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Set list too short
- Thread starter basseux
- Start date
You have a professional gig booked and the group is not ready. That leaves you three options:
1. Plow ahead, perform the gig, and be absolutely prepared for it to be a train wreck and make you look unprofessional.
2. Convince the other musicians to cancel the gig while there is time for the booker to find a replacement or refund any advance sales.
3. Accept that this is a train wreck, bail now, and leave the band time to replace you and decide between #1 and #2 amongst themselves.
Personally, I've had sub gigs where I had to learn 40 R&B tunes in an afternoon. I've played in many bands that did 60+ of those songs without ever rehearsing, or perhaps meeting once or twice to hammer out endings before the first gig. In my last full-time gig we often learned songs in the car on the way to the venue, so there's just no excuse to not get material covered with literal months of time to put in the work.
Learning songs is a prerequisite to play in a cover band, and an absolutely non-negotiable expectation if you are actively booking gigs and making promises to deliver a certain amount of content.
Either these guys aren't good enough to do this kind of work, or they are super lazy, or they just don't care (in which case it's only a matter of time before this entire band collapses.) In any case, don't go down with the ship. There's no shortage of bands who need a bass player and you owe these guys nothing. Either right the ship or get out of there before it's too late.
1. Plow ahead, perform the gig, and be absolutely prepared for it to be a train wreck and make you look unprofessional.
2. Convince the other musicians to cancel the gig while there is time for the booker to find a replacement or refund any advance sales.
3. Accept that this is a train wreck, bail now, and leave the band time to replace you and decide between #1 and #2 amongst themselves.
Personally, I've had sub gigs where I had to learn 40 R&B tunes in an afternoon. I've played in many bands that did 60+ of those songs without ever rehearsing, or perhaps meeting once or twice to hammer out endings before the first gig. In my last full-time gig we often learned songs in the car on the way to the venue, so there's just no excuse to not get material covered with literal months of time to put in the work.
Learning songs is a prerequisite to play in a cover band, and an absolutely non-negotiable expectation if you are actively booking gigs and making promises to deliver a certain amount of content.
Either these guys aren't good enough to do this kind of work, or they are super lazy, or they just don't care (in which case it's only a matter of time before this entire band collapses.) In any case, don't go down with the ship. There's no shortage of bands who need a bass player and you owe these guys nothing. Either right the ship or get out of there before it's too late.
So Saturday, the BL asked me if I wanted to do a creative session tuesday or Wednesday, the day we are supposed to rehearse. And I said that with 7 weeks and a hole of 6 or 8 songs to fill for the show, and considering how long it takes to learn songs with that band, that there was no time for that, and we should do that after.
I was discussing with the sax to try to share concern about not adding songs, and beeing close to the exit.
First news, ( half news because BL already told me he considered leaving), sax considers leaving after the show, and share about the same concerns as me.
Second news is that it seems the BL went through with his creative session idea, and since I was reluctant, he canceled unilaterally the usual wednesday rehearsal and invited another bass player to jam.
I told the sax that it looks like the drop of water that overflow the jar for me.
Sax says he will call BL today, thinks creative session is not the priority too, and that BL is scatering himself.
I was discussing with the sax to try to share concern about not adding songs, and beeing close to the exit.
First news, ( half news because BL already told me he considered leaving), sax considers leaving after the show, and share about the same concerns as me.
Second news is that it seems the BL went through with his creative session idea, and since I was reluctant, he canceled unilaterally the usual wednesday rehearsal and invited another bass player to jam.
I told the sax that it looks like the drop of water that overflow the jar for me.
Sax says he will call BL today, thinks creative session is not the priority too, and that BL is scatering himself.
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Wow... are you in my band?
Not one of the ones in my sig, but Granite State Rhythm is the core instrumental unit in Blues Brothers: Next Generation. It has had a separate existence as a band but keeps on stalling out and not getting gigs. Great musicians but a revolving door of singers, and then Covid, and so on. Now we finally have a 3-hour gig booked (made months ago), we're 7 weeks away from it, and... we have about 25 songs we can play. We basically need another set's worth. And there's no rehearsal this week because there's a BBNG practice on the night it would have been.
So we're looking at six rehearsals till the gig, and this is a group where it's all too common for someone to plead a family or work issue and having to cancel.
Or where the singer (who has become default BL, and is good at it) will give homework to learn three or four songs, and next rehearsal someone is saying, "Oh, which one is that? I didn't listen to it."
Or where we'll run a song, and someone will say, "Eh, it's boring to play this like the record, let's change it up and make it our own," which is going to mean wasting an hour of rehearsal time noodling around on a half-baked idea only to come up with a weird take on it that no one will dance to.
I like these guys and they're great to play with. I'm amazed we stuck together as a group through Covid and constant hiccups and setbacks. If we just get priorities straight and fill out a set list, we can get gigging and do whatever creative challenging stuff later. But I think that the long period of playing without having a gig has gotten everyone used to having no sense of urgency or needing to get down to business.
Not one of the ones in my sig, but Granite State Rhythm is the core instrumental unit in Blues Brothers: Next Generation. It has had a separate existence as a band but keeps on stalling out and not getting gigs. Great musicians but a revolving door of singers, and then Covid, and so on. Now we finally have a 3-hour gig booked (made months ago), we're 7 weeks away from it, and... we have about 25 songs we can play. We basically need another set's worth. And there's no rehearsal this week because there's a BBNG practice on the night it would have been.
So we're looking at six rehearsals till the gig, and this is a group where it's all too common for someone to plead a family or work issue and having to cancel.
Or where the singer (who has become default BL, and is good at it) will give homework to learn three or four songs, and next rehearsal someone is saying, "Oh, which one is that? I didn't listen to it."
Or where we'll run a song, and someone will say, "Eh, it's boring to play this like the record, let's change it up and make it our own," which is going to mean wasting an hour of rehearsal time noodling around on a half-baked idea only to come up with a weird take on it that no one will dance to.
I like these guys and they're great to play with. I'm amazed we stuck together as a group through Covid and constant hiccups and setbacks. If we just get priorities straight and fill out a set list, we can get gigging and do whatever creative challenging stuff later. But I think that the long period of playing without having a gig has gotten everyone used to having no sense of urgency or needing to get down to business.
If you’re playing three 45 minute sets then I’m guessing the set break is approximately 15 minutes. You could reasonably repeat a few songs from the beginning of the performance again towards the end. Now you’re only looking to add about 4 more songs. That’s nothing to add over the course of seven weeks.
So it's done, I left.
After a discussion still going nowhere on the matter of filling up the set.
The BL (who is a drummer by the way) won't let go of the idea of not filling the set.
He says it's useless to talk about adding so gs if we don't meet at rehearsal.
First of all, deciding songs at rehearsals is too late, we want to practice them at rehearsals, not learn them together listening to a phone.
We are in vacations in and out in July and August, so to antipate rehearsal difficulties, I proposed in June that we work through a DAW by recording ourselves at home and trying to put tracks together, to at least keep people engaged, and eventually develop studio skills, but nope, no reaction.
I said they really make me have a foot out the door with an attitude like that.
Drummer asked if I am sure I didn't have two.
Guitar player (he wants to be pro), said it doesn't matter to be 20 minutes off, because there will be only family and friends in the venue.
I tried to make him understand it was one of the most musically busy street in Paris, on a Friday night, where people and tourist just come in, knowing their money will be well invested on good professional music.
But nope, he doesn't gets it.
Guitar player said people laughed at him when he said band members where taking weekends of vacations often away from the city and that it created difficulties to get dates. But unlike him, the guys with day jobs are learning the songs for the rehearsals, they are not saying they don't learn songs if unsure we play them, as a wannabe professional it should be nothing for him. I did even have to find him the chords for Fill Me Up myself by ear because he couldn't.
The bass player finds the chords for keyboard and guitar player ...
I don't even want to book dates when I know we will not even fill the asked time.
They believe booking shows will bring the motivation, but the truth was revealed that it doesn't, at least those that want to see it.
Imagine leaving your day job for such buffooneries.
Drummer said he was playing 3 hours a day, and challenged me doing so.
First, I am not jobless and living at my parents house like him, and before when he had a job l, he was far from practicing as much as me.
Second, I don't need 3 hours a day to learn 6 songs.
He said that the crowd would listen to how we play, and improving is important. Yeah I wish he had though more about that when I said that to him 8 months ago, not when when the priority is filling a 30 minutes hole.
I said that considering there is no mentallity change, I now have two foots out.
After a discussion still going nowhere on the matter of filling up the set.
The BL (who is a drummer by the way) won't let go of the idea of not filling the set.
He says it's useless to talk about adding so gs if we don't meet at rehearsal.
First of all, deciding songs at rehearsals is too late, we want to practice them at rehearsals, not learn them together listening to a phone.
We are in vacations in and out in July and August, so to antipate rehearsal difficulties, I proposed in June that we work through a DAW by recording ourselves at home and trying to put tracks together, to at least keep people engaged, and eventually develop studio skills, but nope, no reaction.
I said they really make me have a foot out the door with an attitude like that.
Drummer asked if I am sure I didn't have two.
Guitar player (he wants to be pro), said it doesn't matter to be 20 minutes off, because there will be only family and friends in the venue.
I tried to make him understand it was one of the most musically busy street in Paris, on a Friday night, where people and tourist just come in, knowing their money will be well invested on good professional music.
But nope, he doesn't gets it.
Guitar player said people laughed at him when he said band members where taking weekends of vacations often away from the city and that it created difficulties to get dates. But unlike him, the guys with day jobs are learning the songs for the rehearsals, they are not saying they don't learn songs if unsure we play them, as a wannabe professional it should be nothing for him. I did even have to find him the chords for Fill Me Up myself by ear because he couldn't.
The bass player finds the chords for keyboard and guitar player ...
I don't even want to book dates when I know we will not even fill the asked time.
They believe booking shows will bring the motivation, but the truth was revealed that it doesn't, at least those that want to see it.
Imagine leaving your day job for such buffooneries.
Drummer said he was playing 3 hours a day, and challenged me doing so.
First, I am not jobless and living at my parents house like him, and before when he had a job l, he was far from practicing as much as me.
Second, I don't need 3 hours a day to learn 6 songs.
He said that the crowd would listen to how we play, and improving is important. Yeah I wish he had though more about that when I said that to him 8 months ago, not when when the priority is filling a 30 minutes hole.
I said that considering there is no mentallity change, I now have two foots out.
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You have a band leader. That person doesn't seem concerned. That leaves you only a few choices.
1) Get enough band members to back you up so that four or five of you can insist on learning new material quickly. Without several others backing you up, this is a useless plan.
2) Just go do the gig and see what happens. Without the band leader being concerned, it's going to be hard to force the issue.
3) If you can't get backup for moving forward with new material quickly, and you can't stand the idea of ending the show early, then leave the band.
1) Get enough band members to back you up so that four or five of you can insist on learning new material quickly. Without several others backing you up, this is a useless plan.
2) Just go do the gig and see what happens. Without the band leader being concerned, it's going to be hard to force the issue.
3) If you can't get backup for moving forward with new material quickly, and you can't stand the idea of ending the show early, then leave the band.
Does this "prestigious" venue always pay their musical acts a percentage of the door?
What a mess!
You're welcome.
OP, here's an easy remedy.
Just make your third set an Allman Bros Tribute set.
Whipping Post
Mountain Jam
Dreams I'll Never See
One Way Out
Done!
Just make your third set an Allman Bros Tribute set.
Whipping Post
Mountain Jam
Dreams I'll Never See
One Way Out
Done!
This has been a very entertaining thread for me. First figuring out where the writer was from, because the tenses are all messed up, and other style aspects, I figured France. (including the style of music) THen it's a story of a band where members (and leader) exhibit nonchalance (sounds like a French word) and probably regard the over motivated person to be a little mal adjusted. Just like in Emily In Paris!! The French DO, with their studied nonchalance and continued use of dairy fats, have better cardiac health than 'Mericans.
Probably not, there are many international jazz artists coming there, and they probably do that only with less known risky bands.
I think we benefited from covid uncertainty, with many artists not coming to europe.
It seems we were booked without an audio sample, I don't know how, maybe they saw we were booked in another venue and though that it would do the job for their needs.
That venue feels important enough to require 6 months exclusivity clause in the city.
Having no clue what is was, I searchengined it and saw it was probably because they invest money to make international artists come, and they don't want other venues to reap what they sowed.
Of course we would not have to deal with that, but it was in the paper they sent.
In that regard, this venue was the most legally demanding venue we had to deal with.
They asked we create an association to make the money exchange legal.
Some venue ask it by principle but quickly forget about it if they see it will be an issue for us.
And as I said there was some contract that even had an exclusivity clause, which doesn't make sense for us, but just that should have been enough to wake the hell out of people.
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I saw the episodes of Emily you are referring to, and yeah that technically looks like that.
The caveat is that I am french as you guessed, and also very nonchalant, and couldn't cope with that.
Not when I have the initial desire to do well, and my pride is involved.
Emily TV show is a bit too cheesy, but I liked the humor, and to see Paris images.
I didn't grew up in Paris and you easily get back to tourist mode.
The nonchallance is by definition not studied, it's a way of leaving that is common to latin countries of the south of Europe like France Portugal Spain Italy.
Country at the north like Germany and UK are not like that and more like USA.
For instance in France, Spain Italy, it's tolerated to be a bit late, and germans go crazy if you are 30 seconds late.
I think Emily had an episod on that.
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7 weeks is quite a long time to find and learn more songs. That's why the band that I am in has an excel sheet with all the potential songs we could use for any given situation. Right now we have 107 songs that are ready to be played. I have played all of them at one point or another and relearning the necessary songs for a gig only takes 2 days of dedicated work at most, since it's mostly just remembering what I already knew. And if I have a problem with a particular song I make a chordsheet.
So, maybe the solution to not having enough songs for a gig, is to just have bigger repertoire. I honestly thought that it's normal for a band who plays more serious gigs to just be prepared for all different kinds of things. Hell, we even learn a couple of jazz standards for a gig we play once a year on sylvester in a fancy hotel...
I saw the episodes of Emily you are referring to, and yeah that technically looks like that.
The caveat is that I am french as you guessed, and also very nonchalant, and couldn't cope with that.
Not when I have the initial desire to do well, and my pride is involved.
Emily TV show is a bit too cheesy, but I liked the humor, and to see Paris images.
I didn't grew up in Paris and you easily get back to tourist mode.
The nonchallance is by definition not studied, it's a way of leaving that is common to latin countries of the south of Europe like France Portugal Spain Italy.
Country at the north like Germany and UK are not like that and more like USA.
For instance in France, Spain Italy, it's tolerated to be a bit late, and germans go crazy if you are 30 seconds late.
I think Emily had an episod on that.
Ive heard the Germans are a bit unique when it comes to timeliness etiquette - not only do they expect you to be on time, but they also consider arriving early to be almost as bad as it’s considered a waste of time to arrive before an appointment.
In the states, at least where I grew up, arriving early meant you were on time, arriving on time meant you were late, and arriving late was a sin punishable by death… or something like that.
You are preaching to a converted, and I like to hear that.
I met the BL at a jam that had a set of 40 songs that changed every 3 months.
You had to learn them to go on stage perform with others, I went there every week.
The goal of the organiser was to teach guys to be professionals.
So you expect people you meet there and team up with to agree to that and enforce that policy.
You can't really go back to lesser effort bands after tasting that.
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I was in Bali in a German surf camp in holidays.
The meetup to the van to go to the spot, was sometime very early like 5AM.
If at 5:00 somebody was missing, Germans pushed Balinese surf guides who are ten time more relaxed that latin Europe, to just drive off.
I can understand the rational behind it in business world, but I never seen it so drastically enforced by people who are just in freaking holidays at the other side of the planet.
Americans are a bit loser from what I seen, you can go up to 5:03 or something
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