Pondering Some New Ideas, Need Some Input

[agedhorse]

I'd love to see a new 400 but IMO the simpler the better. 400 along with BB750 revamp would be excellent.

The BB-750 was not anywhere near as popular as any of the current Subway models. I could see the carbines before looking at the BB (or Titan)

 

[MCF]

I suspect many of us 400/+ lovers probably aren’t/weren’t using it in quite the fashion that Randy designed it for (which I would guess was fat, clean, clear). I used mine with a Bergantino NV610 (basically his upgraded take on the sealed Ampeg 810 design) about 90% of the time and that combination with the EQ shift switches on definitely made for a very mid-forward tone, but in the best way possible to my ears. I also occasionally used it with a Mesa RR215 and it also killed (unfortunately that wasn’t my cab). The TT on the other hand was much smoother and mildly scooped to my ears through the same cab at pretty much all settings. I suspect a combo of the passive EQ of the 400 with a few bands of semi-parametric EQ like the WD800 could achieve some of what was missing to my ears in the TT. Then again I also accept that what I liked was maybe not the “norm” from those amps!

I love my Subway 410. But the Berg NV610 coupled with my SVT VR is the best sounding cab I have ever heard. Jim himself has said if he were to bring it back, the cost would be in the $2500+ area. Pretty crazy if you ask me.

 

[MCF]

The BB-750 was not anywhere near as popular as any of the current Subway models. I could see the carbines before looking at the BB (or Titan)

Please Andy. Do the Carbines.

 

[U4EA]

Good point, I have ALWAYS favored 1/4" jacks for aux in and headphone out because there is no practical way to ruggedize 1/8" jacks/plugs in a way that they will last 20+ years on the road. For a product with a 3 year shelf life it's probably not a big deal but... we offer a 5 year warranty and expect to see these amps out there for 20-30+ years. It's a lot cheaper to replace an adapter than the jack on the amp.



I have certainly looked at this several times, but until we have a better picture of what the longer term outlook for power tubes (specifically 6550's) is, I'm reluctant to stick my neck out very far, and those above me respect my concern. Doesn't mean that it won't happen though, it all depends.

It could even be a revamp of the Prodigy but with better voicing options, less RnD. If tube failure occurs, make it contained and less catasrophic. Easier said than done I know but i'm rooting for you.

 

[MCF]

It could even be a revamp of the Prodigy but with better voicing options, less RnD. If tube failure occurs, make it contained and less catasrophic. Easier said than done I know but i'm rooting for you.

I have only played a Prodigy once. At the old Mesa Hollywood store. I really liked it. It was way too expensive. And with the emphasis changing to the Class D Subway line, it just didn’t seem practical to me at the time. They come up now and again at used gear sellers. To me, it’s not worth it given what the Subways do. If it’s voicing options you want, root for an M6 Carbine inspired to get done. Five setvoicings. Two scooped, one neutral, two mid focused. It’s all most any player needs. Elegant and easy to use.

 

[sunbeast]

I have only played a Prodigy once. At the old Mesa Hollywood store. I really liked it. It was way too expensive. And with the emphasis changing to the Class D Subway line, it just didn’t seem practical to me at the time. They come up now and again at used gear sellers. To me, it’s not worth it given what the Subways do. If it’s voicing options you want, root for an M6 Carbine inspired to get done. Five setvoicings. Two scooped, one neutral, two mid focused. It’s all most any player needs. Elegant and easy to use.

I had an early Carbine and my 400+ at the same time and played the Carbine pre into the 400+ power amp a bunch before selling the 400+, which was a magical combo. The Prodigy I have almost does that thing (probably the Strategy does it better!). The Prodigy is a killer amp!

 

[sunbeast]

I love my Subway 410. But the Berg NV610 coupled with my SVT VR is the best sounding cab I have ever heard. Jim himself has said if he were to bring it back, the cost would be in the $2500+ area. Pretty crazy if you ask me.

Yep- my NV610 has been sitting in storage for a few years at this point, but I don't plan to sell it ever! Its been the longest consistent part of my gear collection by far at this point

 

[U4EA]

I have only played a Prodigy once. At the old Mesa Hollywood store. I really liked it. It was way too expensive. And with the emphasis changing to the Class D Subway line, it just didn’t seem practical to me at the time. They come up now and again at used gear sellers. To me, it’s not worth it given what the Subways do. If it’s voicing options you want, root for an M6 Carbine inspired to get done. Five setvoicings. Two scooped, one neutral, two mid focused. It’s all most any player needs. Elegant and easy to use.

M6 Carbine would be a good option so long as it's voicing versatile. I remember the Prodigy had a couple voicings I liked and the rest I couldn't tweak enough for my liking. I still think Mesa can do a nice tube head that can go down in history as "The Mesa Tube Head".

 

[agedhorse]

I have only played a Prodigy once. At the old Mesa Hollywood store. I really liked it. It was way too expensive. And with the emphasis changing to the Class D Subway line, it just didn’t seem practical to me at the time. They come up now and again at used gear sellers. To me, it’s not worth it given what the Subways do. If it’s voicing options you want, root for an M6 Carbine inspired to get done. Five setvoicings. Two scooped, one neutral, two mid focused. It’s all most any player needs. Elegant and easy to use.

The Prodigy today would be roughly 30-40% more expensive so if you thought it was expensive before…

 

[sunbeast]

This is a great post. So You like the ME Super 400? I’ve waffled back and forth on getting the ME Super 800 to add that other prominent California based amp maker’s (GK) tone. I’m looking into actually finding a way to use two preamps and the effects return of the Subway channel (any switch maybe will work?) to get even more versatility from the TT.

I forgot to reply to this- the Super 400 is the only pedal I've found that does do that unique EQ curve from my 400+ (specifically with those "shift" controls engaged), so I am fond of it for sure. It can be pretty tweaky though (as the 400+ could be!), lacks much clean headroom, and certainly not the best representation of the glorious 400+ preamp grind/growl (the drive it has does actually sound decent, but the 400+ drive is a tall order!). Set mostly clean or combined with a seperate drive I do really dig it.

 

[Ethix4]

I am still intrigued by SMPS driven tube output stage. Although I guess one might say the market has spoken, given the failure of Peavey and others with this concept.

Still a 20 lb head with 4 x KT88 on the output section seems like something a lot of people might want to buy, provided it comes in around max $1200.


It may be unobtainable?

did the peavey amps ones have issues or just didn’t have enough demand/market?

 

[MCF]

The Prodigy today would be roughly 30-40% more expensive so if you thought it was expensive before…

Is that all? I look at the SVT Heritage and see it’s now at least $2799. It was $2199 as recently as 2021. The Traynor YBA 300 lists at $3099, although you can get them from a couple dealers for $2219.

 

[Ethix4]

The Prodigy today would be roughly 30-40% more expensive so if you thought it was expensive before…

As much as I am against the majority of class D amps, I’m all for a small lightweight tube head like that certain 50 w competition. Most of my amps ARE graphic EQ and a/b heads , hybrids or tube.
Weight keeps me from taking the tube heads out mostly.
I find a graphic very useful and a little easier to cut unwanted frequencies than a parametric, but I think the walkabout and mpulse 600 amp had such a useful parametric it might as well have been a graphic .
I think most people would deal with the cost if it meant a tube driven DI, lighter weight with almost the same features. I know I would .
I know this is unrelated to the question but the buster head, walkabout and mpulse 600 are my favorites and I’d drool over anything that combined those even just a little.
Maybe a revamped buster is more doable than a prodigy or 400+ remake?
As echoed on here , sorry if not much input , but very much appreciate your input and thought into what most bassists want, and all your wisdom that’s right here for us to use.

 

[ardgedee]

App based features are problematic to support on products with a 30+ year expected lifespan. Nobody’s crystal ball is good enough to predict compatibility for even 5-10 years at this point.

As a reminder to people who might not register the significance of that: thirty years ago people were using MS-DOS and Windows 3.1, or Macintosh System 7.3. USB didn't exist yet. The commercial World Wide Web didn't officially exist yet, and people who had net access usually needed to use system extensions of various kinds to deal with their telephone modems. Landlines were more common than mobile phones, people kept answering machines and there were late night infomercials selling funny outgoing answering machine messages. The major mobile phone manufacturers were Motorola, Nokia and Ericsson, mobile phones were the size of your fist and had antennas and flip out mouthpieces, GSM was new (the others being TDMA and AMPS) and would eventually be a means for providing WAP, a very primitive proto-web browser.

How many brand-new products available now support anything mentioned?

 

[agedhorse]

As much as I am against the majority of class D amps, I’m all for a small lightweight tube head like that certain 50 w competition. Most of my amps ARE graphic EQ and a/b heads , hybrids or tube.
Weight keeps me from taking the tube heads out mostly.
I find a graphic very useful and a little easier to cut unwanted frequencies than a parametric, but I think the walkabout and mpulse 600 amp had such a useful parametric it might as well have been a graphic .
I think most people would deal with the cost if it meant a tube driven DI, lighter weight with almost the same features. I know I would .
I know this is unrelated to the question but the buster head, walkabout and mpulse 600 are my favorites and I’d drool over anything that combined those even just a little.
Maybe a revamped buster is more doable than a prodigy or 400+ remake?
As echoed on here , sorry if not much input , but very much appreciate your input and thought into what most bassists want, and all your wisdom that’s right here for us to use.

The WD-800 has already stepped into where the Walkabout and MP-600 were.

 

[gtirard]

Cool
This is the third time I got to see an amp being developed by @agedhorse in conjunction with the communities input!

Good times

What were the 2 previous? it must be exciting to see the final result

 

[spankdaplank]

Here's my 2 cents worth of some odd things.

So, based on different amps over the years, for eq I really found the semi parametric eq on the Carvin BX500 to be very useful. The eq layout is shelving bass and treble and two bands of semi parametric, low mid 50 to 500 hz. and a high mid 200 to 2000 hz. cut and boost plus and minus 12db. A little fiddley to dial in but works pretty good when not over used. I've never had a Mesa Walkabout but I am interested to hear what its 3 band semi parametric does.

The other amp that Had an interesting front end was an all tube Peavy VTA-400, a rare beast. All tube, it had a 4x 6550 power section. Cool. There were two separate preamp channels with very different eq circuits. the fun part was that there were separate channel outputs with 1/4 inch isolating jacks on the front panel so that either channel could be easily patched into the input of the other channel. I have a feeling this is used on a lot of guitar amps but this is the only bass amp I've seen wth it. This allowed for crazy overdrive results. Master volume too. Here is the schematic. It's a fun one.

 

[DJ Bebop]

What were the 2 previous? it must be exciting to see the final result

WD, maybe the TT, and the D350

 

[gtirard]

Inspired from what Ampeg does with the SVT/B15 voicing option in the Venture amps, or the voicing option of the Quilter V803

EDIT: Please pardon the super dirty mockup

 

[Ethix4]

View attachment 5414601

Inspired from what Ampeg does with the SVT/B15 voicing option in the Venture amps, or the voicing option of the Quilter V803

EDIT: Please pardon the super dirty mockup

I see you planned this already before! Looks very nice .