass and don't remember if it had dots or where the were if it did. You really won't need the dots after 15 minutes once your hands get used to where the notes are on the fingerboard. (although I cheated once on a recording session where I had to make a huge leap of faith to a note way up the fingerboard and put a piece if masking tape where the note was so I wouldn't miss it ... saw the bassist from Lake Street Dive do that and thought it was a good idea).
 
  • Like
Reactions: Craig22221, Bassdirty, viper4000 and 8 others

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back