Roger Waters has to be stupid

[Gully Foyle]

The Final Cut.

/thread.

Agreed - great record!

 

[jjmuckluckjr]

Oh, by the way, which one's Pink. From "Welcome to the Machine ".
According to legend, when Pink Floyd came to New York to meet American record executives for the first time, the head MuckityMuck actually asked the band that question. Where's Syd Barrett when you need him? (Yeah, I know he passed.)

 

[cnltb]

Why on earth would anybody want to quit working with David Gilmour?

Dave is a great guitar player, and a great singer ...

Maybe because you felt you couldn't see through your ideas teamed up with him?
And...because there are plenty good guitarist/singers out there whom you'd feel better working with?
and maybe because your 'teamness' might have come to a natural end?

 

[Joe Ty]

Not relevant I guess but dark side of the moon is so much better than the wall. It's not even close

Probably the greatest rock album ever, but the Wall was no slouch.

 

[Rayjay]

Rogers and Gilmour parted ways because of ego issues, not talent issues. Both are great songwriters (I know there's a lot of MLOR and DB bashing here...BUT let us not forget Gilmour wrote a lot of the Waters era Floyd material as well). But they both felt that they were the whole band - egos clashed - things came to a head.

I will say that although Waters is a big influence on me, and he had some amazing moments both as a singer and a bass player with a huge tone, and he inspired me to experiment with effects (esp phasers), he has got to be one of the least versatile musicians to have ever made a career out of it. He positively can't play at all unless its his own material. That's why Dave had to play bass on many album cuts, and GE Smith works bass duty for half the set (at least when I saw The Wall tour). And, I believe Dave's songwriting - not his style, just the fact that Dave wrote anything and Roger had to stoop to the level of learning someone else's songs - was a big factor in Roger wanting to leave and Dave being happy that he did.

 

[Robroy]

Rogers and Gilmour parted ways because of ego issues, not talent issues. Both are great songwriters (I know there's a lot of MLOR and DB bashing here...BUT let us not forget Gilmour wrote a lot of the Waters era Floyd material as well). But they both felt that they were the whole band - egos clashed - things came to a head.

I will say that although Waters is a big influence on me, and he had some amazing moments both as a singer and a bass player with a huge tone, and he inspired me to experiment with effects (esp phasers), he has got to be one of the least versatile musicians to have ever made a career out of it. He positively can't play at all unless its his own material. That's why Dave had to play bass on many album cuts, and GE Smith works bass duty for half the set (at least when I saw The Wall tour). And, I believe Dave's songwriting - not his style, just the fact that Dave wrote anything and Roger had to stoop to the level of learning someone else's songs - was a big factor in Roger wanting to leave and Dave being happy that he did.

Musicians are such flakes!

 

[Altitude]

I figure Waters was the genius and Gilmour was the rock star. Waters may have been the bandleader, but everyone in the world except him thought Gilmour was. Past a certain point, he had enough and split.

Personally, I like the Gilmour-led Floyd records. Just sayin.

 

[Honch]

You can slay all you want between Rog/Dave wars but what people see in Syd Barrett is really beyond me. Even Barretts Pink Floyd. And his solo albums afterwards. I think if there's one within the Floyd camp that has gotten way more praise than he deserved, it's Syd.

let the flame...

 

[Robroy]

You can slay all you want between Rog/Dave wars but what people see in Syd Barrett is really beyond me. Even Barretts Pink Floyd. And his solo albums afterwards. I think if there's one within the Floyd camp that has gotten way more praise than he deserved, it's Syd.

let the flame...

Regarding Syd, you and I are one in opinion.

 

[I am Soma]

This does too:

by the gods...those lyrics are so bad

 

[Plutonium244]

Let's face it, huge talents are often a pain in the ass to work with and are sometimes not well-liked. I don't know if I'd really like him as a person-- couldn't say either way-- but I certainly respect the music.

 

[funkymonk13]

Frankly all of Pink Floyd are mediocre musicians. They are brilliant arrangers, producers and SOUND architects. Mixing geniuses. They all came from som art or achitect school in London originally. Lyric writing goes to Rog. I think that given less than a month, I could pull off everything Nick Mason did on drums, just as well as coming up with new and more varied an intriguing stuff. They're all "sluggish" and a hard to rehearse band. Rick was the most talented, he knew chords stuff, voice leading and so on. The most "proud" moments of PF was when Rick Wright was in full flight. Not anyone of the others, so to speak, like when they were in "full flight" something intriguing was happenng. Since both Rog and Dave sang lead, it was almost impossible at times to tell which was which, even when Rick Wright sang one or two songs throughout their carreer.

I remember when they should be recording an album full of "house objects" they were quite stubbornly trying to make "playing" rubber bands tied to a table sound like a bass guitar as close as possible. One day Rick went "hey nuff of this, stop it, it's just insane, not leading anywhere". They were quite indulgent, introvert. And one can clearly see Daves indifference or indignation even during the Live8 reunion performance, where Roger "interrupts" the songs all of the time with talking in the songs and sort of mocking the whole event itself. During intro to "Wish You Were Here" ... annoying as f*..and other tunes as well.

Lol wut?
One of the most popular, influential and timeless acts of the 20th century = mediocre at making music

In terms of technical skill Nick and Roger maybe aren't super proficient but let's not get carried away here.

 

[tbz]

Yeah, Roger sure do think a lot of himself and want all of the world to see him and acknowledge him.

I guess Gilmour doesn't need to make a big act out of his genuine talent though.

I know a lot of folks that can play guitar better than Gilmore. His playing is average for the era and is substantially sub par by modern standards.

Don't know anyone else that writes songs like Waters.

 

[tbz]

Lol wut?
One of the most popular, influential and timeless acts of the 20th century = mediocre at making music

In terms of technical skill Nick and Roger maybe aren't super proficient but let's not get carried away here.

Rick wasn't a great pianist and the guys I pay $100-$200 to play in my band for joke gigs can play Gilmore's parts note for note, and do a ton of stuff he can't.

They made great music, but you have to be really incorrectly calibrated to think any of them are musically talented.

 

[Gully Foyle]

Rick wasn't a great pianist and the guys I pay $100-$200 to play in my band for joke gigs can play Gilmore's parts note for note, and do a ton of stuff he can't.

They made great music, but you have to be really incorrectly calibrated to think any of them are musically talented.

Awesome, what songs did your sidemen write? Why do they still play for 1-200 if they are multimillionaires?

 

[Honch]

... was a big factor in Roger wanting to leave and Dave being happy that he did.

Roger did never wanted to leave.
Roger was bought out.
Roger said once to the "management" that it was either RICK WRIGHT (even prior to the Wall) or him. Then Rick Wright split. He was a hired gun on both The Wall album and tour, but didn't tell this to the public. He was the only one within the band, that earned money from it, all the others lost, because he didn't have a stake in it. So then, if Rick left, Rog was cool with it and wanted to play with the rest of them. Then when "Final Cut" came and had only Waters songs written all over it, session musicians ONLY apart from Dave guesting on a few tracks, they thought "what's the point?" they thought if "he" (rog himself) could do a "solo" album and put the Pink Floyd name all over it, without anyone of the rest participating at all, the 3 of them could just as well produce another album without Rog and put the Pink Floyd name all over it. You know, pro quid pro or what it is called...or really 2 of them as it was on Momentary Lapse.

 

[tbz]

Awesome, what songs did your sidemen write? Why do they still play for 1-200 if they are multimillionaires?

They didn't write any.

I've never said they were poor writers, they're just not really good musicians. Their skills were about par for their era for other bands of the time, and are substantially below what is currently considered "professional quality."

Why did you mention writing? I was replying to a comment that was trying to pretend that their impact was correlative with their musical ability or talent at their instruments. Which it simply isn't.

Have you ever tried to learn Floyd parts btw? It's all absurdly simple.

 

[Spirit of Ox]

David Gilmour's About Face was an alright album.
Roger's Pros and cons of hitch hiking is one of my all time favorite albums. It could've been a Floyd album and probably would have if they (at least Gilmour and Mason) stayed with him. He even had Clapton play guitar on it.
Amused to death- big disappointment IMO.

 

[LoTone]

You're telling me the Floyd albums' basslines didn't groove?

It is common knowledge that, in the studio, it is actually David Gilmour that composed and performed the basslines that ended up on the recordings. So, if you like Pink Floyd's basslines, you actually have an appreciation for David Gilmour's talent not Roger Waters.

 

[Joe Ty]

Awesome, what songs did your sidemen write? Why do they still play for 1-200 if they are multimillionaires?

I think we are back to the argument as to whether musicianship is a measure of athleticism or something broader. David Gilmour was not Jimmy Page. Waters was not Entwhistle. It's nice they wrote music I can figure out and play with my rudimentary skills on the fretboard.