Soloing When You're Not Good At Soloing

[vvvmmm]

For me:
melody;
time/phrasing;
sound change-ups (ex., octaves, harmonics, slap/pop, bends, slides, pedals, etc.); and,
repetition.

Basically how I play lead guitar.

 

[mambo4]

When I was playing lead guitar, I learned a bit of SRV and David Gilmore licks. Sliced and diced and remixed them, and mapped out the solos ahead of time. I like having a plan. Maybe not exactly what I'll play, but each part of the solo will have a specific area of the fingerboard.

 

[Joebone]

What's the story you want to tell, or the feeling you want to share? Do you feel that story or feeling strongly enough that your audience should care? Audiences respond to intensity of feeling - which is why the most abstract of jazz improvisors AND a punk rocker with limited chops but a Shyteload of feeling can both move a crowd. There are many fine technical suggestions in this thread - in particular, I'm pretty big on keeping the melody in mind, and also tend to think of target notes that ascend or descend over an 8 or 16-bar phrase so that I have some sense of development and direction - but let's also not forget that all of the great tools and techniques ultimately do not amount to squat unless you have some sort of emotional message, and the ability to let it out.

 

[Wasnex]

I don't solo unless someone makes me. I play bass so I can play bass lines. So the other night at a jam session, I got the nod, and basically played a busy bass line. I didn't try to do what other instruments do, I did what my instrument does. Drummers play drum solos, and people love them, so why should I not play a cool bass line for a solo. Maybe someday when I'm a better player, I'll have a different opinion.

Depending upon the style of music, that may have been perfect...or not .

 

[Jughead6]

Everyone in my cover band gets a call to solo at every gig. Essentially our BL introduces each band member and they do a solo.

I find that syncopation, well-timed pauses and melody are more effective than trying to play lots of fast notes up and down the fretboard.

 

[Tommygun_ted]

When I was playing in jazz trios, I was expected to solo quite a bit, but it was usually a negotiation (pretty much every tune). When the time came, whoever was calling the shots would look at me and I would either nod yes or no. To be honest I won't repeatedly work in a group where this is not the way things are run. I don't have a problem with stretching myself and taking chances, but I don't enjoy falling flat on my face and I also don't like being handed only the crap solos that the bandleader doesn't want to play on, especially if he/she never looks my way during charts that I like to solo over. Maybe I am just difficult .

As far as playing the melody. That's a strategy that is recommended as a stepping stone for learning how to solo, but I don't think its a strategy you should use too frequently on a gig. Normally a tune starts of with the head, and then you don't hear the full melody again until all the solos are done. So IMHO when you hear the melody a second time it's sort of a signal that the song is coming to an end. So yeah, it can be cool, but not all the time.

If the song is so fast that all you can do it walk and someone asks to to solo...walk it brother! It will be just fine.

IMHO people have the wrong idea about just how impromptu solos actually are. Good jazz musicians spend endless hours analyzing and reviewing changes, and exploring/practicing ideas. I don't think most musicians are making up much on the spot. They are basically playing a stream of consciousness, but they are drawing on a library of licks they have worked up previously. Even if they are playing over the changes of a tune they have never played before this is true. Perhaps it's a new tune, but it's likely that the chord progression is made up of the same building blocks as some other songs they know inside and out. So IMHO the secret is listen to the greats, and study and practice a bunch of tunes....I should probably take my own advice.

This makes me think of my brother. I've played in every band he has been in, and generally when we would learn new songs, if he didn't know/forgot the solo, he would just play the solo from Paranoid in whatever key the song was in. As for bass soloing, and really just playing in general, I don't like to just wing it. I've never been in a band where I've had to make something up on the spot live, so if I'm playing a solo, it's something I've worked out in rehersal.

 

[jamro217]

Jimmy, you always have good posts here and usually have a great way of conveying your thoughts. You have good ideas and present them clearly. Written. In English. It's more than likely you actually thought out what you'd post before you did so and figured out the wording that best described your sentiment. Use that same set of principles to solo on your instrument. 1.) Know the context (the song in which your solo occurs). 2.) Have something to say (hopefully on topic with the theme of the tune and reinforces it). 3.) Find the best way YOU can say it (not in Jaco's words, but in Jimmy's words). 4.) Relax and speak your piece. I always use this method for soloing and it has never let me down. If you're familiar with B.B. King, you'll remember how he never overdid his playing, just enough to say what he had to and was considered one of the best guitarists ever.

One point to consider is how the brain works. You take in a small amount of information, process it and then take another bite. Just like breathing or eating. When too much information is forced too soon, the brain temporarily puts the excess on hold until it catches up (or vomits, whichever comes first). Singers have to breathe. Vocal lines have appropriate breaks in them for both the singer to breathe and for the listener to process and prepare to receive the next phrase. Some soloists just cram as much as possible into a solo and it turns into a mess. Those notes aren't appreciated by the listener, but appear as noise. Choose your notes carefully and if you are able to sing your solo, you will be able to have a successful, memorable solo, not just a lot of noise.

 

[logdrum]

Larry Grenadier - Haden specially when he was with the Liberation Music Orchestra. These guys can solo without going to the D or E on the G and would be as intense as Eddie Gomez in rapid thumb position. Also Chris Wood if you want approachable harmonically although he can go deep.

Dave Holland is another example -and he played and soloed slab, when he was with Miles Davis. I think because of the short sustain of the DB and considering we are also not that "loud", we have to construct these motifs that sets it apart. Also one trick to do is modulate the key and it definitely will stand out even if you don't to anything fancy. Or you can just pulse everything and get aggressive

I am a horn player. I have melodic motifs ready to go on the bass anytime. But I can also just keep the walking or vamp lines going specially if the drummer just keeps on doing the back beat and won't let me loose.

One last thing master the diminished scale and sprinkle where it will create tension and release.

I can also bow , so there is that. But really -- what I am saying probably makes more sense on the DB side. Damon over there will tell of extended techniques and deconstructing everything but that takes courage and it is an art installation, new music kinda of gigs which probably does not pay well.

 

[SteveCS]

Firstly is do I have anything I want say?
...

This ^

 

[JimmyM]

What would happen if you walked into the melody? I have always been a no-solo player, but this thread might change all that.

Do you mean play the melody as a walking bassline in a swing tune? I think that could work. Depends on the melody, though.

 

[JimmyM]

Just keep bending until you hit a note that works.

Sometimes I do

 

[callofcthulhu]

Oh, another good one that I got from Victor Wooten:

If you play a poopy note in a run, just repeat that run again, including the clam - now it's not a mistake, it's a motif that contains a chromatic passing tone.

 

[JimmyM]

When I was playing in jazz trios, I was expected to solo quite a bit, but it was usually a negotiation (pretty much every tune). When the time came, whoever was calling the shots would look at me and I would either nod yes or no. To be honest I won't repeatedly work in a group where this is not the way things are run. I don't have a problem with stretching myself and taking chances, but I don't enjoy falling flat on my face and I also don't like being handed only the crap solos that the bandleader doesn't want to play on, especially if he/she never looks my way during charts that I like to solo over. Maybe I am just difficult .

It doesn't hold you in good stead on fill-in gigs, I'm sure. When I'm BL and I point to you to solo, I want you to solo dangnab it! It's law. The "Take it" law.

 

[JimmyM]

If I need to do a jazz solo over chord changes I'm not familiar with; I remember that a slow and simple speech can be as effective as (sometimes even more effective than) a fast and complex speech - and I pick the former.

Some helpful tricks in my toolbox are;

• Coltrane patterns - simple yet effective
• Emphasizing chord tones and critical tensions (like that #11 or b13)
• Creating a seamless flow via target notes
• Phrasing
• Canned 2-5-1 ideas (like diminished over dominant)
• (last but not least) remembering that I'm communicating via my instrument and focusing on my story instead of chops

As Herbie said, "Music is not about music, it is about life".

Target notes are an especially good thing...one that I forgot about! All really top notch advice, too. I'll have to look into some Coltrane patterns. I know some jazz but I don't go very deep. Thx Kerem!

 

[juancaminos]

Yeah I am not a good soloist either. I really want to be but I'm not. So there are solos with drum accompaniment, solos with out drums and quick little jabs. I like quick little jabs. Sometimes when playing a walking line a good solo is to just keep the walking line going when everyone stops and all attention is on you (Brown Eyed Girl). Something I have done is just STOP. Walk to the mic and ask what people miss the most, the guitar or bass. It gets the audience going for sure.

 

[JimmyM]

Oh, another good one that I got from Victor Wooten:

If you play a poopy note in a run, just repeat that run again, including the clam - now it's not a mistake, it's a motif that contains a chromatic passing tone.

Ha! I'm not above it. Neither is our guitarist. I noticed he did it last night.

Thanks for the participation, everyone! The new tips are high quality...mostly I think people will learn from them and better themselves, develop more confidence with soloing, and then maybe they won't make their bandmates look like dunces by violating the "Take It" law of music.

And there's good reason for it, too...on NYE I told the jazz band I was filling in with not to worry about calling me for a solo on every single instrumental. The sax player says, "If you don't solo, we'll have to come up with 10 or 15 minutes worth of other songs." I totally felt him.

 

[farace]

I dont feel particularly proficient and don't care much for soloing, but every once in awhile I'll hear "and now the bass!" and I'm on the spot. Most of the time I'm improvising in our group anyway, so I just keep on doing what I'm doing, and it seems that sometimes just making the bass line more exposed by having the guitar and keys drop out is enough. I may play it more emphatically, and I might modify the phrasing to be a bit more like vocal phrasing, but it's not far from what I was doing behind the chordal instruments anyway. It seems to result in the desired effect from our audience and my band mates, though.

My partner--our vocalist and the one who puts me on the spot--is laughing at me from across the room as I read this to her. "It's so true," she says.

 

[juggahnaught]

There's some good information here.

I'm not a great soloist either. I can do it if it's something slow and melodic, but I don't have those ultra-fast bass chops like Jaco or Patitucci. Wish I did. I'll continue working on it (along with my chops vocabulary), but right now it's pretty janky and it's more than likely I'll make a mistake and it'll be really obvious...so it's relegated for practice only.

When I have played slower tunes (and when I kind of have a chance to think about a solo), things that have helped me are this:

1. Playing something that I could sing, that's hummable. When I'm able to do this, I find that the solo is generally a lot more melodic and coherent.
2. Repeating melodic phrases, when possible. When I can, I like to treat my solos as melody lines in themselves, and repeating a phrase can really help to give the solo a theme (especially if there's a chord change incoming). It doesn't have to be THE melody, but it can be A melody. So I might start a solo with a phrase, then repeat that phrase with a slight twist...then solo a bit, and if I can remember to end the solo with a similar motif (which I usually don't) it's a nice story told.
3. Like you - if it's possible, especially outside of a jazz context, yeah, play the melody. I did this with my Afrobeat band in a song we do called Mama Africa, and it's actually quite nice.

I've never really tried the walking bassline solo, but there was a video by Scott Devine where he talked about building walking lines, and he mentioned that walking over the extensions can make a regular walking line sound more like a solo - so instead of using roots, thirds, fifths, and sevenths, you could walk over sixths, sevenths, ninths, elevenths, thirteenths, etc.

I think in your case - if you're playing jazz - one big secret to soloing would be similar to the one big secret in public speaking; don't be afraid of silence. But I don't have the experience to back up that opinion.

Good luck, man! It'll get smoother and smoother with practice and repetition.

 

[Kerem Koseoglu]

Target notes are an especially good thing...one that I forgot about! All really top notch advice, too. I'll have to look into some Coltrane patterns. I know some jazz but I don't go very deep. Thx Kerem!

Coltrane patterns are mostly built on pentatonics.

• Major chord: Use the major 1-2-3-5 notes
• Minor chord: Use the minor 1-3-4-5 notes

This is an oversimplification, obviously - but a good starting point. Good luck!

 

[Honkey tonk]

confidence