Question to (mostly Pro's): losing dexterity playing LIVE! :(

[LarryR]

To All,
Forgive the "pro's" mention. Reason being, I've played professionally since the early 80's - which means I get paid to play, fly to gigs, played on several continents etc..

I play all styles. Fender 4 banger all my life. Here's my problem:

First, some of my gigs call for fast finger playing; fast runs etc..
At home, ain't never a problem. I can fly like a bird.

I get on the stage, and my finger dexterity (right plucking hand, NOT fret fingering hand) goes to sh_t! the Fluidity is gone!!! It forces me to make adjustments I don't want to make, that certainly don't serve the music, nor my ability to communicate the part/s I'm playing.

Anyone have this problem? Any suggestions? I should be talking to Stanley Clarke about it. This all said, I don't usually warm up backstage prior to hitting the stage. THIS alone could be the problem, and maybe I've answered my own question. STILL, I'm open to all comments. Thanks all!

 

[Helix]

This all said, I don't usually warm up backstage prior to hitting the stage. THIS alone could be the problem

I play for 10, rest for 10, and play for 10, and then I’m ready to go……never had to when I was younger though.

 

[Hahaha]

I've had the same experience many times. I'm really not sure what the cause is, but my own analysis leads me to wonder if it could be attributed to a combination of things. One factor is that when you're playing by yourself at home you can hear all the frequencies clearly. On stage you are blended into a mix of other instruments that occupy some of those same frequencies which could affect you right hand articulation; you work harder to bring those frequencies out.

Another factor for me is the intimidation I sometimes feel when my bass is blasting through a large sound system. I tend to pull back a bit. This alters how I pluck the strings.

I suppose there could be some psychological factors, but I'm not sure what they would be. I'm really not sure that the things I've mentioned are valid reasons. It's just an odd thing that happens.

 

[Ed Fuqua]

It sounded great in rehearsal.

All I can say is that in my experience, anything that I couldn't do in performance, I couldn't REALLY do in rehearsal. It's that old "don't practice till you get it right, practice till you get it right EVERY TIME."

 

[LarryR]

It sounded great in rehearsal.

All I can say is that in my experience, anything that I couldn't do in performance, I couldn't REALLY do in rehearsal. It's that old "don't practice till you get it right, practice till you get it right EVERY TIME."

I appreciate the response Ed as I respect you very much. That's NOT it man. There's NO lack of expertise in my playing these same parts/lines/songs.
NOTHING to do with practice. Trust me.

I'll open up about the particular gig. David Bowie Tribute band. The slower stuff is always easy. It's a tune like "Hang On To Yourself" from Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders days. Quick tempo tune. I can play note-for-note at home ad nauseum!!! As I said in my original post. The fingers don't move the same LIVE. I tighten up. I think it's a mental turned to physical wall I'm hittin'. Such a drag!!!

 

[Ricky Caboverde]

As a classical guitarist, stretching before playing is a big thing that I've learned from my studies. I try to remember that before playing a large set or a set that includes a particularly "hairy" song. Try to do some light hand stretches and some rudimentary right hand exercises for a few minutes before playing....also, drink water--if I'm dehydrated, I feel like crap and play like it too.

After reading your last post, it definitely seems like a mental thing. You're psyching yourself out. The faster you play something, you should think of RELAXING even more.

 

[landwomble]

It's probably nerves cramping up your right hand, or at least that's what happens to me sometimes until I consciously relax my arm...

 

[LarryR]

To all, so far my valid take aways: warm up, stretch, hydrate, RELAX (nerves).
A shot o'scotch or a Xanax wouldn't be a bad idea. This band doesn't touch 'the green' and in fact is discouraged, so that's out. A guitarist friend said, "if you practice at home, sitting comfortably in your chair, stop! Stand up like it's on the gig". His advice doesn't apply. Standing at home I can "fly" just fine. Keep the comments coming if you're interested...

 

[Ed Fuqua]

OK then.

 

[LarryR]

I've had the same experience many times. I'm really not sure what the cause is, but my own analysis leads me to wonder if it could be attributed to a combination of things. One factor is that when you're playing by yourself at home you can hear all the frequencies clearly. On stage you are blended into a mix of other instruments that occupy some of those same frequencies which could affect you right hand articulation; you work harder to bring those frequencies out.

Another factor for me is the intimidation I sometimes feel when my bass is blasting through a large sound system. I tend to pull back a bit. This alters how I pluck the strings.

I suppose there could be some psychological factors, but I'm not sure what they would be. I'm really not sure that the things I've mentioned are valid reasons. It's just an odd thing that happens.

Hahaha. I don't discount anything you said. I appreciate your time.

 

[tonemachine]

I appreciate the response Ed as I respect you very much. That's NOT it man. There's NO lack of expertise in my playing these same parts/lines/songs.
NOTHING to do with practice. Trust me.

I'll open up about the particular gig. David Bowie Tribute band. The slower stuff is always easy. It's a tune like "Hang On To Yourself" from Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders days. Quick tempo tune. I can play note-for-note at home ad nauseum!!! As I said in my original post. The fingers don't move the same LIVE. I tighten up. I think it's a mental turned to physical wall I'm hittin'. Such a drag!!!

My vote is tensing up.

Turn your amp/pickups up and play lighter. If you cant hear yourself to your taste, turn up and/or trust that the sound guys are making your heard in the crowd.

I'm not a pro but I play with some sometimes and they remind me to warm up and relax, as I have the same problem as you do. Practice while standing at home, too. I also turn up treble and mids while practicing so that I 1) get used to the awful Gank (that frequently goes away in the mix and 2) remind myself to try to avoid too much Gank via a lighter touch and cleaner technique.

 

[Deleted member 261632]

I usually drink a lot (water and other non-alcoholics), stretch both hands and I try to relax before a gig until the point of isolation.

How cheesy it may sound, but I try to become "one" with my bass I'm going to be playing at either rehearsal or gig. Sometimes my 6 banger doesn't feel good (for that gig) and I switch to another bass (mostly 5'er) or vice versa. Call it paper back psychology, but it works for me.

 

[eriky4003]

LarryR,
You don't mention if you practice sitting down. I find my technique and how I hold the bass is quite different when seated vs. standing up. As the band I'm in plays and rehearses standing up, I practice standing up as well (unless I'm figuring out a song, then when I've got the song I practice standing up). If this isn't the issue, I hope you find your solution.

 

[Barbaric.Eric]

Turn your amp/pickups up and play lighter.

+1! I've always found the right hand tenses up a bit (I call it the claw haha) when I try to make up for low bass in the stage mix by playing harder. Doesn't seem to happen when playing with a pick for me though. Since you mentioned it doesn't seem to affect your left hand, it could be from playing too aggressively?

 

[adbass]

A couple of thoughts that may or may not help:

-If the passage you are trying to play is, say for example, eight notes at 120bpm, it might help to be practice this at a faster tempo, say 130bpm, so that you can perform it at 120bpm. In other words, practice it in a way that's more difficult than the performance demands.

-If you're tensing up in anticipation of the difficult passage, anticipate the anticipation. In other words, a few moments before the difficult passage, take a deep breath and do everything in your power to relax. You know you can play the passage. You've done it a million times. If that doesn't work, try to simulate a gig situation (stand up while playing etc.)

GOOD LUCK! You can do it!!!

 

[LarryR]

Tonemachine, Valid! Thx.
ericy4003, doesn't apply, (ie. I do practice standing), but, thank you for chiming in. Your advice may apply to others who may read this thread.
Barbaric.Eric, Valid! Thx too.
adbass: Valid! Though speed at home isn't an issue. I've done what you suggest. I like the idea of "anticipate the anticipation".

A word on "pro". This thread is open to all for G-d sake. I have every right to ask for "pro" opinions, but, my issue isn't a pro thing only. My issue may show that side of me that isn't pro - all these years of playing and here comes a new challenge, that I've yet to figure out. I'm lucky to have Talkbass (and you players) to help. ALL your thoughts and opinions are a blessing.

I've got a gig in Laguna Beach this Saturday. I'll def ponder all the great ideas (so far) on this thread.

 

[winegamd]

I would look at your volume settings and how hard you are plucking. Usually at home we can hear ourselves easily, so we can be heard with a lighter touch. On the gig, where volume wars are present, and we fight to hear ourselves, we tend to dig in a bit more and this will hinder your speed and tire out your hand. Even if you can hear yourself, in the heat of the moment, we can get excited and start playing harder than usual.

 

[Finaks]

Hello! This is my first post in this forum, so I would like to greet everyone!

I play both classical double bass and electric bass, and this kind of lose of dexterity has sometimes occurred to me during perfomances of technically demanding classical pieces.

I find that it all boils down to staying completely relaxed even during playing live. One of the best ways IMO to practice this "unconscious relaxation" is to play a hard passage that has been causing tension and to read out loud for example a magazine or whatever text that you happen to have available.

It seems to be impossible to tense up while reading out loud and playing at the same time, and to me it has been a great help.

Finaks

 

[phillybass101]

I feel for you man. I too was going to add that you should make sure you hydrate before the gig and find a relaxation routine going in. And as if you haven't already have a monitor where you can not only hear the rest of the band but yourself as well.

 

[bassfran]

I've had it happen a couple of times and can attribute it to generally not warming up properly- stretching, hydration, breathing, and relaxation.