Renegotiated Pay

[coy garcia]

Reminds me of a club I used to play where at the end of the night the owners daughter would approach us and short us $50 saying she'll make it up next time...then buy some meth on her way back to her trailer parked out back......I don't miss that gig.

 

[Bunk McNulty]

I won't beat that point into the ground.

No, you should beat that point into the ground. Is the guitarist the bandleader? No? Then he doesn't have standing to speak for the band.

 

[Hurricane Jimmie]

So Anyway, I trust whoever books the gig to handle all the negotiations. Even renegotiations. This might be a good time to set up band limits, so whoever books a gig has some guidelines.
Some venues have a commitment to support live music and respect the bands they hire. And some places have a Debbie.
We once played a bar gig where the manager asked us how much we were getting.

I'm fortunate that I don't have to think about the payday anymore... just the fun of playing some music.
Good Luck to you.

 

[silky smoove]

For me, a 4 hour show means 3 60 minute sets, with breaks in between.

That's interesting. Where I am a four hour gig is almost always a bar gig, and it typcially means four 45 minute sets with 15 minute breaks in between, almost always starting at 9:00 and ending at 1:00. If the crowd is really big and still buying drinks they'll push it right until the bar does last call around 1:30. Just typing that makes me glad that I don't do bar gigs anymore

 

[BobKos]

Eventually you will regret this. Far better to correct some random guy's grammar on the internet than to do that to your wife. Trust me on this.

<SNIP>

I think what he meant went right over your head.

 

[AceOfBassFace]

Wow - definitely some irony that they're reneging on the band's pay for a labor day concert of all things.

 

[Rip Van Dan]

We've had a labor day show scheduled at a campground for several months now. The band has gone through some changes, including a name change since then. Technically, it isn't the same band but we have the same core, me and the guitarist.

A couple days ago the guitarist, who booked the show, says the venue contacted him and asked what the pay was. He told them $750 is what he negotiated with Sean. This is for a 4 hour show, on labor day weekend. Debbie (the one who called up asking about the pay) says "I can't pay that much. Best I can do is $650." Guitarist agrees and then tells us about it. The guitarist now knows he should have asked us first, so I won't beat that point into the ground. I'm wondering why the venue didn't keep any records of this (maybe they did and are feigning ignorance). I'm wondering why Sean felt he could negotiate this if Debbie is the one paying the bills. I'm wondering why the guitarist doesn't have at least an email trail of the deal.

This might be a tactic by the venue to get us to back out so they can book someone else.

I suggested to the guitarist if they want to renegotiate, ok, but we will do a 3 hour show. It isn't about the money. It's the principle. What's gonna prevent these clowns from trying to renegotiate on the day of the show. Anyway, that's when he told me he'd already agreed to the reduced rate. He said he would talk to Sean, they are friendly, to find out who Debbie is and float the reduced play time.

The more I think on it, the grumpier I get. I think it's time to introduce some type of contract, paper trail, deposit system.

BAM! And you find out first hand why you NEED TO HAVE A SIGNED CONTRACT!

 

[arbiterusa]

Take the hundred out of the guitar players pay. Serious. He cost you that money.

 

[Rip Van Dan]

Eventually you will regret this. Far better to correct some random guy's grammar on the internet than to do that to your wife. Trust me on this.

OH, and a 4 hour show - for one band? That's asking a lot of the band and the audience. I have done one of those, and it went OK, but there was a beer truck on the premises, which may have had something to do with our success.

A 4-hour gig is not unusual. I used to do that 5-nights a week back in the 70's where we'd play a venue for 2-weeks at a time. We were a union group so we played 4 sets of 45-minutes with 15-minute breaks. I still play 4-hour gigs now though with non-union groups so we may play an hour or more before taking a 20-minute break. Then have another 20-minute break in the second half of the show. A 3-hour gig is great, but still feels like cheating to me.

 

[USAJO]

The person who booked the job certainly has standing to speak for the band.

He could or should have called everyone to let them know what went down and confirm everyone still wanted to do the gig. Especially if he knew the personalities of the band mates.

if I’m booking the band it is understood that I will use my best judgement and if I’m concerned the band may not approve the terms of gig I’ll run it by them first.

If I was going to have to deal with being second guessed over $100.00 I’d tell the band to consider the gig canceled and I will no longer be involved in any booking efforts.

 

[Rip Van Dan]

Take the hundred out of the guitar players pay. Serious. He cost you that money.

This would certainly drive the point home. "Well we didn't agree to that so that $100 is going to have to come out of your share." Sounds like a great way to alienate or flat out lose a guitarist. But if he stays, he'll never do that again.

 

[Rip Van Dan]

The person who booked the job certainly has standing to speak for the band.

He could or should have called everyone to let them know what went down and confirm everyone still wanted to do the gig. Especially if he knew the personalities of the band mates.

Agreed.

if I’m booking the band it is understood that I will use my best judgement and if I’m concerned the band may not approve the terms of gig I’ll run it by them first.

Agreed.

If I was going to have to deal with being second guessed over $100.00 I’d tell the band to consider the gig canceled and I will no longer be involved in any booking efforts.

Yeah, but that's not what happened. It wasn't originally negotiated for $650. It was negotiated for $750. The guitarist took it on himself to OK the drop to $650. They may very well have been playing elsewhere for $750 depending on how good they were and how in demand they were.

When the groups I've belonged to over the years booked gigs, we all agreed ahead of time what was the lowest price and the farthest distance we'd travel for that price. As long as whoever booked it met that minimum, that was great. We also ALWAYS had a signed contract so there was no confusion on the price. If you were to take such an arrogant and cavalier attitude with a gig I booked, I'd just wave to you as you left.

 

[Ostie]

Is $25 less per person going to make you miss your mortgage payment? If the gig is fun and you want to play it, do it. If you want to stand on principle, do it, but don’t expect to play there again.

 

[LBS-bass]

$750 for 4 hours = 187.50/hr.
$650 divided by $187.50 = 3.46666666667 hrs.
Now, go and have fun !

Divided by how many people? And setup snd load out are uncounted hours? Sheesh.

 

[LBS-bass]

Is $25 less per person going to make you miss your mortgage payment? If the gig is fun and you want to play it, do it. If you want to stand on principle, do it, but don’t expect to play there again.

And next time they screw you out of another $100 because now they know they can.

remind me why I want to play there again?

 

[LBS-bass]

Your guitarist messed this one up. It’s on him. You can teach him a lesson by insisting he negotiate playing time for this rate. Or you can let everyone believe this is all ok and expect to bend over further next time. Up to y’all.

 

[Ostie]

And next time they screw you out of another $100 because now they know they can.

There’s always that danger. We don’t know if these guys really need the money, or if this is just a hobby. The OP said he he’s fine walking, so he’s made up his mind. We don’t know how the others feel. They have two choices here. Take a vote and move forward.

 

[LBS-bass]

There’s always that danger. We don’t know if these guys really need the money, or if this is just a hobby. The OP said he he’s fine walking, so he’s made up his mind. We don’t know how the others feel. They have two choices here. Take a vote and move forward.

Well I would tell this guy to stick his “renegotiated rate” where the sun don’t shine, but that’s just me. Not every venue is worth humiliating yourself over.

OP has said the crowd was sparse the last time they played. What is this room offering that makes it worth bending over?

 

[LBS-bass]

This stuff happened at a club here. New owner told all the booked bands he couldn’t pay the agreed upon rate. Then he got cocky and told a popular duo that he couldn’t pay the agreed on band rate to a duo and stiffed them, even though they filled the room because they are local music royalty.

word got around on social media. It got really ugly in a flash. Bands pulled out, bands started trash talking the venue on social media, nobody would play there. I was booked to play there and my band had to have a long discussion about it; if the BL had insisted on going forward I would have asked him to bring in a sub for me.

The venue apologized and paid the duo what they'd agreed to play for, and made good on the rest of their contracts. So we played.

it’s not uncommon for a new owner to test the water. It’s our responsibility to stand in support as a community and say no.

 

[USAJO]

Well I would tell this guy to stick his “renegotiated rate” where the sun don’t shine, but that’s just me. Not every venue is worth humiliating yourself over.

OP has said the crowd was sparse the last time they played. What is this room offering that makes it worth bending over?

Yeah if the crowd is sparse why pay a band at all? The venue should just make everyone happy cancel them and hire a solo act for $200.00. Everybody goes home happy.