Double Bass Skylark: playing "almost" a Rythm Changes over the A section

[jjqq123]

Hi, i need to learn skylark, and to me some versions (Dexter Gordon´s, Mark Turner´s) just almost play a rythm changes over A.

I´m more confortable playing this, because real book´s changes seem a little bit confusing to me, and i can hear this changes better:

|Ebmaj7 C7 | Fmin7 Bb7 | Gmin7 C7| Fmin7 Bb7|
|Abmaj7 Abmaj7/G|Fmin7 Bb7 |Ebmaj7 C7| Fmin7 Bb7|

Since i´m here i´ll post my bridge section aswell:
Cmin7 F7 | Bbmin7 Eb7 | Abmaj7 |G-7b5 C7 |
F-7 F-7/E |Ebmaj7 Abmaj7/D|G6 Emin7|A-7D7G6Bb7|

So, my question is, do you "hear" changes similar to this when playing skylark? If not, what chords do do you think will clash with this?

Thank you very much. Best regards.

 

[meandering]

Great tune! I haven't hear Mark Turner's version in a while (will check it tonight) and do not know Dex's version (will have to check out, though. What record is it on?). I learned the changes from Keith Jarrett's Blue Note set. He plays something like this for the 1st A in Eb (F is also common, in my experience):

||Ebmaj7 F-7|G-7 (or Eb/G) Abmaj7|Ebmaj7 (or Eb/Bb) A7|Abmaj7 G-7b5 C7|F7 |F-7 Bb7|Ebmaj7 C7|F-7 Bb7||

This is a bare bones outline. Lots of opportunities for tensions, added dominants, etc. The three features that standout to me and differentiate this progression from rhythm changes are: (1) whole step movement in bass in ms. 1 & 2, (2) tritone sub to IV chord in m. 3, and (3) II-V to the II7 in ms. 4 & 5. I seem to remember that Turner plays something similar to the above but I'll verify when I get home.

Your version of the bridge is close but i play some key differences. i have to go back to work but can give changes tonight, if it will be helpful.

 

[Don Kasper]

||Ebmaj7 F-7|G-7 (or G/Eb) F-7|Ebmaj7 A7|Abmaj7 G-7b5 C7|F7 |F-7 Bb7|Ebmaj7 C7|F-7 Bb7||

Yes!!!!

 

[Carl Hillman]

Hi, i need to learn skylark, and to me some versions (Dexter Gordon´s, Mark Turner´s) just almost play a rythm changes over A.

I´m more confortable playing this, because real book´s changes seem a little bit confusing to me, and i can hear this changes better:

|Ebmaj7 C7 | Fmin7 Bb7 | Gmin7 C7| Fmin7 Bb7|
|Abmaj7 Abmaj7/G|Fmin7 Bb7 |Ebmaj7 C7| Fmin7 Bb7|

Since i´m here i´ll post my bridge section aswell:
Cmin7 F7 | Bbmin7 Eb7 | Abmaj7 |G-7b5 C7 |
F-7 F-7/E |Ebmaj7 Abmaj7/D|G6 Emin7|A-7D7G6Bb7|

So, my question is, do you "hear" changes similar to this when playing skylark? If not, what chords do do you think will clash with this?

Thank you very much. Best regards.

Composer's (presumed) changes:



This is closer to the changes meandering posted. (I learned it this way as well.)

Though, Hoagy's bridge does start like yours on vi instead of the oft heard IV.

 

[jjqq123]

Great tune! I haven't hear Mark Turner's version in a while (will check it tonight) and do not know Dex's version (will have to check out, though. What record is it on?). I learned the changes from Keith Jarrett's Blue Note set. He plays something like this for the 1st A in Eb (F is also common, in my experience):

||Ebmaj7 F-7|G-7 (or G/Eb) F-7|Ebmaj7 A7|Abmaj7 G-7b5 C7|F7 |F-7 Bb7|Ebmaj7 C7|F-7 Bb7||

This is a bare bones outline. Lots of opportunities for tensions, added dominants, etc. The three features that standout to me and differentiate this progression from rhythm changes are: (1) whole step movement in bass in ms. 1 & 2, (2) tritone sub to IV chord in m. 3, and (3) II-V to the II7 in ms. 4 & 5. I seem to remember that Turner plays something similar to the above but I'll verify when I get home.

Your version of the bridge is close but i play some key differences. i have to go back to work but can give changes tonight, if it will be helpful.

Thank you for your response! Your take on the B section will be very much appreciated. Since i went to the piano your version has a lot more sense than mine.
"(1) whole step movement in bass in ms. 1 & 2" not a lot of room to be creative here. The thing i hate is that the line cliche has to be one octave up of where i want to hear that line. I think i won´t like that line that much if i have to repeat it for every soloist. Specially if it continues with Abmaj7 (that´s the real book changes here) instead of F-7 in measure 2, followed by Ebmaj7/Bb
"(2) tritone sub to IV chord in m. 3" i don´t like that chord at all! . I guess i could maintain Eb for Eb7..., or play Eb7/G
"(3) II-V to the II7 in ms. 4 & 5" ok, this one is important, cannot skip.

 

[jjqq123]

Composer's (presumed) changes:

This is closer to the changes meandering posted. (I learned it this way as well.)

Though, Hoagy's bridge does start like yours on vi instead of the oft heard IV.

Thank you. That A7 on bar 3 seems less awfull if preceded by Bb-7 on the 3rd beat and A7 on the fourth beat

 

[Carl Hillman]

Thank you. That A7 on bar 3 seems less awfull if preceded by Bb-7 on the 3rd beat and A7 on the fourth beat

I guess it depends on your tolerance for tritone subs. I kind of like it.

You could always just play Eb7 there.

 

[meandering]

Is that G/Eb or Eb/G?

sorry, not used to typing out changes. original post has been corrected...

 

[jjqq123]

Great tune! I haven't hear Mark Turner's version in a while (will check it tonight) and do not know Dex's version (will have to check out, though. What record is it on?).

Hi meandering, forgot this; i thought about rythm changes after hearing Dexter Gordon´s version. It´s this one:

 

[Duanestuermer]

Love that tune, played it on a church gig a while back. All kinds of room for
creativity. Bass is a bit buried without using headphones on a computer.
Invalid Link Removed

 

[Whousedtoplay]

Great tune! I haven't hear Mark Turner's version in a while (will check it tonight) and do not know Dex's version (will have to check out, though. What record is it on?). I learned the changes from Keith Jarrett's Blue Note set. He plays something like this for the 1st A in Eb (F is also common, in my experience):

||Ebmaj7 F-7|G-7 (or Eb/G) F-7|Ebmaj7 A7|Abmaj7 G-7b5 C7|F7 |F-7 Bb7|Ebmaj7 C7|F-7 Bb7||

This is a bare bones outline. Lots of opportunities for tensions, added dominants, etc. The three features that standout to me and differentiate this progression from rhythm changes are: (1) whole step movement in bass in ms. 1 & 2, (2) tritone sub to IV chord in m. 3, and (3) II-V to the II7 in ms. 4 & 5. I seem to remember that Turner plays something similar to the above but I'll verify when I get home.

Your version of the bridge is close but i play some key differences. i have to go back to work but can give changes tonight, if it will be helpful.

Who could explain the appearance of that Gmin7(b5) chord before C7, F7 in Eb major?
It has nothing to do with the leading VII in Major or iimin7(b5) in Minor.
Some passing (leading) chord, a relative of a secondary dominant/tritone?

 

[jjqq123]

Who could explain the appearance of that Gmin7(b5) chord before C7, F7 in Eb major?
It has nothing to do with the leading VII in Major or iimin7(b5) in Minor.
Some passing (leading) chord, a relative of a secondary dominant/tritone?

Hi I think they are called related II, they may be -7 or -7b5 and they precede a dominant chord. May aswell be the related II from the tritone sub (Db-7b5 or Db-7 to C7 to F)
(Correct me if i´m wrong)

 

[jjqq123]

Love that tune, played it on a church gig a while back. All kinds of room for
creativity. Bass is a bit buried without using headphones on a computer.
Invalid Link Removed

Beautiful ornaments, thank you.

 

[Don Kasper]

Hi, i need to learn skylark, and to me some versions (Dexter Gordon´s, Mark Turner´s) just almost play a rythm changes over A.

I´m more confortable playing this, because real book´s changes seem a little bit confusing to me, and i can hear this changes better:

|Ebmaj7 C7 | Fmin7 Bb7 | Gmin7 C7| Fmin7 Bb7|
|Abmaj7 Abmaj7/G|Fmin7 Bb7 |Ebmaj7 C7| Fmin7 Bb7|

Since i´m here i´ll post my bridge section aswell:
Cmin7 F7 | Bbmin7 Eb7 | Abmaj7 |G-7b5 C7 |
F-7 F-7/E |Ebmaj7 Abmaj7/D|G6 Emin7|A-7D7G6Bb7|

So, my question is, do you "hear" changes similar to this when playing skylark? If not, what chords do do you think will clash with this?

Thank you very much. Best regards.

Here is my (old) chart on Skylark. I'm not sure what version(s) I borrowed & stole from.
Thanks.

 

[Whousedtoplay]

As an amateur pop musician, I like Ella Fitzgerald's version of Skylark.

Just an exception/issue about the bass note with one chord.
Let's use Don's chords.

Ebmaj7/Eb - Fmin7/F - Eb/G - Abmaj7/Ab - Ebmaj7/Bb (bass) - (and here is my issue) A7(9) (#11)/C (bass)

Ella's version is in Ab.

 

[jjqq123]

As an amateur pop musician, I like Ella Fitzgerald's version of Skylark.

Just an exception/issue about the bass note with one chord.
Let's use Don's chords.

Ebmaj7/Eb - Fmin7/F - Eb/G - Abmaj7/Ab - Ebmaj7/Bb (bass) - (and here is my issue) A7(9) (#11)/C (bass)

Very interesting.
I think i hear C-9 instead of A7 (Ebmaj7/C), but i´m not sure at all.
1:35 bass does Bb twice (maybe Bb, A, Ab) and i think i hear II V I to Ab

 

[Whousedtoplay]

Very interesting.
I think i hear C-9 instead of A7 (Ebmaj7/C), but i´m not sure at all.
1:35 bass does Bb twice (maybe Bb, A, Ab) and i think i hear II V I to Ab

Yes, it sounds very Cmin.
What’s more, that C is always around.
The first chord is more Eb6 than Ebmaj7.
P.S. Don will explain to us that Ella’s version is not acceptable for serious Jazz musicians.

 

[Don Kasper]

Very interesting.
I think i hear C-9 instead of A7 (Ebmaj7/C), but i´m not sure at all.
1:35 bass does Bb twice (maybe Bb, A, Ab) and i think i hear II V I to Ab

jjqq123,
Yes! (transposing my comments to the key of Eb, not Ab!) - "Ebmaj/Bb, Cmin7" is played in m. 3 of the first 2 A sections of the melody.
At 1:35 (the last A section of the first chorus), IMO, they DO use the "hip" Tritone Substitution "A7#11" (D7#11 in the key of Ab.)
Thanks for your ears and interest!

 

[Don Kasper]

The first chord is more Eb6 than Ebmaj7.
P.S. Don will explain to us that Ella’s version is not acceptable for serious Jazz musicians

WUTP,
I believe you are correct - the first chord does not contain a Maj7. Good Earz!
I believe you are incorrect - any serious musician/bassist should be interested in the actual Harmony in Ella's version!
Thanks!

 

[Whousedtoplay]

WUTP,
I believe you are correct - the first chord does not contain a Maj7. Good Earz!
I believe you are incorrect - any serious musician/bassist should be interested in the actual Harmony in Ella's version!
Thanks!

Don, I've used your excellent chord sheet as my guidance for Ella's commercially more approachable rendition of Skylark.
Ella's arrangement is a simplified (smoother) version of more a advanced Jazz version of Skylark.