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Preference For Sealed Cabs? Why?

#101
I'd like to take a minute to clarify some things as it's been suggested that this thread could be a subtle attempt to market greenboy cabs.

I'm not currently taking orders for greenboy cabs. The past year has been very difficult (divorce, rebuilding, etc) and I got way behind on my orders. Since I don't want my customers to be stressed or unhappy, I have stopped taking orders altogether until I am fully caught up, and that's gonna be awhile yet. Once my orders are caught up I am seriously considering getting out of the game altogether, not that building gb cabs hasn't been a really fun way to lose money :)

The purpose of this discussion is that I enjoy great gear. I play over 200 shows a year, so it's much more fun if you love your tone! I am a musician first and would never try to sell anyone something I make if I honestly believed there was a better option for their situation.

I am thrilled that this thread has been civil and informative!
 
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#102
ronlitz said:
The best cab I ever played was an Ampeg 8x10, which is sealed. The bottom was tight and punchy, and with no high frequency drivers, the top end was smooth and clank-free. The design has a built-in EQ that rolls off the bottom and top, which IMO is exactly what a bass needs. I should mention that I was playing classic and hard rock on a P-bass using a pick. At 168 pounds, I got tired of the schlep and sold it.
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You've explained why my favorite cab bar none is the Bergantino NV610. I also love the NV412, but the tens seem a smidge brighter and have more of the retro SVT 8x10 vibe.

I love the NV610 even though I'm a fingerstyle player who uses it with detuned 5-string bass for modern/classic hard rock and metal. As you noted, the lack of tweeter makes overdrive/distortion sound so much smoother: I can get nice bright aggressive zing with minimal hiss/buzz. Regardless, I prefer it for clean or dirty tones, any string type, any technique (slap, pickstyle, fingerstyle), any musical genre.


Ukiah Bass said:
I'm not a technical expert on cab design. But I always wondered about the sealed cab thing and how much of chasing this particular sound is related to older bassists in particular whose "sound in the head" comes from the recorded and produced record sound of the 1960s and 1970s? Seems like a lot of "how do I get this tone" questions relate more to matters of tracking techniques, EQ, compression, mastering, and possibly end production format than they do to use of a particular cab technology in a live music setting.
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I'm an older bassist who loved the vintage SVT rig I once owned, but one of the biggest reasons I love my sealed 6x10 these days is because it works so beautifully live: specifically, the tight low end. Andy from Acme once asked here on TB, "why would anyone (especially five stringers) NOT want to hear those lowest frequencies from their instrument"? With proper respect I replied that those lowest freqs can cause problems at the gig. It's one thing if you're lucky enough to play in quality studios and concert halls, but I'm just a weekend warrior who mostly plays in bars. In 40 years I've never once have had a sound tech ask me for MORE low frequencies. I've had a couple of techs (very good ones, BTW) tell me to trim my onstage lows because they were covered by FOH: the point was so that I could have higher stage volume.

Even in a situation where my rig is filling the room, I prefer the definition of the sealed cab: the lowest lows can still muddy things up.

There are still people who believe that the lowest notes disappear if the fundamental is weak or nonexistent. Simply not true: I can hear low Bb just fine through my NV610. Now maybe I can't FEEL it as well as I would through a modern cab that goes down to 30Hz, but as explained, that's a "be careful what you ask for" situation.

Again, I am NOT dissing Acme and other cabs that go low. Many bassists love 'em and can make 'em work. I simply prefer the tone and feel of a good sealed cab, and at the gig it works as well or better than any of the ported cabs I've owned or tried.
 
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#105
Fuzzbass said:
You've explained why my favorite cab bar none is the Bergantino NV610. I also love the NV412, but the tens seem a smidge brighter and have more of the retro SVT 8x10 vibe.

I love the NV610 even though I'm a fingerstyle player who uses it with detuned 5-string bass for modern/classic hard rock and metal. As you noted, the lack of tweeter makes overdrive/distortion sound so much smoother: I can get nice bright aggressive zing with minimal hiss/buzz. Regardless, I prefer it for clean or dirty tones, any string type, any technique (slap, pickstyle, fingerstyle), any musical genre.




I'm an older bassist who loved the vintage SVT rig I once owned, but one of the biggest reasons I love my sealed 6x10 these days is because it works so beautifully live: specifically, the tight low end. Andy from Acme once asked here on TB, "why would anyone (especially five stringers) NOT want to hear those lowest frequencies from their instrument"? With proper respect I replied that those lowest freqs can cause problems at the gig. It's one thing if you're lucky enough to play in quality studios and concert halls, but I'm just a weekend warrior who mostly plays in bars. In 40 years I've never once have had a sound tech ask me for MORE low frequencies. I've had a couple of techs (very good ones, BTW) tell me to trim my onstage lows because they were covered by FOH: the point was so that I could have higher stage volume.

Even in a situation where my rig is filling the room, I prefer the definition of the sealed cab: the lowest lows can still muddy things up.

There are still people who believe that the lowest notes disappear if the fundamental is weak or nonexistent. Simply not true: I can hear low Bb just fine through my NV610. Now maybe I can't FEEL it as well as I would through a modern cab that goes down to 30Hz, but as explained, that's a "be careful what you ask for" situation.

Again, I am NOT dissing Acme and other cabs that go low. Many bassists love 'em and can make 'em work. I simply prefer the tone and feel of a good sealed cab, and at the gig it works as well or better than any of the ported cabs I've owned or tried.
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This, to me, is a beautiful thing. A musician who shares from his experiences and speaks to his own preferences without bad mouthing anyone else. Bravo, sir!
 
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#106
Low Class said:
I've been toying with the idea of building a couple of sealed 15 cabs the past few months. This thread may make it actually happen.
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You might want to look at the Kappalite 3015LF. I was always wondering why every (ported) cab that used this had poorly defined lows---kindof mushy to my taste. The I felt validated by the fact that Eminence changed what the T/S spec was. Initially I think they said around .33--pretty good for a ported enclosure. Then they changed the spec. It's now spec'd as .46. Terrible for a ported enclosure. But pretty good for a sealed box. Haven't tried it that way but it might be pretty cool. You'll need a mid driver and maybe a filter for a wanky region---but worth looking into.
 
#107
Mike Arnopol said:
You might want to look at the Kappalite 3015LF. I was always wondering why every (ported) cab that used this had poorly defined lows---kindof mushy to my taste. The I felt validated by the fact that Eminence changed what the T/S spec was. Initially I think they said around .33--pretty good for a ported enclosure. Then they changed the spec. It's now spec'd as .46. Terrible for a ported enclosure. But pretty good for a sealed box. Haven't tried it that way but it might be pretty cool. You'll need a mid driver and maybe a filter for a wanky region---but worth looking into.
Click to expand...

That's kind of odd. I have a 3015LF in a ported enclosure and the lows in my cab are anything but mushy or poorly defined. Then again, I'm using a ShuttleMax 9.2 with some variable high pass filtering, a VT Bass Deluxe pedal and a rackmounted compressor too. Still, even before using it with that gear I never thought of my lows that way. Not that you aren't hearing it that way, just that I'm hearing it differently.
 
#108
Mike Arnopol said:
You might want to look at the Kappalite 3015LF. I was always wondering why every (ported) cab that used this had poorly defined lows---kindof mushy to my taste. The I felt validated by the fact that Eminence changed what the T/S spec was. Initially I think they said around .33--pretty good for a ported enclosure. Then they changed the spec. It's now spec'd as .46. Terrible for a ported enclosure. But pretty good for a sealed box. Haven't tried it that way but it might be pretty cool. You'll need a mid driver and maybe a filter for a wanky region---but worth looking into.
Click to expand...

I considered those drivers in a sealed box, but it didn't model too great, not to mention you'd definitely need the right mid driver and your crossover design chops had better be good to deal with it. But people have pulled off much weirder ideas :)
 
#109
Mike Arnopol said:
No, I'm involved in cabinets based on science fiction snake oil technology
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here's an idea for you.... sealed cabs aye, but seal 'em full of hydrogen, or helium - the one that won't explode on you if it gets too hot... right lighter than air you see - just float them over the venue....
Mike Arnopol said:
You might want to look at the Kappalite 3015LF. I was always wondering why every (ported) cab that used this had poorly defined lows---kindof mushy to my taste. The I felt validated by the fact that Eminence changed what the T/S spec was. Initially I think they said around .33--pretty good for a ported enclosure. Then they changed the spec. It's now spec'd as .46. Terrible for a ported enclosure. But pretty good for a sealed box. Haven't tried it that way but it might be pretty cool. You'll need a mid driver and maybe a filter for a wanky region---but worth looking into.
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often used phrase in chicago or been hanging with a load of brits somewhere?
 
#113
so.... my question not concerning british swear words or favourite ales.....

If I wanted to build a ported bass reflex cab, I would maybe start reading a bit realise I didn't really know how to design cabs well and then find some great fearful plans (other direct radiating plans are available)

If I wanted to build a horn loaded cab I probably wouldn't even need to read anything to realise it was above my pay grade and just go buy some plans off bill fitzmaurice....

If I wanted to build my own sealed cab.... where would I start?
 
#116
I prefer sealed cabs, always have I suppose, even before I knew the difference. There is something about the note definition and not having that wall of woof in certain rooms. Funny thing is, I play in three bands, and all the guys hear the difference too. So if it makes me happy, and it makes them happy, then I'm sure the audiences are happy too.
 
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#117
AudioAsylum, DIYAudio, AudioKarma, and BassChat are other popular forums I visit not mentioned yet. I'm sure there are a plethora of forums for guys who discuss backline and PA stuff via Google searches. I don't have enough time left on this planet to search any out.

I think they just wind up being too darn heavy for most guys nowadays, they are typically larger, plus all the wood needed for the chambers. I have seen plans for 'fridges, and just about any other cab posted somewhere.
 
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#118
I've tried a good number of cabs in different live situations, and have come to the conclusion that sealed cabs sound more "controlled" with my technique. I've played through a handful of ported cabs that would display really unpleasing when I'd dig in hard at high volume, and I've yet to experience that from an Ampeg 810 or my Berg NV610. It could well just be issues with the design of the ported cabs I've tried- I've yet to play a gig through any of the "new breed" of boutique 2/3-way cabs, most of my experience has been of the mass-produced variety...
 
#119
sunbeast said:
I've tried a good number of cabs in different live situations, and have come to the conclusion that sealed cabs sound more "controlled" with my technique. I've played through a handful of ported cabs that would display really unpleasing when I'd dig in hard at high volume, and I've yet to experience that from an Ampeg 810 or my Berg NV610. It could well just be issues with the design of the ported cabs I've tried- I've yet to play a gig through any of the "new breed" of boutique 2/3-way cabs, most of my experience has been of the mass-produced variety...
Click to expand...

There are some really great new (ish) designers out there these days for 2/3 way design. That still doesn't mean those designs will float your boat :)
 

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