Plucking finger independence?

[PaulYeah]

I've been playing since 1989 and only in the last few years have I realized that my lack of plucking finger independence has been slowing me down. What I mean by that is that if I try to play strictly alternating fingers and raking consistently, I often have trouble playing a phrase equally well starting with one plucking finger vs the other.

It came from practicing RIO and other tough basslines plucking the first note with the index finger every time. If I try to play RIO starting on the middle finger, I get tripped up.

So I've spent the last few years (yes, years) trying to get back on track. And it's a lot of hard work.

I don't think I've seen this discussed much, but if you are just starting out on bass and there are any songs or exercises that you practice frequently, please take my advice and play everything one time through starting with the index finger, and then again plucking the first note with the middle finger.

I'm curious if anyone else has had to go through a similar process because they weren't disciplined when they were learning plucking hand technique?

 

[ahbass2500]

Were you taught to strictly alternate fingers when you started?

Asking because I ignored this advice and think I have been better off for it. I alternate most of the time, but do not have any strict adherence to which finger hits a given string on a given beat. While I understand the problem you are describing, it is not one I have had.

I expect it is because I have played in a way that was comfortable to me rather than trying to force myself to play to a rule about which finger does what. Sometimes that means not alternating. Finger raking already disturbs the alternating plucking which is why I stopped trying to do it to begin with. My mind struggled to force my fingers to strictly alternate so I quickly stopped trying.

 

[PaulYeah]

I'm about 99% self-taught. My uncle, who is a guitarist, taught me not to hold the neck like a baseball bat, but the rest I picked up from watching other bass players.

I'm with you on not forcing yourself to strictly alternate. But really the main gist of my post is that there are some sequences of notes that are harder for me to play if I start them with one plucking finger vs the other. Not because I haven't forced strict alternating, but because I haven't practiced every sequence of notes starting with one plucking finger and then again starting with the other.

Count this as another testimonial for getting at least a few lessons early on to get your technique straight!

 

[pluki7]

Most of the time I'll start with the middle finger, then when I need to go to the next string, let's say from the A to the D, I'll use the one that is free, but when moving from the A to the E, I'll use the finger that's already resting on the E to pluck it. So it's alternating going up, but like sweep picking when going down. Of course when doing some things like the disco octave, I'll start with the index.

 

[Brandon Shea]

Certain passages really are easier starting with one finger over the other. Hysteria by Muse is a great example. I wouldn't stress about it too much, and if you find those types of passages in songs, just try to make a mental note of which finger needs to take the lead at the start. Otherwise, just go with what feels natural!

 

[FullumMusic]

Strictly alternating picking can be a great, useful technique that improves your playing and helps with certain passages. It's also a great thing to practice because imho it also improves non-strictly-alternating playing. However, it's not a immutable rule of bass playing law.

Good technique is whatever enables you play the bass line (so long as it doesn't cause injury). If you need to use a different technique to play something successfully, if the original bassist used a different technique, if you need to repeat a finger or rake or whatever, do it.

Something a bass teacher told me once stuck with me: "It's a musician's responsibility to figure out the easiest way to play their part."

 

[evanrunyon]

Gonna be honest here—I’ve never once thought about this.

 

[Brandon Shea]

Something a bass teacher told me once stuck with me: "It's a musician's responsibility to figure out the easiest way to play their part."

I like that! Gotta remember that one.

 

[FullumMusic]

I like that! Gotta remember that one.

Right? It seems so simple & obvious. But i can't tell you how many times i've come across a tricky passage, struggled with it for a while, and had to stop and go, "i wonder if i played it differently if it would be easier?" and then it was. I could drive myself crazy getting good at playing it the hard way, or i can just play it the easy way.

 

[dbsfgyd1]

I've been playing since 1989 and only in the last few years have I realized that my lack of plucking finger independence has been slowing me down. What I mean by that is that if I try to play strictly alternating fingers and raking consistently, I often have trouble playing a phrase equally well starting with one plucking finger vs the other.

It came from practicing RIO and other tough basslines plucking the first note with the index finger every time. If I try to play RIO starting on the middle finger, I get tripped up.

So I've spent the last few years (yes, years) trying to get back on track. And it's a lot of hard work.

I don't think I've seen this discussed much, but if you are just starting out on bass and there are any songs or exercises that you practice frequently, please take my advice and play everything one time through starting with the index finger, and then again plucking the first note with the middle finger.

I'm curious if anyone else has had to go through a similar process because they weren't disciplined when they were learning plucking hand technique?

I spent a lot of time when starting out 55 years ago working on this very issue. Yes it does take work and time. Pretty much I settled on three notes on each string going from one string to the next alternating fingers going up thee notes before changing strings then reversing it going back the way you came.this reverses the order of the finger used to go to the next string.

 

[basslayer]

I used to alternate a lot, but then I got into James Jamerson's hook and I spent four years playing everything (and I do mean everything; I relearned my Metallica song catalog that way) in 1st position with only my index finger. Now I play with whatever's clever in the moment. If it's a Motown thing, I do the Jamerson hook. I mostly (probably 85% of my playing) hang in 1st position, but I pick with my index, middle, or thumb.

 

[mambo4]

I only think about strict alternation an getting even sound in the context of steady 8th or 16th notes.
For rhythmic variety and syncopation like in Rio, I would not focus on strict alteration and just do what nails the rhythm.
Though it would make a novel exercise.

 

[fishdreams]

I did need some assistance and picked up a few things from various teachers. The independence issue falls into a few things IME:

• A given note with Index wasn't sounding the same when played with Middle finger. This turned out a major reason why my phrasing often sounded sloppy. Practice is simple - to ensure that a given note played with I sounds exactly the same played with M: Play alternate patterns (opn strings work perfectly fine) , SLOW, in TIME and LISTEN (this sounds easy but may be -psychologically - much harder than it sounds. However - you want to sound good and it is so rewarding to actually hear oneself start sounding better) . Doing this cleaned up my phrasing and general musicality in my playing tremendously
• I sounded sloppy going form string to string. There's a basic choice to make and to practice when jumping from string to string.
  • Approach A: stick to IMIM/MIMI no matter if you move up a string (say E to A) or down a string (Say A to E).
  • Approach B: when going up (E to A) stick with IMIM/MiMI; when going down (A to E) , II/MM (basically, roll off the plucking finger to the string below, pluck with that finger and reverse course)
  • Either approach can be practiced (again, in time and slowly, and listen - don't be afraid to use a metronome ).
    • Exercises are of the type where for example your picking hand plays (open string work for that matter) an eighth-note pattern, or triplet per bar, and jump strings in 2 note, 3 note , 1 note groupings following either Approach A or B.)
    • Work this also with a few favored riffs or scales etc. Just stick for practice purposes with the favored approach, whatever you practice
    • After a few weeks i got the hang of it and never looked back (I took approach B which i prefer - however, one of my teachers is a technical monster way beyond me, and uses approach A - so either works.- they just need practice). Once I started to make actual music the automatisms kicked in and I followed the favored and practiced approach without thinking (most of the time and that is perfectly fine.)
• as to independence: I am not so busy anymore with which finger I start with - however addressing the above points helped to clean up my playing by a landslide.

Hope this helps and good luck!

 

[SoonerBill]

Gonna be honest here—I’ve never once thought about this.

Me too. I don't think at all about which fingers pick or fret notes. My fingers "seem to know" what to do.

 

[bassdude51]

I used to alternate a lot, but then I got into James Jamerson's hook and I spent four years playing everything (and I do mean everything; I relearned my Metallica song catalog that way) in 1st position with only my index finger. Now I play with whatever's clever in the moment. If it's a Motown thing, I do the Jamerson hook. I mostly (probably 85% of my playing) hang in 1st position, but I pick with my index, middle, or thumb.

Awesome post!!!!!!!! Thank-you!

Probably 95% of the time Mr. Index Finger does my string plucking. Jamerson and Jerry Scheff method.

What you said speaks for me too!

 

[basslayer]

Awesome post!!!!!!!! Thank-you!

Probably 95% of the time Mr. Index Finger does my string plucking. Jamerson and Jerry Scheff method.

What you said speaks for me too!

Awesome. Between Jerry and James, my approach is a blend; I use more floating thumb like Jamerson, but the force and touch is more Scheff-like. I always go for open string notes, if available. How about you? Does your playing favor either?

 

[SuperTheBass]

I'll be honest, I don't think I could tell you which finger I'm plucking with at any given time.

 

[bigdaddybass12]

I have a confession, we all have things we may not want everyone to know. Here it goes, I used to play banjo. It taught me to use different fingers. BUT I don’t play with my thumb. Plus. I had injured my 1st finger and I had use other fingers for a week.
I finally came to my senses and started playing bass.

 

[MCS4]

I agree with the general consensus that "strictly alternating" is not required, but if you feel that you have difficulty leading with one finger when it seems beneficial to do so then I do think it makes good sense to practice it. If I were you I would just devote some of your practice time to starting all parts with your middle finger to get yourself more comfortable with. You might even find it helpful to spend some time doing Jamerson-style one-finger playing but with your middle finger instead of your index. As someone who naturally gravitates toward starting with my middle finger this hasn't been an issue for me, but I have used some practice techniques like this when trying to incorporate some three-finger playing and trying to get accustomed to using my ring finger more.

 

[bassdude51]

Awesome. Between Jerry and James, my approach is a blend; I use more floating thumb like Jamerson, but the force and touch is more Scheff-like. I always go for open string notes, if available. How about you? Does your playing favor either?

Well, I'm a modest bass player. I rest my thumb on the E string until I note onto the E and then I float my thumb. It goes back onto the E for A, D, G noting.
I go open strings as much as I can. Keeps me up on those so called, "money making frets"......ha ha ha! Most of my bassing is automatic and I don't really think too much about what I'm doing with my fingers. Switched to single index about 20 years ago. Used to use index + middle.

Wonderful to meet ya, basslayer