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Problem with drummer

#21
find another band to play with, I'm in the same boat, a awful drummer (she makes that chick from white stripes look like near peart) married to my guitard player. He insists shes the best drummer hes ever played with :hmm: and wont be in a band where shes not playing drums. Neither one of them are trying to do anything to help the band out as a whole and only wants to play out once a month. I'm done with this crap I'm just sticking around since we somehow got on two decent bills. Its just a shame really all the bands around here that are looking for bass players are total D-bags :spit:
 
#22
I've been very fortunate throughout my bass playing career when it comes to drummers. Most drummers that I've played with were, most of the time, the oldest person in the band. They had the most experience and IMHO were the best musician in the band. It all starts with the drummer as in live performance, recording, songwriting. The drummer is the conductor, he has to be a leader to some extent. Good drummers know there place in a band situation. I'm blessed that the drummer I play with today is the same drummer I've played with for the last 24 years and we are as tight as a knat's ass. I do play with other bands every once in a while and though those drummers may not be as talented as the drummer in my main band, at least they instill professionalism throughout rehearsal all the way to the gig; including recording and songwriting. It's a tall order for a drummer whose only in his first band to understand what your trying to get across to him. Usually, it's their EGO and I'm spelling it out in capital letters, that gets in their way. Humility is something that comes to us who have confidence in our abilities to perform; overtime it will grow. Good Luck;)
 
#26
Peaved said:
Click to expand...

You can get the same tactile effect with your fist! And it is often more satisfying.

I HATE drummers with poor time - when I played drums I got so that I could program a drum machine with one bar of time, 15 of silence and nail the "1" of the first bar every time. Took a LOT of work but after doing that for a couple of years my time shifted only when I wanted it to do so.

If the drummer is "responsible for keeping time" why don't they work at it? (Yeah, I know it is the band that is responsible, but....)

Dan K.
 
#28
I thought you said he was "your drummer??" Anyone that untalented and unmusically savvy can not really claim to be a 'drummer' per se.. more like wishful thinking or delusional at worst. As some of the others have already pointed out: start shopping for an actual, experienced drummer. Sorry for your situation.
 
#30
BillyRay said:
He is a strange beast. As I said, his playing during shows is impeccable (most of the time): he'll concentrate on giving his best and since we play small venues, his volume level is usually okay since his kit isn't big (and we don't mic him obviously) but we get the added benefit of being able to crank it more. He also doesn't do goofy stuff like ask 5 times in a row where to come in: he'll roll with the punches and play less fancy because he know he'll look stupid if he messes up in front of the crowd.

And when I say he has good coordination and talent, it's because he has, the same way you see someone sucking immensely on guitar, but you hear/feel that this guy will get somewhere someday if he puts the work into it and gets serious. With other people, you don't see that and know they'll keep on sucking for the rest of their life.

I'd say it comes down more to work ethic and, has was pointed out earlier, musical maturity. This guy thinks Travis Barker is great. While not being bad, Travis isn't the most tasteful/solid guy in the world. He won't listen to much different music, while I spent my adolescence transcribing jazz horn solos... So we come from different background...

I think a band talk is really in order since we have a couple of important shows coming in and musical progress of the band might dictate my decision to stay or quit. It's just that this guy and the guitarist come as a package and I have a very good musical relationship with him.
Click to expand...

I think if you can record and the listen to it at the Band Meeting (see hockey_head's post :D...), you may have a chance. I hear where you're comming from!

Good Luck! Russ
 
#31
I guess I got lucky with my drummer. Me and him click very well and no matter what he's always got the time. I guess being in a drum & bugle corps made him realize his real job as the drummer. To keep me on time :) . Good luck with your drummer the one's that think everyone is listening to only them really irks me. Because they are almost always the loudest.
 
#32
I've mostly played with mediocre drummers. Only once have I played with someone really exceptional.

it's depressing.

but there are rarely perfect situations...

so you either fire him or put up with it. No other choice. You're not going to magically make him different or better.
 
#33
Hmm,

I have to wonder why you joined this band in the first place? As a Bassist when I approach a potential project/band to be a part of they may think they are audtioning me But I'M AUDITIONING THEM. The first thing I look for after the talent of the vocalist & Guitarist is the drummer. He has to be good and Exp'd or it's a waste of time for me. I really watch and listen to him as I play, paying attention to intos, dynamics, timing, ect ect. I'm 46 years old, I don't have time to teach a drummer the things only Exp will teach him. If he gets fired for this he will learn about dynamics even if he won't admit it. I would look for another band if I were You AFTER You record a practice and see his reaction to his playing. If he gets it, then help him out and continue on. If he sees nothing wrong with his playing then move on.

Barry:bassist:
 
#35
Hmm,

I have to wonder why you joined this band in the first place? As a Bassist when I approach a potential project/band to be a part of they may think they are audtioning me But I'M AUDITIONING THEM. The first thing I look for after the talent of the vocalist & Guitarist is the drummer. He has to be good and Exp'd or it's a waste of time for me. I really watch and listen to him as I play, paying attention to intos, dynamics, timing, ect ect. I'm 46 years old, I don't have time to teach a drummer the things only Exp will teach him. If he gets fired for this he will learn about dynamics even if he won't admit it. I would look for another band if I were You AFTER You record a practice and see his reaction to his playing. If he gets it, then help him out and continue on. If he sees nothing wrong with his playing then move on.

Barry
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I'm looking for another band. I joined because I had a prolonged bass break: had not picked up my axe for God knows how many months and I joined for fun. I wasn't going to go to serious auditions sucking like I did.
 
#37
If he's not seriously interested in improving then you may be stuck with him.

It's sad, and unless you have a killer rhythm and dynamic sense between the rest of the band that HE can follow, I would seriously begin looking elsewhere...

IMHO, the drummer and the front man/vocalist generally MAKE the band...a new audience primarily notices the presence of the front man, and the dynamics (which is 75% the drummer), all else is secondary. Even if other brilliance is happening , a new audience isn't likely to wade through a poor front man and bad time/ dynamics to hear it.

A good drummer makes everybody else sound better. That's why they are so hard to find -they already have a gig.
 
#38
I successfully helped to turn a not so hot drummer into a good drummer. He was a guy we called back after not playing with him for years, simply because he was the niceset guy we've ever played with. No drama, loved our band.

We told him straight up through that he needed a new kit and we told him exactly the things he needed to work on. We weren't jerks about it just straight. You need to do some self education about timing and drums, so that you can communicate to him what he needs work with.

Our guy needed work on:

1. defining the back beat so there is a deep groove.
2. Not overplaying. (He loved rush but the only thing that sunk in were the constant wild fills, not the great timekeeping and backbeat)

3. Learning to keep the count in his head so he didn't have to incessantly hit his hi hat. (this was our biggest gripe, every song we played with him he was like hamster on a treadmill. you couldn't listen play without hearing a constant .......tick,tick,tick,tick,tick,tick...................So, much so that someone hitting a hi hat more than a few times enrages my guitarist....lol.

4. He needed to learn to play his kick right. We play simple 4/4 rock but he had this weird skippy kick going on. It wasn't a double hit or a double bass, it was this weird skip that was never on the beat.

We got him past all that by just being very straight and pointing all that. We bought him videos and we even gave him CD's of bands with drummers we like and pointed out why we like them. We also made it a point to tell him that no matter how good of songs a band writes if the drummer ain't laying the foundation right it still sounds like poop. I think that last bit really got him. He didn't want to be the guy that ruins the bands sound.

And like other have said, record and playback right after at practice. If he can't tell he's screwing up then, he's just oblivious or in denial. That was the first thing we did when we started with this guy again, so we could get rid of the skippy kick and incessant hi hat. When we played it back and pointed it out he had a hurt look on his face, but before the next practice he worked on his chops at home and was quickly becoming a new drummer.

Moral of the story.... If the you like the guy as a friend and he's not hardheaded try and learn with him. I've gone through lots or really fricken awesome drummers that were just total jerks. I've found it much better for my sanity to play with a drummer that's got it together upstairs and then help him with his chops.

The main reason we called this guy back is because:

He is literally the nicest coolest guy I've met.
No drama ever. I don't hear about his girlfriend problems. He's not drunk or a addicted to anything.
He holds down a job and is responsible.
He shows up to practice......on time even.
When he doesn't show up he calls.
He'll play any gig. He doesn't demand a certain amount of money or situation.
Basically he's a reasonable adult, which seems to be hard to find in guys who play in rock bands.

Basically you have to decide if the guy is worth helping or not.
 
#39
There are two approaches that I would take:

1) Make sure you take time to write and jam individually, and as duos, while everyone listens. I'm in a 5-piece band, and we do this all the time while we're writing, just to make sure everyone's on the same page. Guitarist & Guitarist, Guitarist & Bassist, Bassist & Drummer, Guitarist & Drummer, hell, even Vocals & Guitarist or Vocals & Drummer. It's just as important for playing as it is for listening, so when you're not playing, you need to be listening.

Playing fast, aggressive metal like we do, this is one way we make sure we're all inline with what's happening in the song and it MAKES us keep things tight and together. Anyone or anything that's off time, out of tune, in the wrong key, whatever... it'll all come out.

2) Coax him into taking lessons from a solid, in-the-pocket drummer who has a history of playing stuff in your style. It's harder to do than it sounds, especially if he's one of those "legend in his own mind" types, so one way that works is to get everyone else in the band to start taking lessons as well. If nothing else, the guys who do get the benefit of education, and you continue to grow individually.

Good luck!
 
#40
4. He needed to learn to play his kick right. We play simple 4/4 rock but he had this weird skippy kick going on. It wasn't a double hit or a double bass, it was this weird skip that was never on the beat.
Click to expand...

This is another thing I've heard many drummers do nowdays (rythmn guitarist also plays drums and he does it), even in straight 4/4 rock or punk. When I started gigging heavily around 2000, it wasn't as prevalent as it is nowadays. Why ? It seems only the amateurs do it...

I also got an e-mail yesterday for a band that I sent my "resume" to. They are supposed to call me today or tomorrow for audtions. We'll see, but I thought it was a cover band before the guy responded to my mail (due to talk of gigging restaurants, bars, festivals, etc. and asking for a straight blues bassist) but it's actually originals and he cites Jeff Healey, Hendrix, Clapton and SRV as influences. Methinks there'll be some guitard "drama" ;) but only time will tell.
 

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