Preamp Question

[Geddyfleaharris]

First yes I have used the search button and done a fair amount of reading on preamps. Second, my rig is a GK 1001RB-II into a 410RBH cab and a 115RBH cab. Our band plays heavy/hard rock. I use a Boss ODB overdrive pedal and a Digitech BP200 pedal. The BP200 is close to being disconnected because of boredom and a lot of other reasons that have been mentioned on this forum in other threrads.

Here is my dilemma. I have serious GAS and the next piece of equipment I am eyeing is a Sansamp rack mounted preamp. Through my searching and reading I have not been able to come to a conclusion on whether I need this component, what it will do for my rig and what the basic purpose of a preamp is. The techie I am talking to says a preamp will make an average head sound good and a high end head sound like it is on steroids (lol). He also says it will give my rig a lot more flexibility. I am more used to just plug and play so adding separate components is something foreign to me.

My original impression of preamps was that they were something needed by tube amps. I believe that I am all wrong on this though. My other thought is that my GK has an internal preamp so am I being redundant by adding this component?

Sorry for being so long winded but I believe background info is important. Any info/opinions/conclusions you guys have will be most appreciated.

 

[MuzikMan]

This question should be moved to "amps" but I'll get the ball rolling here. A preamp is a signal boosting device that takes your instrument level signal and brings it to a level that is suitable for a power amp. Most preamps also have EQ cababilities to help you shape your sound. A head contains a preamp and a power amp built in. These two components can be tapped with an effects loop.

You definately don't "need" a preamp with a head but that doesn't stop us from GAS . You need a preamp if you use a component rig that has a power amp. I wouldn't agree with your friend that a preamp makes all amps sound better. It is possible to move backward.

 

[Geddyfleaharris]

In regards to the forum, it seemed like in my searches preamps showed up in both if not in effects a little more. So it was a toss up (to me anyways) as to where to put it.
Also techie = salesman not friend.

 

[jady]

I had a Sansamp RBI, I ran it directly into a power amp. You could always put it directly into the effects return jack of your GK but I wouldnt run both preamps.

 

[bongomania]

A preamp is a signal boosting device that takes your instrument level signal and brings it to a level that is suitable for a power amp. Most preamps also have EQ cababilities to help you shape your sound.

This is exactly correct; however note that many, many pedal manufacturers make boost, overdrive, and EQ pedals and call them "preamps", even though they are sometimes (often) not able to drive a power amp. This is probably why searching on "preamp" got so many hits in the FX forum; although the Sansamp ("SABDDI") pedals, which are able to drive some amps, serve many purposes and get talked about all day here.

 

[Infernal Affair]

You wouldn't need the rackmount version of the Sansamp to accomplish what you want to. You'd be fine with the pedal (Bass Driver DI). That is, if you really want the sound. It's basically a tube emulator, and is capable of various overdrive tones and amp sounds. You can also get a lot of other interesting tones out of it. A lot of people swear by them. I use the rackmount version plugged intoa poweramp, but I'm switching over to the programmable pedal since it's more versatile for my needs.

 

[MuzikMan]

In regards to the forum, it seemed like in my searches preamps showed up in both if not in effects a little more. So it was a toss up (to me anyways) as to where to put it.
Also techie = salesman not friend.

Oops! Sorry about that. None of my friends are salesmen either.

 

[nad]

The techie I am talking to says a preamp will make an average head sound good and a high end head sound like it is on steroids (lol).

I don't buy that advice. Sounds like those that say a BBE Sonic Maximizer will make ANY head sound better.

Your amp already has a preamp, the only thing you'd want a separate one for is if you want a change in tonal characteristics.

 

[Geddyfleaharris]

Thanks guys! Pretty sure I am going to give one of these puppies a whirl. There was a thread in the Amps section yesterday. One fellow did a nice comparison of the Sansamp RBI and RPM. He owned both. So I think I am pointed in the right direction.

Jady - from talking to the store techie that is exactly how we figured I should hook it up to my GK.

Nad - sort of what I thought about a second preamp being redundant but if a preamp gives me more tonal varieties than what the heck....experimentation is fun. Probably worse things to waste my money on.....like a neck sock or something lol.

 

[idoru]

At least try it out - I like Tech 21 gear so much it has become the basis of my sound. The prevailing opinion here is also positive, I ran a poll in my "Tech 21 Appreciation Thread"

My favourite post in that was from the guy that spoke to an Ampeg endorser after a show, he discovered that the endorser's amp had blown mid-tour, and actually had a SansAmp hidden in the remains!

 

[Matt Fat Cat]

First yes I have used the search button and done a fair amount of reading on preamps. Second, my rig is a GK 1001RB-II into a 410RBH cab and a 115RBH cab. Our band plays heavy/hard rock. I use a Boss ODB overdrive pedal and a Digitech BP200 pedal. The BP200 is close to being disconnected because of boredom and a lot of other reasons that have been mentioned on this forum in other threrads.

Here is my dilemma. I have serious GAS and the next piece of equipment I am eyeing is a Sansamp rack mounted preamp. Through my searching and reading I have not been able to come to a conclusion on whether I need this component, what it will do for my rig and what the basic purpose of a preamp is. The techie I am talking to says a preamp will make an average head sound good and a high end head sound like it is on steroids (lol). He also says it will give my rig a lot more flexibility. I am more used to just plug and play so adding separate components is something foreign to me.

My original impression of preamps was that they were something needed by tube amps. I believe that I am all wrong on this though. My other thought is that my GK has an internal preamp so am I being redundant by adding this component?

Sorry for being so long winded but I believe background info is important. Any info/opinions/conclusions you guys have will be most appreciated.

I've not played with the Sanaamp, so I couldnt comment on it. I can say this... I play thru a 300wt Ashdown that hands down smokes any amp I've played. I paid like $399 or something and it slays any Eden, Phil Jones, Ampeg, mesa I've played. When I buy a new head, it'll be a higher watt Ashdown.

As for GK, I dont care for aluminum cone drivers. Maybe others do, I dont. Instead of adding FX to a mediocre rig, why not save $$ and by a better bass rig, dig? My .02..

Check out my sloppy bass and guitar clips in my sig. The ashdown head is direct XLR to a mic pre, the sounds good... but took alot of clipping.

 

[Geddyfleaharris]

Matt Fat Cat - thanks for your 2 cents. As far as I know my GK RBH cabs do not have aluminum cone drivers (?) not sure where you got that impression from. And my 2 cents is that I hardly think my rig is "mediocre". All my gear is from GK's "Artist" series which is their high end stuff. Although I guess if a person does not like GK then all their gear would be considered mediocre. The purpose of adding a preamp is mainly for experimentation.

I like Ashdown's looks but I have never fired one of their heads up in a store. Because most of my rig is less than 2 months old I am afraid to try their stuff in case I get GAS for Ashdown lol

 

[bassman314]

First yes I have used the search button and done a fair amount of reading on preamps. Second, my rig is a GK 1001RB-II into a 410RBH cab and a 115RBH cab. Our band plays heavy/hard rock. I use a Boss ODB overdrive pedal and a Digitech BP200 pedal. The BP200 is close to being disconnected because of boredom and a lot of other reasons that have been mentioned on this forum in other threrads.

Here is my dilemma. I have serious GAS and the next piece of equipment I am eyeing is a Sansamp rack mounted preamp. Through my searching and reading I have not been able to come to a conclusion on whether I need this component, what it will do for my rig and what the basic purpose of a preamp is. The techie I am talking to says a preamp will make an average head sound good and a high end head sound like it is on steroids (lol). He also says it will give my rig a lot more flexibility. I am more used to just plug and play so adding separate components is something foreign to me.

My original impression of preamps was that they were something needed by tube amps. I believe that I am all wrong on this though. My other thought is that my GK has an internal preamp so am I being redundant by adding this component?

Sorry for being so long winded but I believe background info is important. Any info/opinions/conclusions you guys have will be most appreciated.

GAS for GAS's sake is always bad.. You end up spending money on stuff you may never use...

The question is why are you looking at a preamp? Are you dissatisfied with the sound? If that's the case, then a Pre-amp into return of your GK is a fairly ineffecient way to go. Sell th GK, and get either a new head, or the Tech21 and a decent Power Amp.

If you are just lookign for more choices in tone? try the BDDI, Paradriver or Programmable BDDI.

 

[Matt Fat Cat]

Geddy, i wasnt slamming your rig... i dont knoiw of any GK stuff that is "high end". the GK i've played at stores was all what Id call mediocre. heck man, my Ashdown is below mediocre. i paid $600 for a 1/2 stack, but it rocks man. I was simply suggesting to try an amp head with a pre-amp you like instead of chasing your "tone-tail" by adding rack fx and stuff like that.

As for aluminum cones.. I think Hartke and Gk use them. The speaker cones, behind the grill.. anyway. Buy the Sansamp and give up a review.

 

[JanusZarate]

Geddy, i wasnt slamming your rig... i dont knoiw of any GK stuff that is "high end". the GK i've played at stores was all what Id call mediocre. heck man, my Ashdown is below mediocre. i paid $600 for a 1/2 stack, but it rocks man. I was simply suggesting to try an amp head with a pre-amp you like instead of chasing your "tone-tail" by adding rack fx and stuff like that.

The 700RB-II, 1001RB-II, and 2001RB are GK's high-end amps. You'll rarely see the 2001RB in a store, though, as it's quite pricey, but worth every penny.

The problem with most Guitar Center stores is that they tend to only carry Backline and SBX cabinets. The SBX cabinets are excellent sealed cabinets, but they're not really the cream of GK's crop. The Backline cabinets aren't a very good example of the GK sound, IMO, as they're true "budget" cabs.

As for aluminum cones.. I think Hartke and Gk use them. The speaker cones, behind the grill.. anyway. Buy the Sansamp and give up a review.

It was only recently that GK created a few cabinets with aluminum cones. It's the Goldline (GLX) series. No other GK cabs use those cones. The Goldline cabinets are better than the Backline (the low-end GK cabinet), but IMO, they aren't as good as the Neo and RBH cabinets, which are the "high-end" ported cabinets they make.

 

[nad]

I've never owned anything GK but feel compelled to back them up.

They make great equipment, any "upgrade" from the RB series to me would be wandering into boutique territory.

 

[EricF]

Most of this was already touched on, but I'll throw it out there anyway...

If you are looking for a whole new sound out of your GK head, using a SansAmp as a preamp and running it directly into the power amp section (fx loop return) of the GK is certainly a viable option.

If you want to still use the preamp of the GK and have the SansAmp as a swithcable effect for a second sound option, that is certainly possible as well by running it before the GK preamp, or in the GK's fx loop.

The SansAmp products have a solid reputation for making good sounding products, but they certainly aren't the only option for preamps.

GAS is fun, isn't it?

 

[Geddyfleaharris]

EricF - GAS is great! LOL Sansamp just seems more readily available where I am than some of the other preamps. I am thinking of hooking it up both ways that you describe.

Just to clarify to everyone who might have the impression that I was unhappy with my rig - I love my sound, not at all unhappy with GK stuff. Just wanted to experiment a bit by adding a preamp.

MysticBoo - I agree with your comments. I personally love the GK stuff.